Dog and childminder - what to ask/expect?

Did they tell you this, or did you see it for yourself?

If so, I would go back for another visit before committing yourself. I mean, it's great if they really are different from your first impression, but you need to make sure they're not just saying that to get you through the door!

Sorry to be a dampner, but I think you need to see it for yourself and talk to the staff. Trust your instinct and take your DH with you for a second opinion.

Actually, I don't have a stairgate up. Heard of too many nasty accidents where someone has fallen down the stairs and hit the gate at the bottom. I do have a gate across the playroom to stop babies and young toddlers from accessing them, though.

Just saying, a lack of stairgate isn't necessarily a problem if the childminder has identified the risk and is dealing with it - that's why Ofsted no longer insist on them.

Agree with all the rest, though especially the dog having free access to the children.

She can sort of insist, as in "unless you provide a travel cot and stairgates etc I'm not going to use you". But you're right, it's not enforceable. And there would be no way of knowing that the dog wasn't in the house when she wasn't there to see.

the problem is Thurlow, op can't insist on any of these things, the cm is self employed and running her business as she sees fit. Personally, it doesn't sound good enough to me but the op can't actually request or put in force that she does anything because she is not employing her - and won't witness what she does with the dog during the day. just because the dog is in the garden at drop off/pick up, doesn't mean its there all day!

And unless op is willing to pay for stair gates/travel cots etc (all of which cm should have anyway) she can't insist on them... she just needs to take her business elsewhere.

She obviously doesn't realise/remember the vast difference between a 3yo and a new cruiser. If you are certain that you want her as a CM, I'd make a few things non-negotiable:

Childgates on the stairs and the kitchen/bathroom doors
Travel cot for the baby to sleep in upstairs (every CM I saw had babies sleeping in one of the bedrooms)
Bookcase bolted to the wall
Toilet lock
Possibly lagging etc around the hearth, though I suppose that one depends - we have a hearth and have never protected it (well, we did try once but DD ripped the rubber corners off and ate them...) but I would probably expect more from a CM

Also, as she's a bit crap on these things, I would ask to see the pushchair and car seat she would be using, and also her Ofsted report to confirm she can have babies, not just toddlers.

But the dog mixing with the children would still be an absolute dealbreaker. As others have said, a 1yo just won't understand enough to control themselves.

omg op - don't go there!

that is crazy - baby sleeping on sofa wedged in by coffee table and all the other things you have mentioned, no, no, no...

very surprised she hasn't set up any safety mesaures. ofsted would not allow this - i'm assuming she hasn't had an ofsted yet??

don't look at this through rose tinted glasses or with desperation - don't put your baby at risk - she sounds very unflexible - not segregating the dog is wrong too. Don't use her, there must be another option.

Where are you??

Another thought - are there any other CMs you can visit to just see what their set-up is like? Or maybe start another thread asking for the standards of safety that should be expected. I know what I think, but I only saw two other CMs before we met the right one, so I could be wrong!

From what you've described, I would expect the fireplace to at least have those little rubber corners on, the bookcase to be screwed to the wall, a gate on the bottom of the stairs, and probably change the coffee table for something safer - though I could be wrong on that one, maybe decent glass coffee tables are actually unbreakable?

Ok, that is a lot of things wrong with the house! Just picturing my CM's house, everything is gated, no open bookcases, the main room is definitely set up so that if the kids are on their own for a minute (lets be reasonable, the CM has to pee sometimes ) there is nothing dangerous. Your CM's living room sounds genuinely dangerous for looking after a group of children.

And I actually don't have words for the idea that an 8mo baby is going to be expected to sleep on the sofa I know plenty of older kids will nap for half an hour on the sofa, but a baby? No way. Travel cots don't cost much.

There's no way the baby or the dog can be responsible for their behaviour it is down to the adult to supervise.

It is basically up to whether you can talk to her and get assurances that she will keep the dog away from your baby and whether you trust those assurances.

A 3 year old is quite different to a baby. I still wouldn't leave them alone together but I think they could be trusted to have more interaction because the 3 year old can be explained to and understand how to interact with animals. It may be that she is willing to make different rules for your baby.

If you are starting off a CM relationship then trust and communication are really the most important things so if you are able to have a good discussion about it and come to a compromise it could bode well for the future.

The thing is toddlers and pre-schoolers don't always have the insight to realise that they are inflicting pain. Even with an adult in the room they can stick fingers in ears and eyes causing the dog to react to protect itself.

Everything you've said in your last post makes this even worse, she is new to cm and the dog is young. However 'nice' you think she is, it just isn't worth the risk.

Why not ask her if it were possible to segregate? Let her know it's a deal breaker.

I'd be much happier with older children and a dog. Babies/toddlers just don't have the language skills for you to explain to them, and could easily accidentally hurt or anger a dog.

I'd have no problem with a dog being around children as long as it's under responsible supervision.

I've had dogs the whole time my children have been alive, it's never been an issue.

I completely understand that you think she's a lovely childminder but I wouldn't put my toddler in her care.

When we adopted our dogs we had to go to training sessions. The trainer told us about two dogs she knew who had suddenly turned on children and had to be put down. They did post mortems on both dogs because their behaviour was so out of character. One had a couple of inches of pencil through its eardrum and the other had several staples in its back.

It isn't just about the nature of the dogs. It's just as much about what the children can do to hurt them. The trainer pointed out that the second dog had clearly put up with a lot if it didn't turn on the first or second staple. They can all turn if the right thing happens when the adult's back is turned.

I think this would be a dealbreaker for me too. I wouldn't be keen on a CM with a dog overall, but there are certain breads I would find more acceptable - and a JRT isn't one of them, sorry. They are ratters, their natural instinct would be to bite and shake and really hold one. MiL has a JRT and even though she dotes on her, the dog is away in another room when our toddler is there.

Obviously it is entirely down to you, everyone has different dealbreakers. The fact that the dog interacts so completely with the mindees would be a concern for me personally. A larger dog that was outside a lot, or in the kitchen behind a safety gate, for example, wouldn't be so bad. A small, nippy dog like a JRT, one that is generally considered to need a lot of training, has the ability to really snap.