Caesarians are bad - Michel Odent now

To be fair, I don't think anybody makes you feel a failure - when I was told I would have to have a section for dd1 everybody was very matter-of-fact, it's the best thing to do kind of thing, but I still burst into tears and felt bereft - that came from within. (I cheered up after she arrived though and never felt I had to apologise.)

too, sorry.

Thanks for pointing that article out Dinosaur - I so agree with her about how we fetishise birth to a ridiculous extent nowadays. Was so glad to read on your other thread that your scare was just a false alarm and that baby dinosaur is safe and well btw. Hope your placenta moves out the way to

Did you see that there was a really good article in G2 today - pointing out that Caesareans save lives - mothers and babies - it is called "Too realistic to push"

This is all I know on the matter ...
Was in labour for 3 days with DS (ended in emergency c/s) ... therefore lots of oxitocin I expect ... did not bond with him ...
No labour with DD ... (failed induction ending in c/s) ... bonded with her within a nano second of her arrival ...
So .. what's that all about ...
Very impressed with Pupuce's brave fight (I wondered where you were when this thread started!) but I do not agree with this vaginal birth = happy child vs c/section = unhappy child ... I just can't agree with it because as both of my children were delivered by c/s then they are doomed aren't they?

Oh ... and,
'Note to Self: Remind 7 week old DD when she is bigger that she can't be a midwife when she grows up as she was born by caesarean section .... '
I mean, WHAT'S THAT ALL ABOUT??

i work in a field known as biomaterials, i'm researching a cement for gluing bones together and can also be used to fill holes in bone.

Offtopic, but hey Mears, how are you? Feeling any better?

Oh me too, you're not alone by any means as you'll have seen on here already. What field are you in?

sorry should say damaged in the long run

glad someone agrees with me on the science front - good research is important but bad research is very damaging fro those of us who produce good stuff - often it's only the bad and dangerously contraversal work that gets in the public eye and hence continues to get funding, whilst other very important work gets passed by the wayside for frankly unuseful work like this. I mean having been faced with the choice of either using a synthetic hormone or not having a healthy baby, there was no choice. I felt quilty afterwards and felt like i wasn't a proper mum 'cause i needed help. To have someone says that this might have damaged my child in th longer adds to the guilt already present.

sorry about the rant but bad science makes me cross!!

I just looked him up on Pubmed, you're quite right katzguk. He has published lots of opinion pieces in the Lancet, of one page. I could only find one actual paper, as opposed to a comment. Comments in the Lancet are very rarely peer-reviewed, and certainly weren't peer reviewed at all until a few years ago.

You're not alone Pupuce.
I have read quite a bit of his stuff - very impressive and convincing.

Message withdrawn

i've only just started first job after finishing my PhD..enjoying it at the moment

Could well be why I left

too true, if i want to get on in science then i have to publish, basically you are only as good as your last paper

It's a publish or die world out there, so you would think so , wouldn't you?

i'm not saying that he isn't a fanstatic OB/GYN but that still doesn't make him the world'sleadin authority on c-sections, if he had more data worth publishing then i'd have thought he'd have published it!!!

My understanding was that Odent is a respected OB/GYN, and not a sociologist. I was a good neurohistologist, but I wouldn't expect people to take me seriously in the field of Geology, if I poetulated that volanos were caused by by a depletion in glial cells in the lateral hypothalamus.

if anyone would like a copy of that paper then email me and i can send it to you, can't give you link cause you need to be from a uni to get them.

Can i just add an additional note, the paper was oublish 3 years ago and has never been cited but anyone else...so thats says a lot about what the science community make of it

that will be why then i had no natural oxycotin during labour

Katzguts, it is only pink if you haven't had enough oxytocin during delivery

Postulating half baked thoeries that not having gone into labour will lead to your child being violent, and that isn't supposed to make women feel guilty??

And I think that his points extending animal delivery techniques to humans leaves a lot to be desired. Rats may give birth alone, but often eat their young if disturbed. This seldom, if ever, happens in humans.

The ways in which humans bond with their offspring are so much more compex than seen in animals. We have compex lingustic programming, areas of our brains are devoted only to the recognition of faces. This is a coplex, multi factoral issuue and he seems to be a one trick pony.

have to hold my hands up and apoligise have now found one article from him an birth physiology, have to conceed it is well written, but one paper doesn't make it gospel truth, a bit like the one paper written by Wakefield on MMR, look what caos that caused

Pupuce,
the post-delivery hamorrhage stats are the same if you have a section or vag delivery.

Both birth options have their advantages and disadvantages - section is MY choice and it's best for me. Vag delivery is a choice that other women make 'cos it's best for them. I would NEVER criticise another women for her choice so why am I getting the impression that you're shouting down my choice? No you're not scaring me, you're just adopting that patronising, 'vag is best' tone, without listening to what I want.

And I though that listening, supporting etc were what this site was all about.......

I thought this was interesting. It's a very detailed look at the risks of Caesarean sections. This is all on my mind at the moment as my scan on Friday showed that the placenta was low (although obviously as I am only 21 weeks it may move up).