In shock after visit to childminders

luw7797 · 2023-11-13T12:03:56+00:00

Just posting this cause I need a rant really but I just can’t believe what happened when my partner and I visited a childminders this morning! My DD is 10 months and we have decided to send her to a childminders two days a week as I’m doing a degree. We went for a look around at one that my friends little girl attends this morning. The lady seemed nice but she had a dog which actually tried to BITE my child. The dog was in the playroom with all the children and so I assumed it would be fine to let DD crawl up to it, she didn’t hit it or anything just put her hand out towards it and it snapped and had her hand in its mouth. The skin isn’t broken but there are marks, I can’t be 100% sure whether they are from the dog but I’m going to call the gp when DD wakes up from her nap. The dog then went on to growl at the other children so clearly it must do this all day long. I just can’t believe this woman keeps the dog around the children when it clearly doesn’t like it and one day it’s going to really hurt a child! She didn’t do anything when the dog went for DD, she just said oh did she fall on the dog and I said no the dog snapped at her and she didn’t say anything. There were also about a million choking hazards floating round the place! Tiny little parts of toys here there and everywhere. You’d think a childcare setting that takes on children as young as 6 months would be careful to remove choking hazards surely? I just can’t believe it, it’s really shaken me and made me question whether childcare is the right route to go or if I should drop out of my degree until DD is older. This was the first childminder weve visited so hopefully the next one is very different.

Are your children’s vaccines up to date?

Set a reminder

Retiredfromearlyyears · 11/03/2024 19:28

I’m sorry if this upsets the dog owners reading but I wouldn’t send your daughter to any childminder that allows her dog to mix freely with the children. She is to all intents and purposes running a buisness and this should be done on a professional footing. Basic Health and Safety is being ignored here on several levels. I would report the incident with your child to Ofsted. Thank goodness your child’s skin wasn’t broken. It’s unlikely there will be any further ill effects at least. Ask your local Authority if they have any childminders listed that they can recommend. Maybe there are other alternatives they can suggest. How about a nanny for 2 days.It probably won’t be that much dearer. Good luck with everything.

Joleyne · 29/11/2023 10:55

Maybe you’re unaware of what happens now. The bar to suspend is set very low.

If Ofsted had suspended her, she would be closed down for 6 weeks. The suspension can be lifted in that time, or it may be extended for another 6 weeks, and another, and another…

While suspended, the childminder can’t work or volunteer with children at all.

Ofsted makes unannounced visits to her home as part of their investigation and to gather evidence. The visits are often traumatic.
Almost a year ago, a headteacher committed suicide after a normal inspection in her school, with staff to share the stress.
A childminder is alone and already under considerable stress. These visits are often more like interrogations.
Suicidal thoughts are common. If she seeks medical help, it must be disclosed to Ofsted. She’s then reported to social services if she has children and Ofsted uses it as further evidence that she is unsuitable to work with children.

During suspension, the childminder can resign. If she does, she’s barred from working or volunteering with children. She also loses her insurance and any claim for lost earnings she may have made.

After a few suspension rounds, Ofsted often attempts to cancel a childminder’s registration. All these unannounced visits and investigations are expensive and time-consuming.
If they succeed, the bar on working or volunteering with children is extended to her immediate family and her address.

Innocent or guilty, that’s probably why she resigned before Ofsted could suspend her.

Motomum23 · 28/11/2023 09:49

ginandtonicwithlimes · 28/11/2023 09:38

Worst things I see at toddler groups tend to be childminders. 🤣 Too busy gossiping to notice the boy trying to escape or putting down a hot drink that any child could grab.

Show quote history

I'd agree with you - I don't go to toddler groups anymore because I'm sick of being the person that watches all the kids even the ones that aren't my responsibility. Before covid I fished a safety pin out of a babies mouth whilst his grandma was chattering away and I thought no more - I'm paid for these 2 kids but I'm watching 15. Now we have fun in our little group on the beach and in parks etc without the added stress of other people's responsibility.

ginandtonicwithlimes · 28/11/2023 09:38

Motomum23 · 27/11/2023 15:27

I've been minding for 15 years - with huge age ranges. I have never had a child choke on anything. The worst things I have seen have been other people's babies at toddler groups.

Worst things I see at toddler groups tend to be childminders. 🤣 Too busy gossiping to notice the boy trying to escape or putting down a hot drink that any child could grab.

Motomum23 · 27/11/2023 15:27

I've been minding for 15 years - with huge age ranges. I have never had a child choke on anything. The worst things I have seen have been other people's babies at toddler groups.

bombastix · 27/11/2023 13:10

Childminder with a dog. Just no way.

