Tried to help a mum with her head in the clouds, but it backfired

Lazycow is talking sense. If Nally was doing the preschool runs then of course the preschool would end up telling her at end of sessions how the boy's day went, what happened, problems encountered.

Nally looked after this wee lad more than full-time for 2 years and of course she cares a lot about him, I am shocked at people who dismiss her as judgemental without realising how fond she is of the lad -- and worried that his needs aren't being met by a mother who won't even pay up the bill she owes Nally.

I hope you get some good news, Nally. Think passing on your concerns to a HV is both a duty of care required of you (as a prof. childminder) and the only thing you can do.

Nally whilst I was a childminder I had a problem same as yours with a child in my care.In my case the outcome was the same as it is for you.
Speaking from personal experience the mother is maybe in denial and isnt ready to acknowledge the problems her child has or it could be a matter of the mother somehow believing she is to blame or will be looked on in this way by others. In time she will realise and maybe like me you will get a very distraught woman on your step who has the enormity of it just hit her like a ton of bricks.You cannot make her see it until she is ready to accept it for herself.You did what you could.

Oh that's so true sunnyjim. I was thinking about about the evil nursery and how they approached it with me. I'd had concerns for some months and people had told me not to be so silly, so these were the first people who were thinking the same way.

1. they asked me to fill in a quesitionnaire which had things like "what do you do at weekends?", "how do you play with ds1" - all seemed to be suggesting that they thought we just ignored him. 2)The told me it was my fault he wasn't talking
2. they told me I didn't seem to care there was something very wrong
3. they told me ds1 was the strangest child they'd ever seen
4. they told me that compared to x (from his antenatal group) he was way behind.

Never mind taking him out I'm surprised I didn't lamp the pair of them. God it was awful. Then when we did get to see the professionals 6 months down the line they told us there was nothing much wrong with him, mild language delay, definitely not autism. No wonder I was confused.

I don't think anyone expects nursery/Cm/school etc not to discuss things with each other. I'm a teacher too and of course this happens. The issue is if you discuss things with someone outside your institution BEFORE talking to the parents, and without letting the parents know.

I appreciate that it might be hard to discuss scary things like this but it is part of your job like its part of mine. I think alot of the reasons why parents get uptight when carers 'tell them about problems' is the way it is done. As a teacher and ex youth worker this is the kind of thing I would say to lead into that conversation.

Mrs X could we have a chat next week (arrange a time without kids around) to discuss how littleX is settling in?,
or
I like to give an update to paretns on the development/progress all of my charges are making so can we arrange half an hour to do that for littleX?

Alternativly you could do what one ex carer for DS did and say;
[with the TV on, in front of DS, while I was in a rush and trying to pack my school things.]
"He's a bit shyer and quieter than the other boys I've looked after, I think he is autistic"

oddly I didnt' react well.

Nally I get the impression that you are upset because the contract with you was broken without giving you a reason and you feel it all ended badly.

FWIW I have a CM and she will be taking and collecting ds from nursey when he starts. I would be astounded if the nursery and childminder did not talk about/discuss ds. It is madness to suggest otherwise, how could that work?. If someone is taking a child and picking them up and the parent is not then they would be the first person the nursery would ask for information or for clarification on something.

I would howevever want to be kept fully informed of any conversations. I would also make sure I kept in regular contact with the nursery (more so because I am unlikely to be there and so no as available just for a chat)

As for the OP - is your relationship with the mother very difficult? Is there any way you could call her and say you are missing 'x' and just wanted to know how he is. Maybe if you could end your relationship with this little boy and his mother in a more positive way you may feel better.

If you do this though, try and change your view of his mum before speaking to her. As others have said this must be a very difficult time for her and she needs support not to be made to feel like she 'ignored things'

Also if his mother is angry with you try and remember that much of it will be about her son's problems and that she will almost certainly be feeling guilty (what mother doesn't) that she wasn't there for him. Try not to take it personally.

I think its common for parents motivations to be misunderstood as well. For example we repeatedly refused to send our son to the autism unit- this was interpreted as us being deperate for him to be in mainstream (and therefore in denial etc etc). IN fact we refused the unit because we thought it was very unorganised and not very good. When an opportunity came up for a place at an SLD/PMLD school - ie for children far more severe than at the unit- we bit their hands off- couldn;t get him in fast enough- because its a good school.

