childminder charging for bank holidays even though she won't work them?

I'm glad you are so impressed by my excellent practice!

Well done you for engaging in normal reasonable practice....

Is that better?

Surely that's normal reasonable practice?

'I read all the important point of a contract out to parents anyway to make sure they understand what they are signing and give them an opportunity to voice any concerns. I don't need to see something as a contentious issue to flag it up. I make my terms very explicit from the outset.'

Well done you

I read all the important point of a contract out to parents anyway to make sure they understand what they are signing and give them an opportunity to voice any concerns. I don't need to see something as a contentious issue to flag it up. I make my terms very explicit from the outset.

Clearly you would discuss whether holidays are paid or not so if you don't raise bank holidays in those discussions, don't include them in the childminder's agreed paid leave and are not going to be willing to work them you are highly likely to find some parents aren't happy.

I agree it would be best to flag this up, but I guess if it's a policy the childminder has used/is using successfully then for her it isn't a contentious issue. If she's had loads of complaints in the past she'd know it was unpopular and bring attention to it. If all the other parents are OK with it, how is she to know that the OP would a. not read the contract, b. find the relationship soured because of it?

OP it will only 'sour the relationship' for people who don't read the contract. Hopefully these parents are in the minority.

One could suggest that, knowing that this is a contentious issue between childminders and parents, the childminder also has a responsibility to be up-front about it and point the matter out to parents when discussing terms. Contracts can be lengthy and complicated and it wouldn't be too difficult for a parent to miss this by accident.

OP it will only 'sour the relationship' for people who don't read the contract. Hopefully these parents are in the minority.

If you read the contract before you sign it and send your children to the childminder there is no relationship to be soured. If it sours your feelings you find a different childminder before any relationship is formed. If it seems fair, you send your child there, knowing what will happen on a bank holiday and there is no need for you to feel sour when it happens.

Any 'souring' is due entirely to you not reading the contract.

Some cm charge for bh even though they dont work them.

I dont charge if not worked. If I did it would be a higher rate. I have not worked one as yet.

If someone chooses my service I offer them a good package. Each cm differs as our circumstances are not the same.

I suspect the OP is self-employed, as I am.

PERSONALLY I would prefer a higher hourly or daily rate but only to pay when the service is open. This is because I only earn when I work and therefore the calculations are far easier if I am only paying when I have the service.

BUT, i do appreciate that this isn't the case for the vast majority of people who are employed and either salaried or at least get paid holiday. So I see why CMs structure their fees as they do... but it's pretty tricky for self-employed people to work out - our income varies as it is but now we have to work out days we are earning when we pay childcare, days we are not earning and don't pay chilcare (we're looking after our own chlidren) and ALSO days when we ARE paying for childcare BUT cannot earn as the childcare provider is closed.

As I said though, I appreciate us S-E people are the minority.

Sometimes childminders charge for bank holidays and/or their own holidays because there is pressure from parents to keep hourly rates as low as possible. Imagine if there are a few childminders in the area charging for bank holidays and one who does not. The one who doesn't charge needs to build this into her hourly rate and parents will see her as being more expensive. Lots of parents simply call around and find the childminder with the lowest hourly rate. It can be a pretty difficult decision for each of us to make.

this comes up time and time again

i ALWAYS read everything i sign my name to-i dont get how so many parents sign a contract then bring something up in it months later

do you not read it properly before signing?

That's very true Llareggub many cm's I know can't afford to have time off which is sad, I'm lucky that I can save to cover mine.
I don't charge for bank holidays but I actually think the parents I mind for would pay me if I couldn't afford to take this unpaid as I don't feel it's the same kind of relationship you have with other se people such as plumbers etc, its a personal relationship built on trust and mutual respect.
And if something is written in a contract and signed and agreed then I don't see how that 'sours' a relationship.

The right to time off is part of health and safety legislation. Personally, I would prefer a CM who gets regular time off and if this means paying for BHs then this is fine by me.

Can you imagine how frazzled a CM would be if she didn't take any holidays because she couldn't afford to do so?

As I pointed out, most of those s/e professions work for a single client at a time. It's not easy to charge in a way that is fair to them all if you work for multiple clients at a time.
I care for several teachers' children. They miss nearly all the bank holidays because they're in holiday periods and their contracts are term-time only. They'd be pretty annoyed if I increased my hourly rate to cover a bank holiday they don't even benefit from.

You really have no excuse for complaint if it's in your contract and you signed up to it.
I hope you are more professional in your own business dealings! Have you read your contract(s) with your own client(s) properly?

My CM and I came to an agreement that I wouldn't pay for BH if she doesn't work them, I don't get paid extra if I work them and if I don't work them I usually have to move my days around and work a different day to make it up. Annual leave only stretches so far when you have to take time off for sick DC or school holidays.

Maybe you could speak to your CM?

When I was minding, I used to charge for bank holidays because I was available to work them and as I live near a large shopping centre and lots of my parents worked in retail, I was often busier than normal

If I didn't want to work bank hols I wouldn't have charged, I didn't charge for my holidays either

Obviously people need to read their contracts more carefully.

I charge for bank holidays and, although I would work if asked I have never been asked to work them so far and I've been minding for 13 years!

Most s/e people will have factored bank holidays etc. into their rates. When I worked as a contractor, I was advised to do this.

A childminder is in the somewhat unique position of working for a number of clients simultaneously. Would you consider it fair if your contracted days were not on bank holidays yet you were forced to pay for someone else's bank holiday through an enhanced rate? What about term-time only contracts?

It seems that the decision of whether or not to charge for bank holidays will always be controversial. Some charge; others don't. It's not cheeky or unfair so long as it's stated in the contract and you choose the childminder that best matches your needs.

If you objected so strongly, then why on earth did you sign up to it?

I think people need to realise that most self employed people have high enough hourly rates to cover the time they don't work. Look how much a plumber, accountant or physio charge. It's all included in the price that you pay anyway.
I have only just started minding on a Monday (I had another job until October) and up until now I have never had a problem. I even have had parents pay me for over Xmas without me asking for it. I have decided that I will not charge new parents for bank holidays but I will increase the daily rate to ensure that I am well covered for those days. Hey ho - I will probably actually make more money that way.

As a childminder myself I have only every charged for when I am available to care for children. Regardless of the terms of the NCMA contract, which I do use, I think charging for bank holidays is cheeky if you're not prepared to work them and doesn't help your relationship with the parents.

I know some people charge for their own holidays and maybe, if parents are agreeing to that, bank holidays could be included in the childminder's limited number of paid holiday days but that's as far as it should go and it should all be explained very clearly to the parents at the beginning of the relationship.

Nurseries do this???
I only need 2 days a week nursery but if they charge for bank hols when they're shut there's no way in taking a Monday!
(I am also se and only paid the days I work)

Its pretty standard at nurseries as well.