Help!Nannyshare wages with nanny with her own child????

Good to hear that you have decided against this one.

As you say, concentrate on becoming a registered childminder... hope you can find a suitable place to live which enables you to childmind.

Regarding if you should charge the families the same price. No. I do a nannyshare 3 days a week with 2 kids and 2 days I only have one child, I charge less on those days. The share is not full time, only part, you can't ask parents to pay the nannyshare rate on those days when you have only one child. This is if you agree at the beginning and it is in your contract.

If one of the families decide not to bring their child on a nannyshare day than they still have to pay you, that's completely different as it is their choice to keep the child at home, you're available to work.

In London you get appr. £10-£12 net an hour for nannyshare but this is without having your own child. When taking your own child to work than you should ask appr. 20% less so should be between £8-£9.6 (net) depending on experience and qualification. I can't say gross as we don't know how they split your tax code and some of the days you'd only have one child from the share meaning that they might receive a bigger percentage of your tax allowance. For one child and your own child I would expect £7.2 (but I have level 4 qualific and 6 years of experience of doing nannyshares with 3 children).

You would be employed by them but I would offer also to contribute towards food (as your child will eat there as well), nappies, etc.

I do a nannyshare with 2 children (soon 3 as baby brother of one of the children will join the share too) and I am Ofsted registered (volunterary).

You've been given somw great advice by nannynick, you'd do well to follow it.

The reality is even as a childminder you will have to fit around the parents, the red tape is unbelievable. You have to register as a food premisis if you want to provide bottles or meals.

You should charge both families the same, I never had a job where the wage was based on number of children. I understand you wanting to charge slightly less as you are taking your child with you but don't under sell yourself.

I would be more worried about the complications of a job share, holidays, when your child is unwell. If one family wants to swap days. You need to set very firm boundries for both families and make sure you get holiday pay etc sorted out too.

You would need to carry on as a nanny.

A nanny in London doing a share I expect is on £12 an hour Gross, £10 an hour gross when not in a share. Though of course the salary could be higher/lower based on experience and other factors.

I don't work in London, so don't know local rates... ask local nannies what they get.

Olingo - see link given earlier.
It says "where a person makes the provision"
So nothing to do with employment status or things like that.

MrA, just rereading your question...
No if the person providing care was considered to be Family 2 and they provided the care in their home, instead of in the home of Family 1, then it would not be exempt.

An important factor is where the care takes place.

If the care takes place in the carers home, then it will not be exempt. It is only exempt if the care is provided in the looked after child's home.

This is why nannies can't take children back to their [the nannies] home for 2 hours+

NN- Does the legislation re. 2 or 3 families mention the word 'employment' or 'working for' 'cos maybe that would be clearer I suppose, or does it just say 'provide care'?

Yes, if the carer provides care for children of Family 1 and Family 2 in either Family 1 or Family 2 home, then it is exempt from Childminder registration.
No mention in legislation with regard to the childcarer having children of their own. Thus I consider the exemption would apply in this case and childminder registration is NOT required.

Julinka - It is not sensible to be a Childminder and operate from property which you do not live in yourself.

Use the exemptions available to make yourself a Nanny, whilst you find your own home from which you can childmind. Once caring for children at your home you can then take on more children up to your registration limit.

Your last family took advantage, I am wondering if these two families are also trying it on... they want you to be a Childminder don't they - is this their idea?

doesn't self employment also mean negotiation of holiday pay as you are not automatically entitled to it and also no sick pay/maternity pay as such?

It would also surely be tempting to take on more children as you've gone through all the registering hassle and could make more money by doing so. Obviously not really an option in someone else's home.

And what a faff with all the paperwork re. tax and ofsted. would family pay for your time to do all that? if they can afford it families often want nanny vs. childminder as its less hassly/more accommodating for everyone...

there really should be an easier, more fit for purpose system but ???

I can't help with your nannying question, I'm afraid, but would just like to say that you only need to put one question mark after writing a question. All this business ???? does you no favours.

The childminder thing is a red herring here. You will not be a childminder, you will be employed to look after children from two families (mainly) in the homes of the families which is exempt childcare i.e. a nanny.

Nick by your reading, a childminder with charges from only one family (Family 1) plus her own children (Family 2) looked after in her own home (home of Family 2) would be exempt from registration!

I think that will be a very big hassle. Childminders on here often comment about how Ofsted want their homes more like nurseries - paper towels, no smoking signs, child level coat hooks etc. Plus it can take many months to become registered.
Please do not try to go down that route, while it is legally possible the systems are not designed to enable it to happen, there will be problems.

Could you not rent somewhere bigger, register that for childminding, then care for 5 under 8's plus some over 8s.

As a registered childminder you would be working from your own home and not the home of the children you will be looking after. As a registered childminder you would be self employed. For the type of job as a nanny that you are describing you will not be able to be self employed, you will be employed.

The Voluntary Nanny Registration (think it's called a home childcarer), as you say, is of benefit for the employer and as suc they would usually bear the cost of the registration. You may find that your potential employers will require you to register so that they can use childcare vouchers.

Childcare insurers provide cover for Childminders and Nannies, so they should be able to adapt a policy to suit the situation.

One limit they often impose is the total number of children.

In the event of a large claim I expect insurance companies will argue over a lot of things.
As long as the situation is explained to the insurer prior to cover commencing, then the insurer is aware of the situation - they can then charge for policy based on that information / risk level.
Best to write to insurer making them aware of anything significant that may affect risk... they can then decide to provide cover or not.

Could a nanny insurance company argue their policy was invalid if the OP (legally/in their view) needed to be registered as a childminder due to these circumstances, does any one know?

Maybe a different way to look at it is to work out what premium the share days should have... so should it be 10% more, 20% more etc?

Everyone involved in the share needs to come to an agreement on the pay structure... so do whatever works for everyone.

"but if one family in that share decides not to use the nanny on a particular day, does that mean the salary should drop?"

In this sort of senario, no the nanny should not get less in her wages. This is something that must be pointed out to the employers at the outset, so that they are clear about how the pay structure works. But, if the share starts off as I've outlined above , then a lower rate for the one family only days would be appropriate.

In the application guidance for Oftsed it says ' You should apply as Childminder if you are caring for more than two families wholly or mainly in the home of a child in your care. This is because the law says that people who do this come under the category of childminder if they care for children from three families together'

However, one of my nanny friends works for two families plus brings her own DS with her and Ofsted haven't complained as yet. I think when it says 'three families' it only refers to paying families and not your own child. Or it could be they weren't paying attention when processing her application and haven't realised yet!

but if one family in that share decides not to use the nanny on a particular day, does that mean the salary should drop?

This is what my friend does with her nanny share plus own child. I think it is only when you bring your own child as well. They work it out that a nanny would be paid X amount and split that between 3 i.e. parent1, parent2 and the nanny.

I'm not making a judgement on whether this is the correct way to go about it, just informing you of what they do! I suppose it's up to the individual nanny and families to come to an arrangement that works for them.