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Paid childcare

Discuss everything related to paid childcare here, including childminders, nannies, nurseries and au pairs.

Original poster

terrible payment muddle, please advise!

38 replies

whatamuddle · 21/10/2008 10:53

have changed my name, just in case.

Lovely CM, all going really well, though she's had some time off and because we've not adjusted payments, she 'owes' me several days work which she's now working off gradually by doing a few extra hours each week: all fine, happy with that.

My work gives me a contribution towards childcare costs, and because of me being inefficient etc. they have paid 9 months in a block, which comes to about £800. I have just discovered, after ENDLESS pestering, that they sent cheques for a total of £800 straight to CM, without telling me (though I asked them to), without a proper covering note giving my/child's name back in AUGUST. CM has said NOTHING to me about this.

I'm seeing her for the first time this afternoon since this all came to light, and I really don't know what to do. She effectively now owes me 2 months pay, and I don't know how to manage this. I'm very upset about it all, because I feel my work has put me in an impossible position, and that a good relationship will be threatened by this mess.

CMs (or other mums!), what would you want a parent to do in these circumstances? How can we resolve this situation? I can't write this money off, it's only partly grant, and I pay tax on it, AND to add insult to injury they've over-paid me and I have to give some back...

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Original poster
whatamuddle · 25/10/2008 18:52

yes, got the cheque, paid it in on Thursday (over the counter so I knew it'd be dealt with quickly) and haven't heard anything since - must check it's cleared ok (though the bank is normally v quick to say when there's a problem).

Really, she's a great childminder, and SO lovely with DC. Scatty, very scatty, but then she has a huge and complicated family, and I'd be just the same in those circumstances. Still find the fact she forgot to tell me about the money a bit odd, but I'm not going to go dwelling on that when she and her family are so lovely with DC. I think we're really lucky to have her, and I'm just glad all this is sorted out.

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TheOtherMaryPumpkins · 22/10/2008 19:59

Did you get your check whatamuddle? did it make a boinging sound when you took it? sorry!

JenniPenni · 21/10/2008 21:37

The only way to deal with this is OPEN COMMUNICATION. You have just discovered this, so need to chat with her asap.

I am a cm and know where all my monies come from, it's my business to know... and would certainly not spend £800 that came out of thin air, unless it was lottery money

Good luck! Let us know what she says/does!

TheOtherMaryPumpkins · 21/10/2008 20:43

fair enough she is scatty and you "didn't remind her" but surely the fact you were still paying would have jolted her memory??

Hope the cheque clears ok, I'd have asked for an internet bank transfer I think untrusting soul I am!

countPINKCHICKula · 21/10/2008 20:27

glad you got it sorted chick, she sounds nice but like you say scatty and possibly releived you 'found out'!

Original poster
whatamuddle · 21/10/2008 20:18

Well! All seems to be sorted out, and she'll give me a cheque for the whole amount tomorrow. Money arrived when we were on holiday, then her DH paid the money in without telling her, she got distracted by terrible family troubles, I didn't remind her (didn't know), time passed... So I'm happy, and I hope she is too.
Thank you everyone for advice, and I'm really grateful for the support in saying that whatever had gone wrong, it wasn't my fault. I'm just relieved to have this sorted!

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TheOtherMaryPumpkins · 21/10/2008 18:00

I agree with Sammy, either pays you back asap or you don't pay her.

What works best for you?

SammyK · 21/10/2008 15:52

I would not offer half payments, I would offer two options, either she pays you the £800 back and you continue paying her however you normally do or, you cease payments until £800 has passed.

Original poster
whatamuddle · 21/10/2008 15:27

lots of responses suddenly: thank you.

I'm going to talk to her later, when I get DS, so hopefully all will be sorted out. I just want to make it clear that whilst I'm confused about how/why she cashed the cheque without working out exactly who it came from, I've got NO reason to think that she wanted to cheat me out of the money, and I'm sure we'll find a way round this.

CMs, is it ok to say it's her choice, pay me the money back and I'll go on paying her as normal; or I won't pay her anything till the debt is paid off? Or do I need to work something complicated out with half-pay or whatever over a long time (which for lots of reasons I'd rather not do)?

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TheOtherMaryPumpkins · 21/10/2008 15:15

Well I'm a CM who can't read, so what a pair we make

TheOtherMaryPumpkins · 21/10/2008 15:14

ok I read it properly now, blame the 5mo on my knee!

ActiveC · 21/10/2008 15:14

i appears i'm a CM who also can't spell

TheOtherMaryPumpkins · 21/10/2008 15:13

whatamuddle "My work gives me a contribution towards childcare costs, and because of me being inefficient etc. they have paid 9 months in a block, which comes to about £800. I have just discovered, after ENDLESS pestering, that they sent cheques for a total of £800 straight to CM, without telling me (though I asked them to), without a proper covering note giving my/child's name back in AUGUST. CM has said NOTHING to me about this.

I'm seeing her for the first time this afternoon since this all came to light,"

You did't actually say that the cheque had been paid over 2 months ago, so hard to know what you meant - hence my earlier post.

