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CM CLUB:How much tax would you pay on..

65 replies

PinkChick · 02/08/2008 08:40

Approx £10-£11'000?

trying to do online, theyve invalidated my password as i hadnt used it and trying to find out how much i can spend out of tax savings on new stuff???

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PinkChick · 26/08/2008 09:53

HI, just getting sorted finally, so what tax code do i actually use when im calculating 07/08 income???????

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PinkChick · 06/08/2008 13:22

ooooh..seems i am a bit wet behind the ears!..better change my paperwork!..thanks girls

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KatyMac · 06/08/2008 09:34

Babies I put through £1 a day

Under 5's
BF 0.80
Snack 0.25
Lunch 1.30
Snack 0.25
Tea 1.30
Total 3.90

Over fives

BF 1.00
Snack 0.50
Lunch 1.75
snack 0.50
Tea 1.75
Total 5.50
Plus I put through half of toiletries (hand wash ect) all wipes (dd is 10) half all cleaning stuff

jillyj · 06/08/2008 09:30

noooooooooooooooo pinkchick, way too little for food. i was told by tax advisor from tax office 6 years ago to put £5.00 per day for food per child. change it, quick lol

PinkChick · 06/08/2008 09:26

i deduct everything i use for cm'ing from my shopping list, i was told to estimate £2 per day per child, but i spend way more than this!, plus toilettries, cleaning stuff etc

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KatyMac · 06/08/2008 09:23

How do you do food? Do you charge the parents? or put it through your accounts?

PinkChick · 06/08/2008 08:46

do you know what..!..STUPIDLY..i AHVENT..i just totted up my expenses sheets and put that figure down!..it did include utilities but not the 10 wear and tear!..good job i couldnt get logged on online really isnt it!

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KatyMac · 06/08/2008 07:44

10% even

KatyMac · 06/08/2008 07:43

So have you taken off the 0% wear & tear?

Shoshe · 05/08/2008 20:49

PC I find a lot of mine goes on mileage, I have to do a lot of mileage.

Obviously NOT 10,000 tho

PinkChick · 05/08/2008 20:33

thats what i was thinking too??..how can we write off £10'000???

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navyeyelasH · 05/08/2008 17:15

Brill thanks for the info MrVibrating. So how is it that some CM's pay no tax - do they not make any money beyond their tax free allowance?

MrVibrating · 05/08/2008 03:19

navyeyelasH you are right about the personal allowances and the mess over the 10% tax band, but I think there is quite a lot of confusing information on this thread so I thought I would dive in and clarify a few things.

The personal allowance in 2007/8 was £5,225. This is the same whether you are single or married, unless you are over 73 .

The personal allowance in 2008/9 was going to be £5,435 so people with a 'standard' tax code now have 543L.

Due to the 10% tax band cock-up, the personal allowance in 2008/9 is being increased to £6,035. So in September your tax code should change to 603L.

If you have a job with benefits in kind (company car, BUPA, some types of pension scheme), or you have tax under or overpaid from previous years then your tax code might be very different from this. This is because HMRC use the tax code to collect tax from you (or give some back if necessary) on these benefits. But because this can only be done on an estimated basis, you will probably do a tax return at the end of the year to sort everything out.

The tax code is used only by employers to work out how much tax to hold back from your pay (and later hand over to HMRC), so it doesn't have any effect on your CM affairs (although the personal allowance on which it is based does of course, as you will see below).

Now for the difficult bit...

KatyMac I think you have confused things a little by taking the personal allowance off your total income and then taking off your expenses. How it actually works is this:

Your total income is everything you receive (or are due to receive) from your business (less only VAT if your business is large enough so that you charge VAT).

You pay income tax on your profit, which is your total income less business expenses. For a business that is run from your own home, it can be difficult to work out what is a business expense and what is actually your own domestic expenses. Rather than try and work out what is and what is not a business expense yourself, if you are a Childminder you should use the NCMA guide. Some of the items in the guide are obvious 'direct' expenses, such as the cost of paint and play materials for your mindees. But some are general allowances, particularly the 10% of total income which is supposed to cover wear and tear and replacement of items in the home used for childminding (KatyMac mentions the 10%, but not what it is for - this is important because it means you can't include as a business expense specific items you replace, like new kitchen lino because the kids have trashed it).

So if your total income is £10,000 and your expenses are £4,500 your profit will be £5,500.

The next step is to add up all your income (part time or temporary jobs, interest on savings etc.) This will give you your total taxable income, and now this is where the personal allowance comes in. If your taxable income is less than the personal allowance you pay no tax. In my example, £5,500 is less than the £6,035 personal allowance so when you do your tax return in September 2009 there will be nothing to pay.

navyeyelasH · 04/08/2008 20:42

but does it matter if you are not married? Does the allowance depend on that at all?

katymac I still don't get it. Think I'm just being stupid! Need to get a book on accounting or something methinks!

