Normal for a night nanny to be heavily asleep (not hear baby being sick etc)?

I work as a night nanny and tend to sleep when baby does but a very light sleep more of a doze, I do ask for a bed in room with bed so I can do this but as soon as baby stirs I am awake just in case I need to be doing anything.

Currently night nannying for a 10wk old doing 2 nights a week started 6wks ago and slowly we are getting her to go longer at night, parents dont want to follow a strict routine and are demand feeding and I go with whatever parents want.

I would never ever be asleep when due to finish, I tend to get up 15-20mins before baby is due first feed - if demand feeding or not yet in a routine of any kind you can roughly work this out from last feed time.

My current baby wakes at around 5.45-6am for her first feed and I get up around 5.45 usually awake by myself or she stirs and I get up, if she is not fully awake ie crying I go and make myself a cup of tea which takes couple mins and take back upstairs if baby still not fully awake i pop in bathroom and have quick wash get myself dressed etc etc

At 7am I finish, as long as baby has finished feed (wouldnt leave mid feed unless i had to rush off) I take to mum (or place in cot depending on job), current job i take baby downstairs to mum at about 6.50am who gets up with 4yr old at 6.30am, give a brief handover of how night was and then i wash bottles ready for sterilser.

Also 100mls is way way too much for a newborn baby especially if not used to formula I would be guestimating without knowing your little ones weight a feed of around 40-60mls max at the moment!

Sorry to waffle on but night nannies (good ones) have their place and some people think its an easy job that anyone can just do in that you just feed baby and then go to sleep - its certainly much more than that.

Far too much formula!!! And as for sleeping through being sick?! It's normal for night nannies to sleep but I never slept that well on duty anyway. Definitely not normal to sleep heavily!

Get rid of this night nanny. Definitely. But don't give up on the idea of help.

If you desperately need lots of help get a maternity nanny who will do 24/6 (and hopefully help out with your older one a little) who's experienced working with just post-natal mothers BUT they won't take care of the house etc so IMO your money is better spent elsewhere. It's an option if you feel you need very intensive support because baby is taking up a lot of time.

If you can get by with less then I would get a doula for a few hours a day and a good cleaner to do the heavy stuff.

IMO now isn't a great time to introduce a new carer for your 16month old. I would have someone who can watch and cuddle the baby so you spend some time with your older one. If you have to give a bottle of formula do it during the day, maybe have your 'help' do it and BF at night. After a while your older one may feel more comfortable going to the person you've got coming in, especially if they're prepared to do lots of fun active stuff. Your toddler won't pick nanny over you, you're his mummy and you're who he wants right now. I still remember my mother reading me endless stories when she BF my siblings but I was a bit older and more minded to listen to stories. What does your toddler really like doing? Can you have 'special' toys to keep him occupied while you BF? I agree about dealing with toddler first - babies are tougher than we give them credit for!

If you decide to go the Mother's Help route bear in mind:
MHs are often fairly inexperienced people wanting to get into nannying. They can be a lot of work and you will need to employ them (contract) and pay NI/tax if you pay over the threshold per week. You will probably get a lot of fairly rubbish applications from people who profess to love children but don't know one end of a baby from the other.
You may be very lucky and get a Granny type person who knows about running a household and having babies. Alternatively a temp who is already legitimately self-employed to avoid the hassle of employment but then you don't necessarily have guaranteed care as they can choose when/whether they work.

If you want to stick with a night nanny then get one experienced with BF mothers who's prepared to bring the baby in to you and settle them after you're done feeding.

Hope you feel more together soon and do keep posting, if not here then other places on MN because there's lots of help and advice on all sorts of things.

The night nanny sounds horrendous. I currently have a night nanny 2 nights a week for my 3 week old, started last night so BF is fairly well established. She stays downstairs with him in his moses basket, reads, watches TV and sleeps when she gets home in the morning. I feed him till midnight and she wakes me up again at 6am to feed giving him some EBM in the night.

I was on my knees and have 2 other children and this is the only way I can function so I do sympathise and I do get 5 other nights to be up with the baby.

I would certainly second the other ideas of getting some help at home. If you could get someone to come in, give the house a tidy and spend some time with your big one or take the baby for a walk whilst you do something with her then I think that you'd find things much easier.

You have come out of hospital very quickly after major surgery and you need help more in the day than at night ime.

