Newborn (ish) and Toddler, Nanny reluctant to leave the house

Oh and I'm sure there are more accidents in the home, but a) when you think how much time you spend at home v at playgroup you can see why, b) she's not at home, she's on a playdate which means there is another adult there to help her watch the toddler while she feeds the baby.

You are the employer so you have the right to tell your nanny what you want her to do.

It is completely do-able to have a small baby and toddler out in the morning for a few hours then come home for the 11.00 feed or even do the 11.00 feed whilst out.

Can you find a few morning activities locally (playgroups, music classes etc) and be clear that you expect her to attend them.

It will be a difficult conversation but I think you need to have it sooner rather than later!

I don't think it's an ordeal. I think when a 'generally excellent nanny' encounters a problem, she should be helped to overcome it not criticised and told to find a new job. I know loads of nannies and every single one of them is human, which means they are not perfect, they make mistakes, they lack confidence in specific areas, they have things to learn etc.

If this was on the teaching board 'NQT struggling', the responses would be 'oh I struggled when i first started', 'we all have areas we need to improve on', 'maybe try this/that' NOT 'It's weird', 'buck your ideas up' etc.

I don't get why some nannies are so critical and unsupportive of other nannies Flisspaps, that's my issue. I don't disagree that the nanny needs to deal with the problem and take the baby and the toddler out. I think NannyNick and Lechat and Karo and others have offered some helpful advice. I think other posters have been unnecessarily harsh and unhelpful.

obv all nannies earn and gain experience and I do have a lot as been a nanny a long time, but in my first job when i was 18 i had a baby and an older sibling and i managed to get out and feed, and yes that baby was colicky and took a long time to take that bottle - but i coped - infact more then coped, and that was my first job so without having experience

and if i didnt think i could then i would have said something to the mum and discussed my concerns - so i dont think im being uncompassionate when op said that her nanny had lots of experience just not with babies this young

op herself said she was getting concerned - and asked if was being unreasonable - personally no i dont think she is

a nanny with experience should be able to look after a baby and a toddler - if she isnt, or feels that she cant cope, then she needs to tell the op now, and worst scenario maybe hand her notice in :( as op goes back to work in 2mths things need to be sorted out now or op is not going to be comfortable in going back to work if she is worrying how her children are

yes maybe by having a gentle approach/talking about nannys concerns may help, but if they dont then what happens - as i said i hope things work out

if the nanny doesnt want to be away from home for the 11am feed, then she needs to sort out going out in the am for the older childs benefit - its not fair to op's oldest child to be in the house all the time - so even if walk/feed the ducks/park if nice - or a music class/m&t/soft play area/trip to library etc if too cold and back by 11am

perhaps have a look on netmums for local M&T - there seems to be one every day in the morning in my area - and most start 9/930 after school drop off

at the moment op says she isnt even doing that 'refuses to go out' and thats not right

I would expect her to be able to go out for walks with both baby and toddler. I would expect her to start planning how she was going to meet needs of baby and toddler. Tbh I don't see the difference in terms of outings between a baby of six months and a baby of four months. They are portable in sling or car seat. No it isn't easy but surely this is part of the job?? I would be a bit peeved if I was paying for a nanny who stayed at home all day. I think you are either the sort of person who gets on with things or you aren't. I would be a bit worried that she isn't this kind of person. Maybe she simply doesn't like going out to activities? I once had a childminder who never went to any activities with my little one and I worked out in the end it was because she was very reserved and preferred to stay at home as this suited her personality. I would discuss the going out with her and make it clear exactly what you would like her to do with the toddler each day. Then you can discuss how she can make that happen. I would be quite direct about this. Does she have access to a car? This would make it easier as it is then say to make a quick return if baby is unsettled.

I thought the majority of accidents took place in a home, not toddler groups, playgroups and the like? Besides, feeding the baby doesn't render the nanny unable to get up to attend to the toddler or stop her running out of an open door. Parents who have no training or experience manage.

I don't get why you think it must be such an ordeal for the nanny to cope with doing the job she is paid to do Outraged?

'No. I really don't think it is easier at all. It's not even an issue in my mind, as in I wouldn't think of the pros/cons of either as they it's the same to me. '

You should probably go on a health and safety course then because no way is a child in playgroup/park/music group as safe as they are in the home of a friend. I just asked DC1 (she's 8) why and she said 'erm....coz what if someone leaves the door open at the playgroup and the toddler runs out'. So there is one reason for you. I could ask the 6 year old and 5 year old for ideas if you need them?

'Also, as a side note, if I wasn't sure that I could do a job with a young baby and toddler, then I wouldn't take a job with a young baby and toddler'

From what I understand she took the job with just the toddler and the OP has since had another baby. You're very lucky to be 'sure' you can do something before you've tried it. Most people need to try something before they're 'sure' how good they'll be at it.

'As Blondes says, I hope that she asks for help and is honest about things that worry her/she finds daunting and that it all works out in the end'

I hope so to. I hope if she asks other nannies they're slightly more understanding than some of the nannies here. If she confesses she's a bit unsure/lacking in confidence I hope they don't say
'buck up your ideas or find a new job'
or
'It is weird'
or'Any nanny worth her salt should be able to cope with feeding a baby and toddler' ' if I wasn't sure that I could do a job with a young baby and toddler, then I wouldn't take a job with a young baby and toddler'

She's probably just a bit daunted, it's one of those things when she's done it a few times she'll be fine.

I'd second the asking her which activity she'd like to do on a Monday/Thursday and then usher her out on those days to do the activities. Most music groups only last 30 minutes so she can easily get back for 11am. Your LO will be on a faster teat soon anyway so feeding will hopefully be easier.

