What am I doing wrong... or do we just have too many kids?

But this thread is why they scream ‘slave labour’!!!! We have au pairs so we also understand how it works but we do it fairly!

Interesting article www.theguardian.com/commentisfree/2018/aug/30/au-pairs-servants-legal-rights-government

I hate MN au pair threads because they are invariably full of people who have no idea about the au pair deal and come on to scream “slave wages”.

Au pairs get rent, food and all bills paid by host family. The £100 is put spending money on top of that. It’s a pretty good deal for a hound person on their year abroad.

OP - we have had au pairs for many years. The market at the moment is awful, Brexit has decimated EU applications which means the only other countries you can legally hire from are Canada, Australia and NZ. There are applicants from those countries but fewer and now they are on huge demand. TBH I am not sure tinkering with your hours or pay will help much.

Do you advertise the opportunity to Skype your previous au pairs? We always do and it helps a lot as they can get the “inside” scoop on you and feel safer in their choice.

Also 30 hours is high. I’ve always thought 25 was upper limit for UK au pairs.

Good luck with your search.

I thought that 30 hours with four children is pretty much full time. I think you need to offer at least £30 a week more, regardless of what the agency suggests. It has to be money and the number of children and your offer is not attractive enough.

Of course 4 children is more work than 2 children! Not sure how you can think it isn’t?

The odds are against you. Four children is a lot. I can't imagine the amount of noise generated by the four of them chatting during dinner. That's enough to put off anyone who is not really keen on children.

Most aupairs want an easy life in a nice city while they improve their English. I don't think Manchester is a problem, but the money you are offering, the 4 children and Brexit don't make your offer very attractive

Agree with PP that the £85pw recommended by APW is unrealistic now.

We are in London and our last au pair was paid £125/pw (rising to £150 after a year) plus mobile and Travelcard for looking after one child, and no housework.

When we were looking more recently for two children, most au pairs wanted at least £120/£130 a week with mobile contract and travel card as a minimum - we ended up going for a part-time nanny since the cost was similar for what we actually needed.

Brexit has definitely had an impact - we found our au pair before the EU referendum and had hundreds of applications within a few days. Last time we only had a handful of applicants, and because of the reduced supply they could generally afford to be choosier about pay, extras etc.

I was an au pair in a very cheap European city in 2015 and received 70euros pw/my language classes (about 260pm)/transport card/phone contract in exchange for afterschool childcare for 3 kids 3/5/7. I also received 50euros pm for snacks/toiletries/groceries just for me.
It worked out as 20 hours pw and I never had to ‘make up’ my hours to the 30 APW mentions. I had a big group of au pair friends, and everyone knew who had the families that really squeezed every minute from their au pair, as they were also always ridiculously underpaid and worked awkward times.

www.mumsnet.com/Talk/am_i_being_unreasonable/3499082-To-ask-if-you-realise-au-pairs-are-seriously-under-threat-after-Brexit

Good luck I hope you find someone, it must be tricky. I have a few doubts when I have to babysit 4 children so for a young woman to have to care for them daily must be a daunting task! I definitely think gym membership etc would be more of a hook. Could you get a mother's help again if that worked well before?

Au pair world might be saying that's enough but that is a huge ask for so little money - my friend pays £120, plus use of a car, both kids in school and they paid flights home at Christmas as well as the beginning. 4 kids will be very off putting

Reverse the situation and ask yourself what you would want for what you are asking. Personally I think it's a big ask with four children, lots of au pairs can earn that or s bit less for looking after one or two children. In all honesty you need a nanny, not an au pair.

And also, the bus pass not a great perk compared to, say, cinema pass, mobile paid for, gym membership, etc. In fact, I'd have thought - given you live 15 minutes outside the city - the bus pass should be a given and another perk offered as well as that?

The four kids would put me off if I were an au pair, I'm afraid - having to manage the behaviour of four small children would be exhausting, and having to oversee getting dressed in the morning and ready for bed at night, including (it seems) supervising bath time...

Read any thread on MN to find out how bath and bed time finishes off most parents of two kids, never mind a young au pair (without the parental authority) trying to wrangle four!

Look at the other jobs on APW - they are essentially your competition. If there are jobs in London with two kids and £130 a week (for example) then you're just not going to get any applications that week. £20 more, in London, for half the work.... see how the potential AP's mind will be working?

You need to up the wages or the perks and sell Manchester hard.

So you want a live in nanny but only want to pay buttons?

You’re complete fools.

How old is the pre-schooler. A fully toliet trained nearly 4 year old would be very different to a two year old but to be honest either way that sounds more childcare job than au pair job.

Not a hope in hell would I live in someone else's house following their rules looking after their 4 children for 30hrs FOR £100 a week. The 'bonus' of a Manchester bus pass doesn't make it any more appealing !
Sorry OP but if you want quality childcare, you have to pay for it.

Gosh OP it seems you need a nanny but can only pay au pair rates. You are also massively minimizing the job you want done, FT childcare for one pre schooler (au pairs are not usually qualified for this) and dinner and baths for the rest? 'Bunging something in the oven' or 'light veg/oven food' is still cooking. No young person wants to come to all of that just because they have a nice bedroom.

PPs who are accusing you of paying slave wages don’t understand how the AP system works. Just ignore them.

However, you need to understand that four kids is definitely, absolutely, unequivocally a LOT more work than two kids. It’s not just hours are hours. There’s a huge difference between, say, evening babysitting while the kids are asleep and she can sit and watch Netflix vs full on juggling four kids with meal prep, homework, baths, school runs, and the rest of it. When she’s got all four kids it will be chaotic and she won’t even have a chance to take a breath. If you’re expecting ANY duties betind “in the moment” childcare, like kids’ laundry, tidying, or meal prep beyond reheating what you’ve already made you need to pay for extra time rather than considering them concurrent duties during the childcare hours. (Obviously this May be different on the days she has only one child, esp if the child naps.) Money is one thing but there’s only so much one person can physically do.

Also how are the 30 hours spread out? Are you expecting her to be up in tthe morning to get the kids ready or take them to school and then pick up again in the afternoon? It would be more attractive if she only had one solid block of hours each day, so she could sleep in (or sometimes spend the night with a friend or boyfriend) and start her day at 3 pm or whatever.

The fact that you had good Au pairs in the past is encouraging, but I think it’s like the real estate market. The house you can buy for £200K this year may cost £300K next year. It’s all about supply and demand.

Good luck!

Sounds good with the attic - i take it you pay all bills and provide all food? i like manchester, if only i liked children

Shitty wages. Doesn't matter whether they get a free "nice" room and meals. For that amount of money and things they've got to do, that's all you pay them? It's no wonder you're not getting any request.

Looking after four bloody kids, essentially doing the job that you are supposed to do? Why did you have 4 kids if you're just dumping them on an Au Pair?

Solution? Pay them more money!

Careful of increasing pay or you’re seen as their employer tax wise

APW- think their wording is ‘never work more than’ 30 hours so I wouldn’t interpret that as the average or the suggested number. It’s a huge amount of work for so little pay. I personally think it’s unrealistic and unfair. Ours does 20-22 hours. Looking after one child (we have two but other is in nursery all day). Language fees paid. Own beautiful room with en suite. Pay £110. Beautiful city. For some reason I think you think they’re getting a great deal- work out the hourly pay and for 4 kids and you’ll see they are not. I recently found a new au pair and the numbers were down but still hundreds of applicants

I think Manchester would be a great city to be an au pair in.

I think the pay is way too low for four kids.