As this is the case then yes by all means ask about it ASAP and demand it back or no fees due for 2 months, which would you rather anyway? Would help if you had at least 2 scenarios to put to the CM as yes in 2 months it was probably spent by now.

I'd also chase up and see exactly who cashed it too just in case the CM does know nothing about it and that's why nothing was said

traceybath · 21/10/2008 15:13

It is rather odd - best to give her the benefit of the doubt. I once had a cheque sent to the wrong address and it was cashed by someone fraudulently - luckily my mum worked for the bank they tried to pay it into and got it sorted.

But surely she'd have phoned the company to check what the money related to?

Good luck with sorting it out. Also i wouldn't feel guilty it is so not your fault.

oops · 21/10/2008 15:10

Message withdrawn

ActiveC · 21/10/2008 15:07

Oops hit the nail on the head!

Whatamuddle, Well done for wanting to be diplomatic abut the situation. However your childminder is a professional business woman. How the heck she didn't question a cheque for £800 I don't know. Surely the cheque had your company name, SHE COULD HAVE MADE ENQUIRIES, BUT CHOOSE NOT TO. I assume that you have been paying her, so you have/ are paying her double.

Tell her straight that you know its been cashed and should she try and plead innocent, tell her you'll report her for fraud.

Was it a crossed cheque? How likely it it that the cheque fell into the hands of another bearing the same full as your childminder.

In my opinon, your cm has one option; to work it off and if she says no, contact the NCMA, who I'm sure will be none to pleased that one of their members has brought its name into disrepute.

I'm a CM and would never do this. Disgusting.

oops · 21/10/2008 15:07

Message withdrawn

lizziemun · 21/10/2008 15:04

Can you ask your finance dept to get a copy of the cheque from their bank as it will/should show the account details of where it was banked.

mumof2222222222222222boys · 21/10/2008 14:40

Just to answer your query re the fraud...I imagine that paying it back might have been an option. However it is not one that the individual pursued. He said he hadn't noticed it which was frankly unbelievable. When I first heard the facts I thought it was harsh to sack him - but the Employment Trib upheld the decision.

Good luck with CM.

Original poster
whatamuddle · 21/10/2008 13:50

of course, though, that's a good way of thinking of it: advance payment.
(problem is, I've been paying her effectively double for 2 months without realising - that's why there's an issue!)

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Original poster
whatamuddle · 21/10/2008 13:48

marypumpkins - I guess this thread originated in my putting myself in the CM's position: she has a big family, a lot of (unexpected) calls on money just now, and she's scatty (super-nice though, and DC really loves her). I felt that I'd unwittingly put her in an unreasonable position, and that it would have been perfectly understandable if she had spent the money - it's two months since she got it, after all (bloody work, I have been chasing them about this since BEFORE they sent the cheques out).

What I'm trying to do is to find a way out of this that isn't too painful for her, and which doesn't leave me massively out of pocket. Of course, if she has just put the money into a savings account then all is fine and dandy, and she can just give me a cheque and all goes on as normal. I just know that if I was in her shoes, inevitably, at least some of it would have been eaten away...

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TheOtherMaryPumpkins · 21/10/2008 13:42

Can we not give the CM benefit of the doubt for now and assume she thinks it's just advance payment for childcare rather than bandying terms like fraud about or assuming she will have spent it all?

SammyK · 21/10/2008 13:36

Wow what an odd situation to get into! I too am that CM didn't question it. (I am a cm and a mum)

You need to work out exactly how much you are 'n credit' with her, and then how she will pay it back.

TBH I think it is her own daftness and you shouldn't feel bad about not paying her until her debt is paid off. She is running a business and should know what money is coming in and out, alos you (and the other parents) have all been paying her, with her having 800£ cheque landing on her doormat. Odd. I wuld want to know where £800 had come from!

Original poster
whatamuddle · 21/10/2008 13:15

gosh, mum22boys, fraud? I'd always imagined that in such circumstances you'd just pay the money back - it wouldn't be fraud. How could they prove you knew about it?
But yes, of course, windfalls do need to be treated with caution...
I'd like to get our feet clear on this, ie her pay me back, or pay nothing till it's all sorted out, but I definitely don't feel I can insist on this.

Just wanted to say, this has been really helpful. And has made me feel much better about not being COMPLETELY in the wrong. Which in turn I hope will mean that I handle the whole situation better - not being too apologetic about it.

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mumof2222222222222222boys · 21/10/2008 12:25

It all seems a bit odd to me, but as you want the relationship to continue, I think you need to have a chat and get to the bottom of it.

State that as she has received the cheque (interesting to know whether she connected it with you, and if not where she thought the windfall had come from) you estimate that no further payments are due until x December. Ask if she agrees. Then ask if she doesn't, whether that presents any problems.

Good luck.

PS At work we have had someone who was overpaid for 5 months. Said nothing. Sacked for fraud. Went to tribunal and lost. Salutary tale for those who receive "windfalls".