I know you shouldn't have to, but maybe going out with her a couple of times just so she can see she's capable of doing it may work.

As blondes says she should be able to feed a baby at look after a toddler at music group. How will she ever learn as she goes along if she hasn't tried it?
She is a nanny so she should be good with children.

'If a mum who has no exp before having her own thinks she can cope - then I hope her nanny can as that is her chosen career'

She probably can cope, maybe she just needs a bit of confidence. The OP says she is 'generally an excellent nanny', so she's having a slight problem with managing a very young baby and a toddler and your response is 'honestly i would tell your nanny to buck her ideas up or find a new job', how compassionate!

As Blondes says, I hope that she asks for help and is honest about things that worry her/she finds daunting and that it all works out in the end.

Also, as a side note, if I wasn't sure that I could do a job with a young baby and toddler, then I wouldn't take a job with a young baby and toddler. At least not a sole charge one anyway.

No. I really don't think it is easier at all. It's not even an issue in my mind, as in I wouldn't think of the pros/cons of either as they it's the same to me.

I did say maybe its the social aspect that worries her. Tbh, if she does feel she lacks experience in caring for a 4 month old, then maybe she should be honest about this and ask for help/pointers and also, talk about situations that she feels nervous in. No one expects her to have "experience from the womb" at all but the way you learn when you don't know is by being honest and asking for help.

I'm going by what the op said and if it was her she would bite the bullet and go out.

If a mum who has no exp before having her own thinks she can cope - then I hope her nanny can as that is her chosen career

Lets hope the nanny gains confidence in 2mths

I'm all up for giving support and hope all works out and feeding gets easier

Bit of both re. routines Hecate.

I cannot believe that anyone who has experience looking after young children doesn't understand why it's easier to feed a baby at a friend's home than at a playgroup/music class.

The OP has already said the nanny doesn't have experience with a baby this young, she's learning, give her a chance! Did you emerge from the uterus with childcare skills Blondes or did you have to learn at some point to? Maybe bear in mind that not all nannies have the same level of experience as you. She may be unsure about feeding a fussy 4 month old whilst ensuring the safety of a toddler. I completely agree needs to learn, she needs to take the toddler out as the OP wants, but how about some suggestions on how to support her rather than criticism and 'buck up your ideas'!

You've got to love how supportive the nanny community is

Shouldnt she be following your instructions on things like routine and activities?
Forgive me, I have no experience of nannies beyond mary bloody poppins and so don't know if they decide routines and rules or follow those of the employer.

Thanks www. Any nanny worth her salt should be able to cope with feeding a baby and toddler - and esp inside with other mums or childcarers

If your nanny isn't capable of looking after 2 children and doing simple fun activities then if I were op I would be worrying about what happens when she goes back to work in 2mths

Yes although some pools allow a buggy or car seat on the poolside so whilst baby sleeps you can take the toddler whilst keeping an eye on baby (I did this with my DC but best check with the mother first as not everyone will go for this arrangement)

I'd agree with lots of the above, perhaps with the exception of swimming as many pools don't allow more than one child per adult for obvious reasons.

Agree with Blondes actually. It is weird. Part of being a decent nanny is being able to hit the ground running and I don't think giving a bottle at a playgroup or class is actually that difficult. On a train/bus maybe, but inside, with other understanding parents/carers, not that difficult.

I think she might worry about what people think of her trying to settle etc if baby is refusing to feed though, maybe it is the social aspect she has an issue with?

I would do some research & present her with a list of organised activities & outings and make sure you expect at least one outing a day. I have one I've put my list on my iPhone & it's invaluable - in the morning I look at what children I'm minding & taking into account their ages choose an activity. Eg Monday
Morning:9:30-10 rhyme time at the library / 10-11am play group at village hall / 9:30-11am soft play at the leisure centre / 10-11am sensory baby group at children's centre
Afternoon: 2-3pm messy play at church hall / 1:30-3pm toddler disco at children's centre.
Anytime activities: bus rides to the library (include bus times) / farm visit / woodland walk / playground / steam train rides / soft play / duck feeding at the lake etc

Make sure she has pocket money so she isn't paying & has a mobile on her & knows to pack snack etc but I definitely think this needs spelling out to her.

Could a routine be created whereby there is an outing every morning to somewhere? Is youngest old enough to go swimming? At 4 months, presuming health ok, I would have thought going swimming would be fine. Pools can often open early (6am sometimes) and can be quiet at 8:30-9:30 as other children are doing school runs with older siblings.

Babies like going for a walk, is there any issue with the practical side of things? Do you have a sling that nanny can wear (I find those best for young babies), which then frees nannies hands for walking with toddler, pushing buggy etc. do they know walking routes in the area that are suitable. I find routes with a cafe at the half way point useful, especially if they have baby change facilities, as it is a place to warm up if it is cold, a place to change nappy, a place to sit and feed baby.

Are there toddler groups that welcome parents/carers with babies? A general toddler group may well be better than a structured activity which I find tend to be aimed at a particular age group. Nanny does not need to stay for the full duration of the toddler group, they tend to be drop-in groups so can leave early, arrive late.

It's not weird! It's perfectly understandable that it's easier to feed a baby at someone's house than at a playgroup or during a music class!! For very obvious reasons.

so your nanny seems happy to fed baby their bottle at a friends house but not out at say music/m&t etc - weird

honestly i would tell your nanny to buck her ideas up or find a new job

its important for your eldest routine/day to day to be the same and if she went out before, then she needs to go and at the moment she is being unfair to her