Childminder holiday entitlement - 5 weeks full pay?!

Surely her 28 days per year is prorated for non full time children so she would be owed 28/5x3????? You need to check through your contract carefully what does it say with regard to paid holidays.

Well my CM won't accept holiday pay. But the same token, we still pay if we are on holiday, so it probably works out OK in the end because we are away for about 6 weeks a year. No sick pay either - though of course I still pay if ds ill and staying at home.

I think I pay about £4 an hour.

mummy369 - you should only owe her 3/5ths of the holiday pay and if you have been with her for less than a year than that should be pro-rata. Not sure if that helps!

Lizzy, are you from Wandsworth ???

I think its a case of you pay for what you want, and if youre not happy then look elsewhere.
My CM gets 4 weeks paid hols plus BH, but no sick pay (although in 4 years think she has been sick once).
FWIW she normally offers to have ds even in her holiday time if im stuck and as shes going away for her hols in august her daughter and her mother have offered to help with ds
She works long hours for me, and sometimes days shes not contracted to work so I grin and bear the 4 weeks full pay because we help each other out IYKWIM

dd's cm charges a 50% retainer when not being used and doesnt ask for holiday pay or sick pay at all!her daily rate is £25 and she is superb[an ex Norland nanny].

Some childminders actually make their own contracts and don't use NCMA or Morton Michael, so they can basically say what they like as it's their business.
I prefer to use NCMA myself

Hi i am a childminder and just reading these threads im a little confused as to some people saying childminders are entitle to sick pay if you read the small print on the ncma contracts as far as im aware you cant charge when the childminder is ill because you are closed and can not provide childcare for your mindee's.

Also some people say were not entitle to holiday pay what a load of rubbish it states this on the back of the contract ,plus its then up to the childminder if they charge full/half/or no fee at all for holidays everyone is different.

Please tell me different if i have got it wrong!

Every childminder is different. If your childminder offers holiday care, then they are entitled to have at least 4 weeks off and bank holidays if they want.
If you don't want to pay for your childminder's holidays then you need to find a childminder that only does term-time care and does not charge a retainer.
But of course you won't have cover for holidays.
Swings and roundabouts comes to mind

Your contract should answer the question - see what it says

Hi, My childminder told me she can't look after my daughter from september. I decided to end the contract earlier because she is away for 2 weeks in the Summer, and anyway my husband is home to look after the children. I gave her 6 weeks notice as per the contract, and now she says I have to pay her holiday pay because she is 'owed' it. She says she is entitled to 28 days holiday - my daughter only attends 3 days per week so in effect that would be 9 weeks paid holiday per year. I told the childminder surely she means 4 weeks? But she disagrees. Now, because the CM has only had 7 days so far, she says I have to pay her 21 days. My sums indicate that if I paid her this sum it would be the equivalent of 7 weeks pay and there's only 9 weeks left to the end of the contractual year! With only a week to go until the end of the notice period, I'm really worried about how to broach this with her. She is a very business-like person and can be very unreasonable at times. She sends text messages whilst I'm at work, repeating them 2-3 times until I reply; Also, she charges FULL PAY for all time off - both hers and ours, incl. sick leave and bank holidays. So I have actually paid in full for every week of the contract, and what she is asking for sounds like I have to pay her twice? Has anybody had a similar experience and have any advice for me, please?

OOOO I think I would like 5 wks paid holidays and 10 sick days a year and bank hols too sounds fab

Never come accross a CM with that many perks before, I would strongly suggest you have a ring around and see what the going rates are, as a very wise MN said it is going to cost you a pretty penny if you need to double up on care not to mention your own time of work.

Tanith sounds like you get disguised poorly mindees as well might think on the sick pay thing myself, although I might be tempted to chuck a sicky if I was getting paid anyway only kidding.

