Does everyone think childcare should be paid for?

This is a precisely the issue - people don't want to work a lot of the time

No why should I pat for other people's kids when I've already paid fir 4 of my own?

If there is to be further state intervention/subsidies for child-rearing, I'd rather it went towards enabling families to have a parent at home (or working fewer hours). The marriage tax allowance is pitiful really, that could be more generous.

I'd rather be able to afford to have more involvement in raising my child than have "free" childcare.

You’re providing the basics, most should want to provide more than just enough to survive.

Children who are exposed to new things, travel, clubs etc. are proven to do better in general than those who are not able to engage in these activities.

This is what’s meant by not having kids if you can’t afford childcare, as if you can’t even afford that, how will you cope later when they want to do more?

I agree that work places should provide heavily subsidised child care places - along with access to private GP services. I also think work should be more flexible. Work has to the default. Everyone contributes something - even if only one or two days a week. So everyone has a stake.

I think I just reached peak Mumsnet. My kids are happy, fed, clothed and loved. They have prospects for fucks sake.

3 day a week childcare for two is double our mortgage. Our mortgage was based on the affordability of both our full time incomes. We earn around the same (this is important because friends who have a higher earning DH don’t have the same considerations if they choose to give up work). And we earn above the universal credit threshold. Either one of us work part time and we take home less than £50 per week after paying for childcare or one of us gives up work. Either way we have to pay our mortgage (and bills etc) on half the income our mortgage is based on. Whilst I knew this was the case, the reality is much harder than expected especially with the the cost of living increases. Our childcare bill has increased more than 10% in six months. No, I don’t expect anyone to pay for my kids and one of us will take a career break if needed. But it really is a second mortgage.

I reckon work places should provide on site subsidised crèches (within reason, obviously it wouldn't work for all jobs). Much like I can plug my kids into the soft play at Ikea or a kids club on holiday. Childcare providers get paid properly for their services from the company, working parents don't have to worry about the journey from/to childcare and the companies win by encouraging parents (and therefore talented colleagues) back to work by taking some of the financial burden off them.

But it's not just about economics - its about social behaviour as well.
Already there's growing feeling that those who work are getting screwed. There are people who reduce their working hours in order to maximise their benefits income. And non-workers often treat those working, (call centre workers, retail staff, receptionist, waiting staff in particular), like shit.

So fewer people want to do it. So do we recruit cheap labour from poorer countries, force people to work or what??

A single person who has worked full time from 17 - 66 pays tax and is far worse off, will never get free prescriptions, paid sabbatical time or a council house or help with anything.

A woman who has six kids, never had a job, no partner and done nothing will be financially better off than a couple both in low paid jobs, renting privately. She has no incentive to do anything different. And whilst providing childcare may or may not help the kids all it really does is make it easier for her to have more - to the detriment of her existing kids. (And the feckless fathers have NO disincentive at all as they don't have to contribute anything - and if they stay on benefits their kids cost them nothing at all)

If you're working full time then you should be able to pay towards your own childcare? Its subsidised and is short term

The encouragement for those with that much money is already there in their lifestyles..they go abroad, weekends away, new cars, new clothes, dinners out, eat expensive foods whilst those in need can't put the heat on. Why do you think Trusses policies were so divisive? Those on the high salaries are not going to give up work to live on the bread line and use food banks, or give up their homes because benefits don't pay for their expensive houses.

What happens about low paid families,single parents and so on? Most people do not have free cc from families . It seems unfair on children.Less people can afford an SAHP these days .Some sort of Government help should be avaliable surely

Well a decent life, being able to travel, school trips, clubs, not depriving your children of experiences due to costs.

Unfortunately many people have children and just get by, those are the children who often then struggle throughout life, with poor prospects.

Children should be able to thrive, not simply survive. And unfortunately those not able to afford childcare often can’t do that.

We have an ageing population which is costly to the economy.

as someone in my mid/late 20s I don't understand why this government can't adequately fund housing and childcare. These are two major factors which take a large chunk of people's wages (I also think wages should be higher, but that's a separate argument)

A big reason why I don't know if I can have kids, is because of housing costs but also childcare Costs are ridiculous.

If we don't make it more appealing to have kids we're going to struggle.

other countries fund childcare and the quality is still good we should aim for this imo.

I'm not sure what your definition of a "good life" is so I'll brush over that.

But speaking personally, I can't afford childcare which hugely limits the amount of shifts I am able to take on in my job. Once they are at school, I will take on more shifts. It's pretty simple.

It should be subsidised enough to be affordable to all families so parents don't have to give up work because they can't afford childcare.
I live in Finland where its heavily subsidised, I was paying 20 euros a month for my son while he was in the younger group that has higher ratios, now he is in the older class I pay nothing. If I had a higher income I'd be paying more as fees are on a sliding scale, but there's a very reasonable maximum (something around 250e a month for one child). If I had to pay a lot I'd not send him to nursery and then he'd miss out on the social development and his Finnish skills would be much worse so he would struggle when he starts school which would then cost more as the school would have to provide extra support. Children going to nursery before starting school makes the switch to school and learning easier so that makes things easier for the teachers. The benefits go to more than just the parents.

no shit Sherlock

I don't agree with free childcare. It's not free. Taxpayers would be paying for it.

There should be some support (other than the tax free childcare scheme) before the age of three. It’s crazy really that I’m paying more than my mortgage for childcare for ages 1 to 2, two years, before the 30 hours kick in. It would be better to have a smaller subsidy starting after maternity leave.

They don’t need state help, but the state should want to encourage those on higher salaries to continue working and contributing to the economy and the tax system as a whole.

It's crazy economics that we don't do this.

No wonder our economy is failing.

We spend billions educating women only to have the 80% who have DC's to suffer detriment in the workplace, underemployment, discrimination, poverty, social exclusion, homelessness, etc etc because of the barrier of a lack of free community controlled childcare available to all mothers as and when needed.

It's such a massive waste of resources and potential. Underemployment of mothers costs us all billions every year.

The only reason for not doing it is misogyny.

I am from a country where childcare is very heavily subsidised and nearly free. NOBODY has more children because if that, in fact the country has one of the lowest birth rates in Europe and struggled with aging. The benefits of subsidied childcare are well documented incl helping women stay in the labour market and giving ALL children the same opportunities from a very young age. That women argue against it baffles me!

And yes I have children and I can afford childcare and I also accept my taxes go to things I don’t personally need/want. It’s called living in a society.

Because if they are earning that much they don't need state help which is why they pay £000s more than the average in childcare fees. I bet they took the grant for utilities support and wasted it whilst elderly were freezing too. It's just wrong like picking up more food than you can eat because it's free and your first in the qué while others go hungry. .....it like our last PMs idea of cutting tax for the rich to boost the economy.

It implies nothing of the sort, some of it will be down to wondering how a parent can properly support a family if they can’t afford childcare.

Children are expensive, to give them a good life especially so, if you can’t afford childcare how are you going to afford a good life for them after they start school?

I do blame the government, they are cheapskates who underfund the current funded provision and hence my desire to not eosh to be subjected to more of it. And by the way, I am also a working mother.