What would really, really upset me is the nursery/school talking to the childminder instead of me. I would find that unacceptable about such a serious matter. Yes, tell the cm if she does pick up that little Sam wet himself or that he didn't eat any dinner or he seemed a bit tired or unwell, but if you have serious concerns call the parent and arrange a meeting.

I sent my borderline at 21 months ds3 to ds1 and ds2's old nursery because I knew they would be honest with me about his socialisation etc.

I hope there are lots of childminders like you, nurseyjo.

Message withdrawn

There is nothing wrong with childminders speaking to nurseries. There is a lot wrong with parents not being informed in a sensitive manner.

oh god yes we all know that- yabbering away behind parents backs like we're some sort of simpletons. A SALT who had never met me OR ds1 told the SENCO at ds1's school that I was well known for "being in denial" (erm this would be me who thought ds1 had autism over a year before he was diagnosed would it- I know where that came from and the instigator of that rumour is bloody dangerous- I have yet to find a parent who doesn't think that). Luckily for me the SENCO rang the nursery to ask if it was true, and they were able to tell them no. I couldn't complain as I wasn't meant to know.

I have found that once you get into dealing with people who really understand SN (such as ds1's special school) they start involving you in their conversations. It's much easier all round.

I agree, aloha. Usually by the undertrained and undersympathetic.

interesting katiemac

god it would annoy me though

Oh Scummy, I think it is completely normal for parents of children with special needs to get told it is their fault at various points along the way. Particularly if the child is somewhere on the autistic spectrum.

One of the first things I was asked to do on my last SN course (concerning a child with no diagnosis) was to discuss it with the nursery/school that the child aslo attended

This was to find out if the bahaviour was consistant or if it were just at my house

So - talking to nursery/school staff happens regularily - I am sorry if this upsets you all

dont apoigise aloha,this is an open forum,we all have differnet views.
anyway wheres nally??.....................leaving me ere to fight her battles!!!

Yes- am sure smee meant the earlier post!
I agree with coppertop re nally's language. It always astonishes me the way parents are pilloried and blamed for the way they respond to finding out about potential special needs.

I'm sorry if I had a go at you smee. As a mother with a young child who was unhappy with a childminder and at a preschool because of his special needs (and a LOT happier 'hidden away' at home with me ) do feel very cross at what I see as a lack of undestanding in the OP and in the behaviour of the preschool.

I would want a CM to discuss his/her concerns with me.

I would not want a nursery/pre-school to discuss their concerns with the CM. Not on something so serious. That is unacceptable.

I had concerns about ds1 from the age of 17 months. His nursery raised concerns with me when he was about 22 months. Following that I saw my HV and had him referred to SALT. My attitude was then that he had been referred, the HV was visiting him regularly and that we now had to play an awful waiting game. The nursery said I didn't seem to care that there was anything wrong with him, that I must be stopping him speaking by talking over him - when I said I wasn't they said I must be not talking to him then (he's 7 now and still can't speak, funnily enough his younger brothers can). At that pooint I suiggested they weren;t qualified to armchair analyse him (that went down well) I took him out after finding him sitting on a chair alone in a room with all the other children next door "because he likes it there". He never went back to that place again.

We spent some time at home, I read up a lot, employed some private SALTS and did some work with him. The idea that there is loads of help out there just waiting to be given to pre-school kids from the experts is laughable. My non verbal ds1 didn't get any hands on NHS SALT until he went to special school aged just short of 6. We saw a paediatrician who gave us a leaflet and had 1 hour a week portage- that was it. 90% of his early intervention came from me, from me paying 1000s to attend courses, to learn about his condition and buy in expertise. That continues although we are lucky that he now attends an excellent specail school (via 4 wasted terms in mainstream).

At 3 he started a different nursery that had been recommended to me, where staff worked hard with him, and we worked together to help him. No doubt the first nusery thought I was in denial l, but he actually got far more from me at home than he would have sat in a different room by himself.

The Mum may have heard (from the pre-school) that they spoke to you, and that may be why she removed him. Or maybe she is looking into a home programme, or maybe she needs some time to come to terms with it all.

i do!!! slow typing!!