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Original poster

URGENT PLEASE - which of you CM's MOVED HOUSE recently????

65 replies

looneytune · 29/09/2006 16:18

I was chatting to one of you recently about the stresses of moving house and you were just about to.

I need you ASAP - Ofsted causing me problems, just like they did you but I can't find the thread to remind me what you did about it!

HELP!!!

May be moving in 2½ weeks

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Original poster
looneytune · 14/10/2006 10:35

Wow Nannynick, been busy again haven't you I've got our buyer coming to measure up very soon so when she's left, I will read through all these updates I've got another letter to do to Ofsted this weekend about variation of numbers and am worried about my last email to them but there's nothing I can do!

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nannynick · 14/10/2006 01:10

The two leading insurers of Childminders have both got back to me quickly regarding the query.

I have more queries for one of the insurers so I am following that up... so it could be another few days until we get more info.

One thing they both did confirm was that the childminder should notify them of a change in address.

One didn't mention anything about the insurance not being valid during the move process, whereas the other said the insurance would become 'inactive' - I am following that one up to see if they will provide further information.

Interestingly, one insurer imposes an admin fee (for new documentation), the other didn't mention any fee.

ThePrisoner · 13/10/2006 21:47

Well I have read my insurance document (couldn't resist the challenge nannynick!) - throughout the document, it only refers to children being "in the care of" the childminder, and doesn't say anything about where.

nannynick · 12/10/2006 23:13

Have you wondered what happens if you move house and DON'T tell Ofsted?

Well, it's certainly something that has happend in the past - you can read about it in the following CM Inspection Report . The Outcome was: Notice Of Action To Improve. Ofsted DID NOT cancel the CM's registration.

With regard to Ofsted's letter:

The applications this excerpt is referring to is the CM1 application pack ( one of these is not necessary)

Not sure I fully agree that the excerpt is from that, but they are right that a CM1 is not required.

Ofsted asks that you do a risk assessment

If you phone them they might ask you to do that. But has that happened every time a childminder has told Ofsted they are moving house? What public document does Ofsted produce which gives guidance to childminders moving house, which mentions this risk assessment?

like the one you sent to us and there are certain criteria laid down which decides whether or not an inspection of your new premises is necessary

The criteria is found in:

Childcare registration and inspection legislative changes: March 2005 local authority briefing sessions presentation materials - prompt points for inspections

Not exactly the place you'd first look, is it?

The Childminder cannot mind from their new property until a certificate is received from Ofsted with the new address on it, as this would
otherwise negate their insurance.

Would it? Does your insurance terms state that your address must appear on your Ofsted registration certificate? Will need to contact the usual insurers to see what they say... my gut view is that they don't require the address. Could be wrong though. Anyone want to read through the fine print of the insurance documents?

Original poster
looneytune · 10/10/2006 16:13

It is but I still don't understand their reply?

OP posts:
HenniPenni · 10/10/2006 11:47

Wow, what a result!!, that should be a big weight of your mind!

Original poster
looneytune · 10/10/2006 10:58

Check this out, my reply from OFSTED..........

Thank you for your e-mail, regarding your house move and with regard to
the following excerpt - which I will now explain further to you.

The applications this excerpt is referring to is the CM1 application
pack ( one of these is not necessary) - Ofsted asks that you do a risk
assessment - like the one you sent to us and there are certain criteria
laid down which decides whether or not an inspection of your new
premises is necessary - usually this is because a complaint that has
been made against a childminder since the last inspection or there have
been actions made against the property previously ( normally this is
because of health and safety issues) and if the only visit a childminder
has ever received is a registration visit.
The Childminder cannot mind from their new property until a certificate
is received from Ofsted with the new address on it, as this would
otherwise negate their insurance.

As Ofsted is here to ensure the safety of the children in childminders
care you will appreciate that certain criteria has to be met.

Having checked through your letter it meets the criteria and a new
certificate is on its way to you - and you should receive it in the next
day or so.
With regard

Sharon
Ist Team Supervisor

OP posts:
Original poster
looneytune · 09/10/2006 07:52

Thanks Nannynick

TP

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ThePrisoner · 08/10/2006 22:53

Shall we take bets on whether Ofsted actually know that they have produced these leaflets??! (Sorry, I think I had better crawl back into my box ...)

nannynick · 08/10/2006 08:26

Childminders (and anyone) has a right to complain about Ofsted Policy and Procedures. In addition, if Ofsted make a decision regarding your registration that you don't agree with, then you can take them to the Care Standards Tribunal who will decide the case.

Ofsted produce two leaflets which would apply in the current situation regarding complaining about Ofsted policy, procedures, communication and variation of registration.

Complaints About Ofsted Early Years
Building Better Childcare: Objections and Appeals

Original poster
looneytune · 08/10/2006 08:02

Thanks TP. Must say due to some people's reactions to my letter, I've been worried about how I worded my letter. Nothing I can do though so no point I suppose. Just hope they judge my variation request on that alone.

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ThePrisoner · 08/10/2006 00:31

looneytune - you have done nothing wrong, and your letter isn't rude. If you had moved and done something they had told you not to (even if they were wrong, but you didn't know it!!), then you'd have something to worry about.

I think you should follow up your email with another one, suggesting that perhaps they would like to go and sit on the naughty step (not that childminders use one), and think about what they've done. And they can apologise afterwards.