AirFryerFrequentFlyer · 27/11/2023 13:09

@Motomum23 I'm really shocked you've said that about the small parts. That doesn't sound safe at all. You think you can keep watch on every single child every second of the day to stop them putting something in their mouths? Yeah good luck with that

AirFryerFrequentFlyer · 27/11/2023 13:04

lovescats3 · 13/11/2023 14:47

A dog's mouth is very dirty I assume you washed your child's hand afterwards

Cats mouths are worse.

Original poster

luw7797 · 27/11/2023 11:15

@edwardcullensotherwoman yes of course from now on I will be much more cautious with my child around dogs but I don’t think it was unreasonable of me to assume this dog was friendly and enjoyed being around children and babies seeing as it was literally in the children’s playroom. It was growling at the other children too so I don’t think it was that it wasn’t used to my child, I think it just did not like being around children. And yes in my previous posts I have rectified myself and said if the dog had actually wanted to bite my child it would have and it was more of a warning, but what happens when this dog is sick of giving warnings and actually bites a child? If she had tried to “reassure” me that the dog was safe around kids I’d have probably laughed in her face, it clearly was not safe around children at all.

OP posts:

edwardcullensotherwoman · 27/11/2023 00:26

user1846385927482658 · 13/11/2023 12:33

The dog was in the playroom with all the children and so I assumed it would be fine to let DD crawl up to it

For future reference, never make that assumption about any dog.

This.
The dog had never met your DD whereas it had likely got used to the other children if they're regulars. Never assume that it's ok for a child to approach a dog and reach towards its face!
I would also say that had the dog been trying to bite your DD or be aggressive it would have broken the skin of her hand was in its mouth. It was probably trying to correct her to show it didn't like what she did.

That said, her lack of response is really bad - she should have apologised and explained, and reassured you that the dog is safe around children!

Deadringer · 27/11/2023 00:00

You absolutely did the right thing, and while your friend has been inconvenienced, it is possible that you have saved their child from potential harm.

Original poster

luw7797 · 26/11/2023 19:45

@ZoChan This occurred in the playroom, which the childminder allowed the dog to be in. A 10 month old isn’t able to know if they’re doing something “bad”. If the dog wasn’t safe for children to interact with then what on earth was it doing in the play room? Of course I assumed it was okay for my child to approach. If my child had been poking and prodding and annoying the dog and I’d done nothing then that would be a different story but all she did was crawl over and reach her arm out, that’s all it took for this dog to snap at her - it absolutely should not have been in the children’s space.

OP posts:

ZoChan · 26/11/2023 19:24

But you were there. If a potential customer visits with their parent, the childminder wouldn't be in charge of them? So playing devils advocate, she wouldn't have reacted to your child as DC is in your care? I would have been on it because I don't mind interfering when I think a child is doing something they shouldn't, in front of their parent, but many don't and wouldn't say anything. And now the childminders had to close, losing work before Christmas, because you didn't remove your child from a situation you weren't happy with. As PP said, it's no wonder childminders are leaving the profession in droves.

Motomum23 · 23/11/2023 14:06

Yeah I can hand on heart say the childminder knew she would be pulled over the coals. I've had a malicious complaint in the past (a contractual dispute then they decided to make up a bizarre pack of lies) ofsted came, saw it was all rubbish and wrote off the complaint and I carried on with my head held high.

Blondeshavemorefun · 23/11/2023 14:02

You did the right thing

chillin12 · 23/11/2023 13:59

luw7797 · 23/11/2023 13:56

Just to update as some have asked what the outcome of our complaint was. Ofsted informed the childminder of our complaint and I have heard through the friends who’s daughter went there that the childminder has chosen to close. As far as I know Ofsted haven’t done an inspection and they haven’t updated us with an outcome, this is just what I’ve heard through my friend. Friend is now unhappy with me as she had decided to keep her child on there and now she will have to find a new childminder. Personally I don’t think I’ve done anything wrong, the only thing I can think of is maybe she thought I was exaggerating what happened to my DD or she trusts the childminders word over mine who knows. I feel like the fact the childminder has chosen to shut down, without even having an inspection, is a huge red flag and suggests she knows she’s most likely fail it. Sad about my friend but not much I can do, such is life some people will choose to move on from you and there’s not a lot I can do.

