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Original poster

Terms and conditions for self-employed nanny

38 replies

nannyquery · 28/12/2010 11:00

I've been using a local self employed nanny on an ad hoc basis, but am now going to use her more regularly so need to sort out terms and conditions. She has said she wants:
5 weeks paid annual leave
2 weeks paid sick leave (which she is very likely to use as she likes to attend appointments with her husband who has a chronic health condition)
Half pay as a retainer for all school holidays when she won't be needed.

This seems rather a lot - she'll basically be being paid either full or half wages fro 20 weeks of the year while not working.
I was going to suggest that if she has holidays as a retainer she should take her annual leave during this time. Just to give you a full picture she gets £9 an hour for looking after 2 children and as she is self employed she can (and sometimes does) look after other children att he same time as long as she's within the limits of her nanny insurance.

Another issue is she has been talking of getting ofsted registered for months but hasn't done anything about it. This is loosing me £50 a month as I can't use vouchers so was wondering if I could say I would provide a further 2 weeks leave if she got registered?
Anyway, could anyone suggest what is reasonable? I don't want to be unfair, but this seems a bit one-sided.

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Blondeshavemorefun · 28/12/2010 13:52

I have checked - apparently it remains legal for a small number of older nannies to be self employed (she is registered as such). She is not operating illegally (and I would certainly not employ her if I thought she did). I am therefore no more liable for her than if she were a childminder (which is to some extent more what she is)

Checked where? As nannynick said a link verification would be fab

Wonder how old you would need to be?

She is not a cm as cm's are registered and work from their own premises not yours

Tax companys do all the paperwork and can cost £100 upwards if that is all that is bothering you from employing her :)

arentfanny · 28/12/2010 13:42

If she is self employed then she only gets paid for the days she works, like the rest of us self employed people.

nannynick · 28/12/2010 13:40

I have checked - apparently it remains legal for a small number of older nannies to be self employed

A link please. That is the sort of gem that people would love to find.

Do check with a status officer... while they may take the approach of looking at the general picture of persons jobs in total, if they are mostly only working for a couple of people employment status well be done on a per-job basis.

They may decide that it is up to her but the contract she is proposing sounds to me as though she is wanting benefits of being employed, whilst also having the benefits of being self employed.

Original poster
nannyquery · 28/12/2010 12:20

Thanks for the feedback. I have checked - apparently it remains legal for a small number of older nannies to be self employed (she is registered as such). She is not operating illegally (and I would certainly not employ her if I thought she did). I am therefore no more liable for her than if she were a childminder (which is to some extent more what she is).
I'm not sure what to do about it really - she gets on well with the kids and we have very little choice round here WRT childcare (no registered childminders). I'm very reluctuant to formally employ a nanny as have no experience of all the legal / tax / NI etc that (quite rightly) we need to sort out, and DH's job is not secure at the moment so we would quite likely need to make her redundant quite soon - it seems very unfair to recruit someone on this basis as she may miss out on other jobs, and using someone self employed feels a bit better.
Think I will clarify her status again and ring the tax office to check, and then negotiate terms and conditions.

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Blondeshavemorefun · 28/12/2010 12:10

She is self employed - I will not be employing her. I realise this is unusual but she has been doing this for years (is in 50s) and as she started before a certain date the tax office accept this

if you are using her regually and you are deciding her days and hours then you are employing her

YOU will be the one who the tax office will be after and YOU will be the one who pays the £3k fine if found guilty of tax evasion

she may have been doing this for years, but doesnt make it legal

as a se person, she will not be entitled to sick pay or holidays - but again as a se person she can make up her contract, just as cm do, and up to you if you agree to her terms

which btw as se, what she is asking for is toally over the top

rubyslippers · 28/12/2010 12:01

She basically wants 7 weeks leave (include the sick leave which isn't really for her)

Plus a retainer

As you say, she is being paid for not working

I would use a different nanny or a CM

Original poster
nannyquery · 28/12/2010 11:57

Yes, Ruby - this is my thought. However, I have yet to have a conversation with her to see if she can be a bit more flexible (havn't agreed to anything yet).

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Original poster
nannyquery · 28/12/2010 11:54

She doesn't look after more than two families. I don't mind her looking after other children as long as I know (I usually know the families).

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rubyslippers · 28/12/2010 11:53

She sounds really inflexible tbh

Original poster
nannyquery · 28/12/2010 11:51

She is self employed - I will not be employing her. I realise this is unusual but she has been doing this for years (is in 50s) and as she started before a certain date the tax office accept this.

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Blondeshavemorefun · 28/12/2010 11:42

why do you want to employ her?

if you employ a nanny you state the terms - to a certain extend i state what i want, sick pay, and if family wont agree i wont work for them

if you employ her she is legally entitled to 28days pro rota holiday a year

sounds like you would be better off employing a term only nanny - no point employing a full time one if you wonr ever use them during holidays

is she looking after other children at your home? surely she would need your consent to this, and if more than 2 familys at same time, then she is breaking the law and is behaving as a cm is - and cm work from their own home - not someone elses

if you need her to be registered then set a date and if not done by that time, or no proof nearly registered, then you need to terminate the agreement

rubyslippers · 28/12/2010 11:41

Why should she get sick pay to use when her hsuband is going for appointments?

Sorry if that sounds harsh, but this is not usual

I think it seems very weighted in her favour

Are you going to issue a contract and pay her tax and NI?

I give my nanny 4 weeks paid holiday, plus all bank holidays in addition

She also has to take 2 of those weeks at our request

She gets sick pay in addition to statutory (2 weeks at full pay, 2 weeks half pay)

Original poster
nannyquery · 28/12/2010 11:37

any thoughts?

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