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Paid childcare

Discuss everything related to paid childcare here, including childminders, nannies, nurseries and au pairs.

Original poster

Help me decide what sort of childcare to go for in September .... longish post

86 replies

VirginBoffinMum · 13/12/2008 10:42

I'm having dc4 in April, and by then my other kids will be dd 21 (i.e. not needing childcare any more and away at uni), ds 11 and ds 8. I work full time about 1 hour 20 minutes away from where I live. I try to work from home every Friday, so I am out the house from 8-6.30 or so from Monday to Thursday. I've also got a minor disability that affects my mobility at the moment so I get quite tired, plus obviously I'll have a five month old probably waking me up in the night as well. DH works even longer hours than me, and part-time working won't be an option for either of us for a while.

Currently I have an au pair to do the school run and various bits and pieces to help me. However I am trying to decide what to do about childcare come September when I go back to work after maternity leave, and if anyone has advice or help I would be very interested to hear it.

There is a really good nursery at work but it costs £180 a week (probably less a bit more because you can do salary sacrifice), plus I wonder if the drive would be too much for the baby. It would be nice to have the baby near me though. I would probably still need an au pair on top of this for the older boys (£80 a week plus board and associated au pair management hassle).

Another option would be a nanny for all three, but I reckon this would probably cost me about £350 a week gross. Realistically this is a little bit beyond our means, but may keep me more sane. However I am a bit worried because I have heard a nanny wouldn't give domestic help and we would need someone to be doing washing and ironing and a few errands as well (I have a cleaner once a week for the main cleaning jobs). I am also a bit worried about whether a nanny would be hard to manage and fussy. I have been wondering about trying to get a Norland trainee to avoid this, but I am not sure if this means they will be any better. That would be £158 gross a week plus an one-off agency fee of £2000.

We don't have any childminders in our area and the local after school club closes at 6 and isn't brilliant, plus they usually ration it so you only end up with 2 or 3 days a week, but only find out which days at the last minute, i.e. days before term starts, which is why we stopped trying to use it.

As I say, any thoughts or advice on all this would be very helpful indeed.

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Blondeshavemorefun · 13/12/2008 22:35

thing is you cant compare an AP with an exp sole charge, qual nanny

they are completly different,a nanny should just on with things, ap's need guidence

sure you will find a fab nanny

Original poster
VirginBoffinMum · 13/12/2008 22:29

Bit of a rant from me now then too! It would change my life if I had a fab nanny. All the childcare disasters I have with the APs over the years and one four month stint with a temperamental and moody nanny housekeeper have knocked my confidence terribly.

We get no help from our extended families and really need the backup, and it's so disappointing when you do without things to pay for decent childcare only to find people taking advantage. I am trying to be optimistic this time.

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Blondeshavemorefun · 13/12/2008 22:15

there are always going to be bad nannies about

but also fab (modest) ones like me

guess you go on refernces, and how you feel/gel with them

i think nannies should have quals, but also know of some qualified nannies who are crap

just bugs me that tech ANYONE can call theirselves a nanny

where i went to college for 2 years and trained/studied hard

Original poster
VirginBoffinMum · 13/12/2008 22:11

It was Nice Nannies Now, actually.

I have come across an awful lot of unprofessional nannies, this is what made me nervous actually. I could never work out how other people got proper ones, and assumed they must be loaded and paying megabucks.

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Blondeshavemorefun · 13/12/2008 21:59

virgin - you have had some bad UNPROFESSIONAL nannies if they didnt show for an interview

agree most nannies use agencies as to stop us getting mucked about but also garee there are some crap ones about

Original poster
VirginBoffinMum · 13/12/2008 21:52

You sounds like my kind of gal, Tankie.

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tankie · 13/12/2008 20:54

I've never been offered gym membership or a car (not that I want either). I was given a bicycle once though!

Original poster
VirginBoffinMum · 13/12/2008 20:35

Interesting stuff, Tankie.

I did wonder about agencies inflating salaries, because I had a go at finding a nanny this way once a long time ago, when ds1 was small, and they were asking more for a recently qualified 18-year-old than a qualified teacher would earn at the time, plus saying things like "other families throw in a car and gym membership" which I thought was patently daft for someone in their teens. The car would probably end up wrapped around a lamp post for a start. I didn't even have a car myself at the time, anyway.

Plus they did send unsuitable people - one girl we interviewed when asked 'What would you feed a one-year-old for lunch?' had absolutely no clue, and another one, when asked how she would entertain the kids, seemed to think taking them to a different theme park every day of the holidays with her nephews and nieces at our expense was the answer. Other agencies asked us for registration fees and then candidates would simply not turn up for interview.

This all thoroughly put me off nannies and agencies for a while, so I sent the boys to nursery, but I was working very close nearby, so this was OK for a bit. However I think from what you are all saying that the voice of reason has now kicked in, and there are a lot of nice nannies out there who are worth speaking to, if you know where to find them. I'm a lot closer to this hallowed state now after all your advice, and as a result my confidence is starting to creep back.

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ThingOne · 13/12/2008 19:56

The main reason so many nannies use agencies as you have to be attached to an organisation to get a CRB check.

tankie · 13/12/2008 19:42

Also, a lot of the jobs coming through agencies I've also seen advertised by the parent on gumtree, netmums etc - I could answer the ad directly, or go through the agency and cost the employers a big fee! I don't think agencies do anything you can't do yourself.

tankie · 13/12/2008 19:40

VirginBoffinMum - most of them haven't checked my references very thoroughly tbh, and they just seem to put me forward for jobs a bit at random. I've been sent details of live-in jobs, jobs with only school age children, nanny-housekeeper roles that I've told them many times I'm just not interested in. They don't seem to put much effort into matching nanny and family in my experience. I actually went to an interview once before I realised the family needed a driver (I don't drive). They also inflate wages, which while obviously I'm glad that they're trying to get me a good wage, I don't want to outprice myself.

