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Paid childcare

Discuss everything related to paid childcare here, including childminders, nannies, nurseries and au pairs.

Does everyone think childcare should be paid for?

332 replies

Cococomellon · 01/01/2023 16:43

I have seen a lot of posts in social media about the cost of childcare, that it should be free and all the reasons in favour of that such as allowing both parents to work and the impact on the economy.

I can see how this would be a benefit. I have a young child and pay for childcare but I planned for this and it is not a surprise to me.

Who pays for this "free" childcare? Is there spare money the government has squirrelled somewhere? Should we all pay more taxes? Will the nhs get even less funding? Schools?

Perhaps I am just very right wing as I don't see to see the counter- arguments but I'm sure many people (some who don't have children) don't want to pay for others children to go to nursery?

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chavbagornot · 01/01/2023 17:07

I think it would be great if childcare costs were cheaper and I say this as someone without kids because why would someone choose to work when the cost of childcare for a lot of women wipes out most of their income - therefore it becomes an obvious choice for many to take time out of work.

However this issue as I see it is that there is such a gender gap in the first place - why is it women are often usually the lower earner and therefore it makes sense for them to be the ones to take the year off?

But then I also think (unpopular opinion) women feel entitled to have long time off work even after the recovery from childcare many want the time off - it often isn't about the money for a lot of women so if childcare is cheaper I'm not convinced it would encourage many more back to work that wouldn't have been in work in the first place without cheaper childcare

biedrona · 01/01/2023 17:05

ouch321 · 01/01/2023 16:49

I wouldn't want to pay for people's childcare. Already I pay taxes that contribute towards schooling. If people want to have children they need to be willing to cough up to cover the associated costs.

Harsh as it may sound to some, that is the reality.

Letitrainletitrainletitrain · 01/01/2023 17:05

Cococomellon · 01/01/2023 17:00

@RaininSummer Yes exactly. People have several children in the expectation of receiving benefits and free childcare while some of us have "good" earnings but have to consider childcare costs in deciding whether to have another child. All while paying higher taxes to fund those having more and more children without a thought.

Oh come on

It's been years, years since benefits were available for more than 2 children. Yet still people bang on about having children for benefits with the regularity of a daily mail columnist

Alfiexx1 · 01/01/2023 17:03

I do however think the fees need to be assessed and the government should potentially look at ‘windfall’ taxes on providers charging over a certain amount to encourage lower fees. Or for the government to set a max fee, as they’ve gone up 40%+ in the last 10 years which is well above inflation and min wage increases

Letitrainletitrainletitrain · 01/01/2023 17:03

I don't have kids

I am happy to pay for subsidised child care because all too often expensive/lack of childcare forces women to stay in abusive relationships, damages their career etc

Its all very well saying children are a choice, but its a choice that impacts women and I choose to support women

What I would also like to see is more support for parents who want to stay at home for say 3 years. Bring back sure start centres, increase respite support for children with disabilities, better programs for parents looking to re enter the workforce etc

And I don't think this entirely has to be funded by the taxpayer. The reality is that currently the tax payer is funding profits for big organisations through paying universal credit to people in full time employment because they don't earn enough to live.

Legislation around salaries and profits could mean that we wouldn't have these massive cost of living crisis and people could be paid appropriately lowering the burden on the taxpayer, or leaving more money free to support all areas of society.

Perhaps there would be less sense of entitlement to help if big corporations were not currently forcing part of our workforce into needing help, in order to bolster their profits? Its not entitlement when it's survival.

Wardrobemalfunction22 · 01/01/2023 17:03

We live in an ageing population so unless people are incentivised to have children the problems were seeing in nhs and social care are just going to get worse. Short term vs long term viewpoint. Yes, more subsidised childcare would cost more taxes but in 20 years time when we have no state pension and no state social care we may regret not funding childcare now.

CaptainMyCaptain · 01/01/2023 17:03

It is in everyone's interest, including the childless/child free, to have an educated population and workforce that is why it is paid for from taxes. I see no reason why this could not include childcare where both parents choose to work and pay tax.

Alfiexx1 · 01/01/2023 17:02

I don’t, but then again I’m not in the demographic where this would be helpful, I earn well and it hasn’t been a barrier to me returning to work at all.

Luckyducker · 01/01/2023 17:01

No, I don't think childcare should be paid for. People need to either look after their own children for pay for someone else to do so. People can't just have children and expect everyone else to look after them for free. People who cannot afford childcare should receive help as with all essentials but many people can afford it.

Cococomellon · 01/01/2023 17:00

@RaininSummer Yes exactly. People have several children in the expectation of receiving benefits and free childcare while some of us have "good" earnings but have to consider childcare costs in deciding whether to have another child. All while paying higher taxes to fund those having more and more children without a thought.