They will learn not to do it again.

nannypoppins · 07/10/2006 18:13

I moved house a year ago and as I understood it I had to inform Ofsted with 14 days of moving and do a risk assessment of the property myslf while I waited for an inspector to visit. As a network childminder I asked my development worker and she advised me. In the meantime I carried on childminding. In fact we moved in on the Friday, made sure all areas used for minding were safe and children came to me on Monday morning. Ofsted inspected 2 weeks later and my full inspection was almost due so I asked for a full inspection to save them coming back at a later date. I was graded good in all areas so all the hard work to get our new house up and running for minding was worth it.

nannynick · 07/10/2006 17:24

End of the day, as I said before, what are they going to do about it. Unless you are breaking a law, they can't do anything about it. If they feel you are breaking a law, then let them take it to court.

Original poster
looneytune · 07/10/2006 17:10

Oh dear. I've just had a really stressful week and have been really annoyed with them since all this started and just typed it as soon as I saw Nannynick's post. Maybe I should have calmed down first - oh well, not a lot I can do now!

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ThePrisoner · 07/10/2006 16:50

I think that it is strongly worded, but I also think that it had to be. I live in hope that Ofsted will take note of what you have said, and maybe they won't get it wrong with the next person. (And I am counting flying pigs as I type).

Original poster
looneytune · 07/10/2006 15:57

Ooops, my support minder thinks that was a bit strongly worded - do you think I can get into trouble for it?

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Original poster
looneytune · 07/10/2006 11:11

Oops, I was a bit mad at them and rushed it - just noticed I spelt involved wrong and put found instead of find.

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Original poster
looneytune · 07/10/2006 09:28

OMG - Nannynick, I could kiss you!!! What idiots they are!! I've just sent them an email:

Further to my email sent at 15.16 on 4th October 2006, with originals in the post the same day, can I please draw your attention to one of your recent publications regarding childminders moving house.

On YOUR website I came across publication HMI 2601a - Framework for the regulation of childminding and day care. Here is a link for your information www.ofsted.gov.uk/publications/index.cfm?fuseaction=pubs.displayfile&id=2800&type=doc

Please look at paragraph 24, which reads as follows:

Childminders do not have to make new or separate applications if they move house or wish to care for children from more than one domestic premise. However, they must tell Ofsted in writing of any changes to the addresses where they provide childminding or changes to the premises, in advance if possible, but in any case within 14 days of the change.

I am very disappointed with Ofsted as I made several phonecalls to your office because I was very sure I didn't have to have an inspection in order to re-commence childminding. My local Early Years Team also got envolved and contacted a manager at Ofsted.

Moving house is stressful enough as it is and it looks like I have spent unnecessary time putting together a document in order to satisfy Ofsted, have worried parents unnecessarily as they are currently unsure as to whether or not I can continue childminding, only to finally found a publication saying it is ok on your own website.

First thing on Monday, I will let parents know there is no problem and that I will be childminding a few days after my move.

Regards

I highlighted the paragraph in bold too!! It's really annoying that they don't know what they are doing. I was at childminder drop in on Tuesday and another lady there phoned them as moving house in near future and they told her no problem, just give us your new address once you've moved! I'm furious with them.

Anyway, thanks to you, it's sorted as far as I'm concerned

Sorry I've not been actively responding to your posts or emails, not intentional, just had an awful week with the house stuff and been away from my pc more than usual. Just cleared my inbox this morning and will look at your emails now!

Thanks

OP posts:
nannynick · 07/10/2006 07:55

I doubt that Ofsted staff have read HMI 2601a either. It was published very recently, but even so, this week they were still telling people enquiring that they would not be able to childmind.

I really feel that Ofsted need to publish a guide for childminders who are considering moving house... not only for childminders so they know the regulations, but also for their own staff. At least someone, somewhere in Ofsted knows the right information, as it appears in HMI 2601a. Pitty not everyone knows it.

Beaks · 07/10/2006 00:19

To nannynick-in answer to your question earlier-no they did not allow me to mind in the meantime. Fortunately this was not a problem as I had not started in my new area (hence the delay in writing to them). However when I rang them they did not mention the 14 day rule and funnily enough in the fun of moving house and schools I had not read HMI 2610a!!!Could possibly have avoided 2hour reinspection.

nannynick · 07/10/2006 00:05

Don't you just love Ofsted? Thought Not

But, they have recently published a document on their website, which contains a statement regarding childminders moving house.

HMI 2601a - Framework for the Regulation of Childminding and Day Care. Published 29 September 2006.

Paragraph 24:
Begin Quote
24. Childminders do not have to make new or separate applications if they move house or wish to care for children from more than one domestic
premise. However, they must tell Ofsted in writing of any changes to the addresses where they provide childminding or changes to the premises, in advance if possible, but in any case within 14 days of the change.
End Quote

StrawberryFULLMoonOWOWOWWWWWWW · 03/10/2006 19:13

try emailing ncma?

Original poster
looneytune · 03/10/2006 18:43

cheers nannynick. i keep trying the NCMA but due to very noisy children, especially when on the phone, i usually end up calling at a time when they are closed.

i have no toddler groups or anything whether the other 2 are at nursery tomorrow morning, so I will try when I just have baby.

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nannynick · 03/10/2006 18:40

Letter sounds fine to me. Hope it gets the desired result.

For anyone who is an NCMA member, please contact NCMA (regional or national) and try to get them to talk to Ofsted regarding this issue. As the voice of many Registered Childminders, I feel that NCMA should be sorting this sort of thing out, so that childminders know what the procedure is, should they move house and wish to continue childminding.