I hope you haven't been scared off, newmummy. FWIW here is my advice:

1. Can you bring the new baby into bed with you? I would not worry about forming bad habits at this stage. It is all about getting through these first weeks and whatever works, works. Feeding lying down in the night is fantastic for your supply and hopefully you will get more sleep too (as you can sort of drop off while feeding)

1. I agree with during the day can someone take the new baby out for an hour or so, to give you some one on one time with your toddler. Can you involve your toddler in anything, e.g. bringing you a nappy for the baby or a muslin to burp him etc. And I also agree with always see to the toddler first if both are crying - the baby knows no different, the toddler is still young enough not to understand why he should wait.

1. I know this sounds a bit hippyish especially with bedsharing as well, but if you can get a decent sling, a wrap sling or a ring sling is good, then you can cuddle/feed the baby while doing something else with your toddler and the toddler should not feel so jealous of this because you are not actively paying the baby attention.

1. Relax! It really doesn't matter if you end up taking your toddler out in his pyjamas, or the house is a tip, or you are eating rubbish food. As I said above, anything that gets you through these first weeks is worth it.

I agree with the post-natal doula suggestion. She won't "take care" of the baby per se, but she will take care of you, DH, toddler and the house, etc. Her job is to help you so you can look after the baby and recover.

If you have daytime help, then you know no matter how hideous the night before may be that you can handle the next day. That will be a great relief. And you need daytime help to recover from your CS. DS won't understand why you can't pick him up, but if doula/helper gives him to you, sets him on sofa with you then he should be happy. You will be able to give DS more quality time and attention if someone else can feed him and distract him a bit when you are busy with baby.

thank you very much starexpat, and i am not going to take the credit for your breastfeeding, but thank you for the compliment I must change my name back !

agree with Lulumaam. I took similar advice from her when ds was tiny, when she was lulumama and I was a different name as well, because dr kept telling us to give him formula for low blood sugar. It did nothing but interfere, especially in early days. I ended up bf for 13 months thanks to her fabulous posts, so I'd listen to her

Oh dear, wish I could come round and help it sounds like its all getting a bit much and I remember the 'overwhelmed' feeling. FGS you had a baby 3 days ago, you are entitled to be feeling knackered and confused.

I had a 22 mo when ds was born and she did have a bit of trouble adjusting. But it passes so quickly and then they cant even remember when the baby wasnt there.

Fire the night nanny.

If you really you feel you want/need one i would get another one, it is going to be no use to you if you are still lying awake worrying about the baby.

I would second/third/tenth the spending money on cleaning etc. Buy a whole load of frozen meals from cook (I think their kids fish pie is great, ypour 16 mo will like kids meals and they arent junky)

If you can get a lively nanny/mothers help to come and do fun stuff the 16 mo will enjoy that, painting/junk modelling etc.

And dont worry at all if you have to stick cbeebies on!

Fire this nanny she sounds bonkers with the formula and sleeping through sickness please complain.

I think you need to employ a Mother's help/ doula instead.

did the nanny bring the baby to you for breastfeeds in the night?

i think you'ev had some brilliant advice

i would echo the suggestion of a post natal doula.. they will help with your toddler, help you with breastfeeding suport, do some light household chores and cooking... basically, give you the freedom to rest, establish brestfeeding and have a little energy to do something with your toddler

if you give formula at night esepcially at this early stage, you are running the risk of scuppering breastfeeding, you have more prolactin at night and this will help establish your supply/demand cycle

sounds terribly unproffesional, i would be pursuing a refund and complaining if you got her via an agency

to look for post natal doula -
www.doula.org.uk

and

www.nurturingbirth.co.uk

there are a number of doulas on MN, who have been used by other MNers, if you are looking for a recommendation

Where are you located? Maybe someone on here could help or I might know someone who could do Mother's help, too - depending on where you are?

Did you hire the nanny through nightnannies, I had a couple of shockers from them and I had to fire both and had my agency fee refunded. One complained because my baby had given her a rough night! Er, hello ...

Imo, night nannying is a dodgy area, most nannies are doing it to make a quick buck and are pretty useless. Agree, get a doula or mother's help asap, so you can sleep in the day. Good luck, OP, it's hard but you will get through this

I have been in a similar sitaution to the OP. I had a 12 month old who didn't sleep through the night and a preemie newborn who screamed the whole time. It was hideous. Every sympathy to you OP.

Can I suggest:

1. Get rid of the night nanny

1. Get a mothers help to come in every day from 8 - 1. She can keep on top of the cleaning, washing and ironing. A tidy house really helps when you are struggling to keep on top of things and will make a big difference to you mentally ime. Get someone who likes children and who can play with the 16 month old whilst you feed/change the baby.