I think the sickpay is a good idea. The thing with being ordinarily self-employed is that your clients don't normally make you ill. Every illness I've had whilst minding has been brought in by the mindees themselves. It's tough enough trying look after all the kids without feeling like death, too.
I wonder if the sickpay is designed to make parents think twice before dosing up sick children and sending them in to spread their germs around. I'd be interested to know if it works!

She's told you what she would like, and you can tell her what you would like, I am always open to negotiation with parents - to a point. Is she too?

If she is immovable, then look elsewhere, that is a lot to ask for imo, and I am a CM in nappy valley area too.

It sounds like if she is new to this that she has just taken advice on what should be in the contract. I think that if she is keen to have you ( and i would imagine that once she has one charge she will find it easier to get others) that you should let her know what you would find acceptable.

agree 10 days sick seems way over the top, wouldnt be so bad if you knew her track record and it seemed unlikely to occur for 10 days each year. Equally 5 weeks paid hols seems ott. We used to agree hols each january with our cm- we always took the same 2 weeks in the summer and often the same week over Easter and I used to pay half for the others.

i think that you do need to go and see some others, if nothing else so that you have a realistic idea of what she is offering vs others.

Out of curiosity , what is her notice period? Is there a probationary period where you could pull out on short notice (or she could) if things to get off to a good start?

If you are feeling "tricky" about this conversation, how are you going to feel when there are other issues to discuss... Say for example, you don't like her approach to potty training? Maybe using a friend of a friend as a childminder has more complications than benefits?

That seems a lot to me (particularly the 10 days sick) and it could be very difficult for you and your DP to cover. I pay my CM for holidays as per the NMCA standard now, but only for 3 weeks so DH and I have plenty of holiday left to cover days when the CM's children are ill (1 so far) or DD is ill (5 so far).

If she took all the holiday and all the sick days plus there are a few days when your DC is too ill to go can you and your DP actually work?

Will she take on the responsibility for finding alternative childcare if she can't deal for a day?

My goodness I must be doing something wrong !!! I don't charge for outings, I take children on a weekly basis, swimming, library, toddler groups, parks, farms etc, don't charge for bank holidays, don't charge for my illness, and don't charge for my holidays, which is 4 weeks in a year. I'm not rubbish (got an outstanding in '07) do all my appropriate paperwork and only for £3.50 per hour (and some still question that).

Mind you thats why I probably don't earn much by the end of the year

As others have said, CMs can do things how they like in terms of holidays etc. I've been interviewing CMs lately and this is the most paid holiday I've heard of and none of the ones I've interviewed have asked for sick pay.

More importantly though, is she the right person to look after your child?

I would def ring round to at leat find out what others charge, that isnt normal round here at all, I dont charge anything for hols or sick. If you can afford to throw away several hundred pounds then not a prob but remember you may have to pay alternative child care when she is not working.

I'd not be happy with those terms and would look elsewhere, particularaly as she is just starting up so doesnt have the experience.

Dont forget, unless you take your hols at the same time as hers for the five weeks you'll have to pay for alternative care. This applies when she's sick too if you cant get the time off. Do you have enough annual leave to cover all the time off?

S/E has its perks, paid holidays and sick pay is not normally one of them.

she is just starting up and is asking for sick pay and holidays

i could understand if it was a cm that had been around for years and turning children down, but a newbie shouldnt dictate those terms

if you really like her then tell her, but say that others you have been to see and like dont ask for sick pay and holidays and see what she says

maybe the new cm doesnt reliese that she will be se and isnt entitled to those perks (but if you dont ask, you dont get)

Hmm ... I'd say then that you'd be keen to use her but that you've spoken to a number of other CMs and their terms all appear to be XXX. Have a ring round and see what the standard seems to be where you are

FWIW my CM charges 4 weeks holiday and no sick pay which is pretty standard in North London I believe.

There is something in the working time regulations about continuous provision and se and holidays/sick pay entitlement but I can't buggering find it now

Anyhow it matters not as the choice of what to charge is upto the CM and the onus is entirely the parents, you either agree or you don't.