MrsFluffleHasAWuffle · 04/08/2008 20:03

That,s this year btw - and we are all still working out last years, which was £5225

sory I am confusing everyone now aren't I

MrsFluffleHasAWuffle · 04/08/2008 20:02

Personal allowance is £6035 sorry, I typoed. It was £5435 but they increased it over the hoohar with the 10% tax band being scrapped

KatyMac · 04/08/2008 19:20

Ok we can claim
10% of all turnover (ie every penny we earn) - so you can add that to you Tax free allowance
Plus 10% council tax & water rates - which also adds to the Tax allowance
plus 33% of your fuel costs - which also add to you tax free allowance

So if I turnover £10,000
I have my Tax free allownace £5000 (approx)

Then expenses:
I have 10% of council tax £100
I have 10% of Water Rates £21
I have 10% turnover £1000
I have 33% of Fuel (£150*12)/3 £600

So before I start I have £1721

Then I add in the food costs - I use a set sum per meal

Then I add mileage (40p a mile)

Plus all the other expenses - say £3000

So 10,000-5000=5000

Less expenses (£1721+£3000) so £5000 - £4721 means I pay tax on £279 @ 20% = £55.80 on £10,000 turnover

But I pay NI every week plus NI on £279

navyeyelasH · 04/08/2008 18:38

Sugarandspice I know how the tax system works in terms of %, first £5000 odd (or whatever tax code is) is free, then 20% up to £36/35k then 40% on anything after that.

The bit that I don't understand how profit v income is calculated?

So lets say hypothetically that in one day I was paid £5 by a parent, and during the day I had the mindee I bought them an ice cream costing £1.

so my income is £5
my expenses are £1
and my profit is £4

do I have that right? And then things that are expenses are things like, car seats, buggys, toys etc? I just can't fathom how some CM's pay no tax? Does that mean they are not 'making' any money other than their £5000 odd tax free allowance?

pinkchick I know what my tax code is because I work as a nanny and it's on my payslip. I think only employees have a tax code though ?

But I just had a look here and it says: "(Exceptionally, the personal tax allowance is increasing twice for the 2008/09 tax year. From September 2008, the personal allowance will increase to £6,035 and it will be backdated so that it applies for the whole of the 2008/09 tax year. The tax code for this new personal allowance will be 603L.)"

Also there is a bit on listen to tax minute near the middle that says stuff about tax free allowances have a look here: listentotaxman.com/ I'm guessing it varies person to person depending on age and status etc. I also think that it is increasing twice for 08/09 year because of the 10p tax rate cut that labour introduced earlier in the year - I think upping the tax free allowance is the governments way of trying to make sure people aren't worse of because of the tax cut. But I'm not certain on this! Nannynick will know, fingers crossed he pops by!

PinkChick · 04/08/2008 17:10

so what IS the tax code then??am confused now???

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sugerandspice · 04/08/2008 15:46

This years standard tax code of 543L means you get £5430 tax free, last years was 522L meaning you got £5220 tax free.

You basically take the figure of all of your money in (income/turnover) then deduct all of your costs (expenses etc) then what is left is your profit.

You then take you profit and deduct your tax free allowance, then you have to pay tax on anything above that. For this tax year April 08-March 09 you pay 20% tax on anything over your tax allowance, it then goes up to i think 40% but thats only if you earn over something like 37k ish. If it is last years you are calculating though you take off your 5220 tax free, then you pay 10% on a bit then 22% and again 40% if you earn loads, i cant remember the exact amount that you only pay 10% on but it was about 2000.

Spent ages going through all this with my accountant in Jan! and helpfully made notes!

navyeyelasH · 04/08/2008 11:23

Can I hijack a little here please? I have read the info that you have all posted (and some other stuff) but my brain just can't get around certain things.

I work as a nanny and some of the work I do is on a self employed basis; I am also in process of registering as CM so that on rare occasions I can look after little ones in mine.

Anyway I don't get this profit V income stuff? How do you calculate it? Also Mrs MrsFluffleHasAWuffle said that the personal tax free allowance is £6350, but I'm sure mine is only £5430 (tax code is 543L)? Does it vary person by person?

Sorry for hijack and good luck with sorting everything out Pinkchick - I'm trying to get my head around this now so I don't get stung by HMRC next year

thanks xx

PinkChick · 04/08/2008 10:23

, i bet you CAN claim it but they dont want anyone to know..thats the prob isnt it, you just never know what you can do

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MrsFluffleHasAWuffle · 04/08/2008 10:17

pfft they want to update their bloody website then don't they! but am breathing a little sigh of relief though as it looked a bugger to work out!

Just mystified a little now as the CM "bisctuit tin" accountant bloke in Edinburgh has requested my CM friends mortgage details and written in letter that they now CAN claim it and that its a new thing??

PinkChick · 04/08/2008 09:09

Hi Girls, just rang ILR and that section about claiming a percentage of interest on your morgage payments is NO LONGER VALID..they said it is an old system and even when that was relevant if i had claimed it, i would then be hit for capital gains tax if i sold house..so just to update you all, save anyone else ringing and make sure you dont all claim and get into trouble..shame though!, she said if i go onto ncma website they have examples of what i can claim, although im guessing it will be standard % off utility bills etc..will let you know

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jillyj · 03/08/2008 22:06

ah, mine does, she works in another job 3 days and does my cleaning as a little extra job. heyho