All in all, agencies seem like an extra layer of hassle - I much prefer dealing directly with the family myself.

Blondeshavemorefun · 13/12/2008 19:26

i think it is worth placing your own ads, and use agencies

HarrietTheSpy · 13/12/2008 19:07

I'm going to give it a go and see what shakes out. We have been planning what you were thinking of - a nursery, au pair, plus school for DD1 - and I got increasingly worried about our choice after we trialled an ap in October. I think this sort of combo would finish me off in terms of trying to manage it all and not at all sure we'd save any money. Would lose my nursery deposit but so what.

Original poster
VirginBoffinMum · 13/12/2008 18:54

Tankie, why do you think they're rubbish?

Harriet, that sounds a lot to me from what people have been saying on this thread - I think the credit crunch may be in both our favours.

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HarrietTheSpy · 13/12/2008 18:39

Does anyone think I could recruit a live in nanny for this much in the current market? I live in zone four in London, East side. I've been working on the premise that the starting point for me would be around £22K+, which is out of our price range at the moment.

tankie · 13/12/2008 18:29

I would definitely try to advertise yourself rather than use an agency - I'm with a couple of agencies and they're all a bit rubbish tbh (even the very posh, very expensive one!).

I like adverts that a clear about the hours, duties and wages and steer away from any that say things like "our 5 month old is very intellectually advanced"

Original poster
VirginBoffinMum · 13/12/2008 18:26

Hello again all.

It's looking like a nanny will be the best option then, from what everyone has said. I am very glad I posted, because previously I was going to go down the nursery route but I now think that is a bit impractical, and it was very helpful to hear about the experience of other mums with long car trips, etc.

I have been checking out sites like Nannyjob to see how other jobs look, and I also checked out the Norland website (I actually got the price wrong - it's a minimum of £210 pw net in the first year (going up to £300 in the second year) plus £1500 agency fee). I think it seems as though I ought to advertise on NannyJob, Gumtree, in The Lady and also via Norland to cover all the bases - does this sound sensible, or is it overkill?

Plus does anyone have any tips as to how to look like a nice family to work for??

Big thanks for all your help, by the way .

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Blondeshavemorefun · 13/12/2008 17:37

true - many hands make light work

AND YOU BOTH CAN HAVE WInE AT 7.30 [FGRIN]

Original poster
VirginBoffinMum · 13/12/2008 17:23

Tankie, I would say bring them all but my DH is allergic to cats!

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Original poster
VirginBoffinMum · 13/12/2008 17:21

Ah, good tip, Blondes. Fridays would usually be free unless I had a meeting or something.

I myself am usually prostrate with tiredness after coming home from work, so really would welcome an extra pair of hands at that time. DH only gets home sometime between 815 and 915, you see.

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tankie · 13/12/2008 17:20

I'd do it! If I didn't have a DP and cats tying me down that is

It's quite a long day, but made up for if Fridays are mostly free.

Blondeshavemorefun · 13/12/2008 17:15

sounds good ad

maybe mention that weekends are free, esp as live in - would the rest of friday be free after helping with school run, ie after 9.30?

i know that the last hr is the worst with homework, tea, bath and bed - might be nice for the nanny to finish before 7.30 if you are there

Blondeshavemorefun · 13/12/2008 17:15

sounds good ad

maybe mention that weekends are free, esp as live in - would the rest of friday be free after helping with school run, ie after 9.30?

i know that the last hr is the worst with homework, tea, bath and bed - might be nice for the nanny to finish before 7.30 if you are there

Original poster
VirginBoffinMum · 13/12/2008 17:06

Super advice this!

How does this sound for a nanny job then?

Live-in job, attractive large village 20 minutes by bike/car from very nice city centre with all amenities and nightlife. Also near mainline train station and main bus routes. 6 weeks paid holiday a year, massive double bedroom with sitting area, TV etc, and share children's bathroom, overnight guests allowed. £15,000 gross p.a. One evening's babysitting a week, very occasionally two. Nanny must be Ofsted registered.

Monday to Thursday:

7.30 Help get kids up, dressed, ready for school.
7.45 Wave ds1 off to secondary school with all necessary equipment (he will be getting himself there).
8.30 Take ds2 to school on foot (1 mile away) with baby in pram.
9.15 Back at home. Look after baby. Do children's bedrooms, playroom, children's washing and ironing as required, while baby is having naps. Bond with other nannies, go to Tumbletots, park, swimming, etc.
3.00 Go back to school to collect ds2.
4.00 Give ds2 milk and biscuits, help him with homework and music practice for about 10 minutes or so.
4.45 ds1 comes back home from secondary school by himself. Give him milk and biscuits, make sure he spends 1 hour doing his homework.
6.00 Cook dinner, something simple like pasta or quiche (kids have hot dinners at school but are still hungry)
6.30 Family dinner all together. Clear up afterwards, help mum start to get everyone ready for bed if she is very tired. Get everything ready for next day and lined up by front door, eg PE kits, uniform and so on.
7.30 Clock off

Friday:
Help mum with morning school run if she is over tired.

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WhileShosheWatchedHerFlocks · 13/12/2008 16:51

I had a mindee, who's mum was doing the same sort of drive everyday, it worked while he was very young, but as he got to be a toddler, he was falling asleep in the car going home, and then didn't want to go to bed till midnight, then didn't want o get up in the morning, sleeping in the car again, and then not sleeping till the journey home, if this works for you OK, but the Mum found it very hard, she only managed for 6 months, before having to get a CM nearer home, and pay for the extra hours.

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