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Timeforachangeisitnot · 01/01/2023 16:59

AnotherAppleThief · 01/01/2023 16:47

I'm a childminder and I don't see why I should subsidise childcare for parents which is effectively what happens when you ask the government to step in. They choose what they decide to pay (as with the current funding) and then make providers jump through hoops to make a living wage or godforbid, a profit.

This. Had a conversation about social carers in the home today. For info, I am in Scotland, where personal care is free to the user.

All well and good, but the carers are paid peanuts, they have to provide their own transport ( mileage rate probably does not cover costs), there are not enough people willing to do the job, and it ends up being shit for carer and caree.
Having the government oversee and pay for childcare is a race to the bottom.

Newmum738 · 01/01/2023 16:59

Childcare should be free or at least heavily subsidised. Those who don't want their taxes to pay for it forget that it is those children that will be paying taxes to fund their health care, social care and social security. Not being able to pay for childcare means people have fewer children which means there will be fewer people in the labour market to fund the range of services that we all think we are entitled to.

Cococomellon · 01/01/2023 16:59

@AnotherAppleThief I wasn't saying you did say that!

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RaininSummer · 01/01/2023 16:59

Isn't there already free hours available at 2 and 3 depending on circumstances? Also those in UC get substantial help with costs. I wonder if it might lead to people having more children which I don't think we need.

AnotherAppleThief · 01/01/2023 16:58

Cococomellon · 01/01/2023 16:56

I could go with this @AnotherAppleThief or even help for one child but why should people with several children have free nursery places from age 2 when others pay everything for one child and higher taxes?!

I feel I am not allowed to say these things out loud. It is not socially acceptable to be a righty.

I didn't day free places for 2 year old?

PeekAtYou · 01/01/2023 16:57

I understand the theory but we know from the age 3+ system that the government does not fund it properly so making the system from birth would result in more childcare providers closing and shortages of places.

Cococomellon · 01/01/2023 16:56

I could go with this @AnotherAppleThief or even help for one child but why should people with several children have free nursery places from age 2 when others pay everything for one child and higher taxes?!

I feel I am not allowed to say these things out loud. It is not socially acceptable to be a righty.

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7Worfs · 01/01/2023 16:56

I’m very conservative when it comes to the economy, but childcare and education are the only budget items I don’t begrudge big spending on. It’s the very foundation of society.

Anotherbloomingchristmas · 01/01/2023 16:56

In a civilised society I think government should at least heavily subsidise childcare.
Much of the financial problems experienced presently by the generation with young dc are due to living costs requiring 2 wages.
I also believe that fathers should have to contribute 50% of childcare costs regardless of whether they remain in a relationship with the mother. It’s time we recognised that childcare is the responsibility of both parents.

Cococomellon · 01/01/2023 16:55

I don't think it is the same @livelyinthemuff I can see the argument but almost everyone uses healthcare at one stage or other and where do you draw the line with healthcare choices - smoking related healthcare, any healthcare for people who smoke, the obese, anyone who drinks more than X units a week? What about their children if they have four? The children would be cared for. It is not always possible to pinpoint direct causation.

You cannot plan for most illness the same way you can prepare for having a child.

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Cimafunky · 01/01/2023 16:54

livelyinthemuff · 01/01/2023 16:52

It's also a choice to eat to much or drink too much.

Should we deny those people free healthcare once their lifestyle catches up with them?

Likewise you could argue that state pensions and carers/fully/partly funded care homes for the elderly should be declined because they've had 50 odd years to save to provide for their old age

AnotherAppleThief · 01/01/2023 16:54

I think it should be tax free though, the whole amount not capped to £8k.

jannier · 01/01/2023 16:52

Cimafunky · 01/01/2023 16:48

In theory, if there is free/low costs childcare for working parents then more parents will work and therefore more taxes will be paid. More parents will pay into pensions. Parents will have more disposable income and spend it generating even more tax payments.

If that were the case as I'd have more 30 hour funded parents working for more than the minimum 16 hours and more 2 year funded doing back to work courses and less shopping.

Cococomellon · 01/01/2023 16:52

This is what I think @ouch321 and @Winterpetal

I have a child and of course would have lots more money if we had free childcare but I would honestly rather pay for my own child's nursery costs than pay for those with more children. There is already a lot of help.

There is a sense of entitlement to "help" these days.

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livelyinthemuff · 01/01/2023 16:52

Winterpetal · 01/01/2023 16:50

It’s a choice to have children,with that choice comes responsibly to look after them.
no one forces anyone to have them
so why should the government pick up the tab for looking after them.
i had 4 kids ,.government does enough providing free school places

It's also a choice to eat to much or drink too much.

Should we deny those people free healthcare once their lifestyle catches up with them?