Don’t worry OP, you definitely did the right thing . At least this incident has prevented other children being at risk. I’m glad to hear 🥰

Original poster

luw7797 · 23/11/2023 13:56

Just to update as some have asked what the outcome of our complaint was. Ofsted informed the childminder of our complaint and I have heard through the friends who’s daughter went there that the childminder has chosen to close. As far as I know Ofsted haven’t done an inspection and they haven’t updated us with an outcome, this is just what I’ve heard through my friend. Friend is now unhappy with me as she had decided to keep her child on there and now she will have to find a new childminder. Personally I don’t think I’ve done anything wrong, the only thing I can think of is maybe she thought I was exaggerating what happened to my DD or she trusts the childminders word over mine who knows. I feel like the fact the childminder has chosen to shut down, without even having an inspection, is a huge red flag and suggests she knows she’s most likely fail it. Sad about my friend but not much I can do, such is life some people will choose to move on from you and there’s not a lot I can do.

OP posts:

Blondeshavemorefun · 17/11/2023 20:12

Did you hear anything from ofsted?

It's shocking a cm had a dog in the kids play area

Should be separated at all times

Reugny · 17/11/2023 16:58

WoollyBat · 15/11/2023 15:00

But the thread isn't demonising all childminders at all and many poeple are saying they've had great CMs.

The point that's being made is that if there is abuse or neglect – which sadly there sometimes is – a CM is on their own so there's no oversight and no one would know. And in that way, a nursery may be preferable - there are bad nurseries and nursery staff too but problems are more likely to be noticed by another adult.

https://www.mylondon.news/news/south-london-news/toddler-2-almost-hit-2-28126586

Similar happened a nursery near me. That nursery closed down within a year.

Btw I used a nursery and a childminder.

ginandtonicwithlimes · 17/11/2023 12:46

A CM on here not bothered by small things on the floor?!? I wouldn't be leaving my one year old with you.

Tg2023 · 16/11/2023 14:00

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WoollyBat · 16/11/2023 13:38

All the nurseries I've worked at have been full of unmotivated bitchy staff. They're not usually great environments to be fair but the parents would never know as they have a different persona on pick up time.

Yes nurseries can be bad too. I discussed this with my HV and she recommended one she said was the best she knew of in our city and that most were not great.

BUT it is nonetheless easier for a CM to get away with severe, wilful neglect or harm, and there's no oversight at all, and it's also easier for others in the CM's life or home to access children to abuse them, which is very unlikely at a nursery. And of course, as in this case, for there to be a dog involved which always brings a risk.

All CMs are not good or bad, all nursery staff/nurseries are not good or bad.

The point, again, is that the setup for a CM makes abuse/harm/neglect easier. That doesn't mean it can't happen in a nursery, but it does mean it's less likely, or more likely to be seen and reported.

Looneytune253 · 16/11/2023 11:54

WoollyBat · 15/11/2023 15:00

But the thread isn't demonising all childminders at all and many poeple are saying they've had great CMs.

The point that's being made is that if there is abuse or neglect – which sadly there sometimes is – a CM is on their own so there's no oversight and no one would know. And in that way, a nursery may be preferable - there are bad nurseries and nursery staff too but problems are more likely to be noticed by another adult.

All the nurseries I've worked at have been full of unmotivated bitchy staff. They're not usually great environments to be fair but the parents would never know as they have a different persona on pick up time.

WoollyBat · 15/11/2023 15:00

But the thread isn't demonising all childminders at all and many poeple are saying they've had great CMs.

The point that's being made is that if there is abuse or neglect – which sadly there sometimes is – a CM is on their own so there's no oversight and no one would know. And in that way, a nursery may be preferable - there are bad nurseries and nursery staff too but problems are more likely to be noticed by another adult.

MariaVT65 · 15/11/2023 13:52

Snap8TheCat · 15/11/2023 13:48

I would just like to say how hurtful it is to read some of these comments demonising all childminders from usually one (sometimes no) encounters with a childminder.

I am not an abuser. I do not leave children alone or in the care of others. I do not park them in front of the TV and chat with friends. I do not take risks with my mindees. I do not put their needs behind those of my children. It is not a convenient way to earn money whilst I stay home with my own children.

Childminding is a career choice for me. I care passionately about the care and education of my little ones. My own children are teens and my mindees and their families are an extension of ours.

I work hard developing my knowledge and training in my own time. I look after them as I did my own, with love, kindness, awareness and energy.

I also have many childminder colleagues who are the same. They would feel the same as I do in feeling absolutely gutted at the generalisations made here towards us.

I absolutely acknowledge there are good and bad childminders. Some of my friends have really good childminders. My personal experience is that i’ve had 2 bad childminders, so based on this my personal decision is to not use any again and we’ve found nursery a lot better. I agree generalisations shouldn’t be made but I think many of us are going on experience. Just as a basic example you mentioned no tv. My second childminder had tv on all day.