1. Speak to your local college about child care courses and find out if any of their students would be available to help you out at teatime/bath time /bedtime (say from 5 - 7). This is a really hard time of the day with 2 very small children and is less daunting with a bit of help.

1. Keep in touch with friends and try to get out if you can every day or at least have friends over.

1. Go easy on yourself. Take it a day at a time. It does get easier. My dc are 5 and 4 and a total and utter delight. The close age gap now makes things so much easier and they are best friends.

Good luck.

Rudy - in real life, do you say whatever you want to people, even if you know it will hurt or offend them? I doubt it, somehow.

Having had PND myself three times, I think that the OP is doing the right thing by getting some help at this point - especially having had a caesarian.

I wouldn't be happy with a night nanny who didn't hear the baby being sick or crying - I have cared for a friend's baby overnight on a few occasions (I lodged with her, the baby was bottle fed but woke very very early, and I said I'd do the odd night to give her and her husband a break). On the nights when I wasn't looking after the baby, I never heard him, but on the nights when I was looking after him, I always woke for him - subconsciously I knew I had a responsibility.

I would suggest having the help during the day - someone who can do some of the housework and heavy stuff, and who could look after the baby from time to time, to give you time to spend with your ds. And perhaps the baby could give him a present - we did that with each of ours, and it did help them accept the new arrival.

Take care of yourself, newmummy, and I wish you many happy times with your little ones.

OK I am going to ignore all the nasty goings on

But as a childcarer who first started as a nanny 15+ years ago, I can tell you that a night nanny can work.

I would never 'sleep' I would ask for a comfy chair (nursing chair was fine and most people seemed to have them) more often than not I would just read / shut my eyes and rest.

As for a breastfed baby, I would take the baby to the mum in bed, or to the bedroom door for a hand over, and wait to be called to collect the baby.

If you need help, and have the funds then why not make it easier for yourself.

Ok, I stand corrected. I said people weren't being judgy. They weren't... until Rudy came along with her enormous sense of entitlement. Yes, you are entitled to your opinions. You can say what you want. It's just about social skills in this case and knowing the appropriate time and place to express those opinions.

Ignore her, OP. I still think a daytime help would help you out more - especially if you wake when the baby does anyway or want to bf through the night. You need some help and rest during the long day with a toddler and a newborn. Someone to do some cleaning, play with toddler, hold the baby...etc.

When i had my baby i loved the first few weeks, it didn't matter that she woke up at 4 in the morning because she would settle again and we could carry on sleeping until we felt like getting up. But i am a single parent so had no one else to look after or cook for and it was my first baby so we could suit ourselves completely.

If i was in your position OP i would def get help in the day for your toddler so you can recover from your CS. A mother's help or temp nanny could also take baby out for a walk as well and help with a bit of housework. This will leave you able to recover and rest which will help your milk supply so it's a win win.

Keep us updated if you can and best of luck!

I have a 15 month age gap between mine. I too had a problem with the older child rejecting me when the younger was born. It passed in time and the only thing to do was to keep offering the older child unconditional love and attention until they were prepared to accept it.

Whilst feeding the baby, I used to tell stories. Ds got to pick what he wanted to be in the story and then I made one up - he was usually in them too. We had (and still have) long running series with some characters in and I still tell ds the stories when he is upset about something. I think it helped to make us closer again.

I'd definately get rid of the night nanny - I'd expect a night nanny to be awake rather than asleep or dozing. Being paid to sleep is taking the piss! Definately see about getting some hlp during the day - either to amuse your 16mth old, or allow you to sleep, or to mind the baby whilst you spend some quality time with your toddler. Congratulations on your new baby - hard woek at the minute but this stage WILL pass!

Rudy - why don't you try to offer some constructive advice, instead of sitting in judgement on a Mum who has just had a newborn, and a c-sec, and has a toddler and PND to cope with?

How nasty.

newmummy - please don't take any notice of posts like this.

I think a woman who has had a c-section, a toddler and can afford some help should bloody well take it

it just has to be the right sort of help and this nanny sounds awful

if i could have afforded it, i would have hired a night nanny

Then read all her posts in this thread rudy and not just the op.

OP, I have a three month old and a 19 month old. It does get easier I promise. Good luck.

Blondeshavemorefun - its not like I don't have a baby...know the drill...