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Baby names

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Would it be weird to use the middle name

88 replies

Marshmallowtoastie · 06/01/2024 20:21

I’d like to name my baby a fairly common first name and a middle name from our culture, then we would use the middle name day to day and always introduce them by the middle name.
Do you think I could ask the school or other places to use the middle name as well? I’m worried it will be confusing, but I like that they have the option when applying for jobs or go to new places when they are older that they will have the option of a British sounding name, as we’ve experienced issues ourselves due to our names.

OP posts:
Are your children’s vaccines up to date?
falalalalalalalallama · 07/01/2024 13:56

Marshmallowtoastie · 07/01/2024 09:58

There’s a lot of evidence that when applying for jobs, names can prevent things like getting interviews or being offered the job. With the option of an English name we prevent that. They can still introduce themselves as their middle name if they’d like once they started but at least for application they don’t have the issues.
there are lots of other times when names can lead to racism and discrimination too, and at least they can avoid this when they want/need to. That’s what I was thinking.
even day to day as an adult I have gone places and just known it was going to be a problem as soon as I told them my name, and I knew the attitude towards me would shift. At least dc could give the British name in that case.

It’s interesting to hear from the people who go by their middle name, I’m interested that they say it’s a complete nightmare. It sounds like primarily the issue is that people call them the wrong name and it leads to some issues. Perhaps if you were happy with the first name and used to responding occasionally to the first name, would that have eliminated that problem?

The evidence for this is really strong.

I think your idea is a good one.

The "hassle" of losing opportunities due to bias (unconscious or otherwise) is something I'd prefer to avoid for my DC over the possible "hassle" of using a middle name.

I'm all for not losing our cultural roots though, for those of us who aren't wholly English by heritage - if our DC don't have names from our culture at all, those names will die out.

Incidentally, there's a tradition in Wales for people to be known by their middle name and for their first name to be kept for "Sunday best" - so it's not even uncommon on these isles (even if many of the English are unaware of it).

https://www.walesonline.co.uk/lifestyle/fun-stuff/people-sharing-unique-thing-what-27992968

People are sharing a unique thing about what Welsh people do with their names

'I'm known as Amelia and had no idea it was my middle name until I saw my birth certificate'

https://www.walesonline.co.uk/lifestyle/fun-stuff/people-sharing-unique-thing-what-27992968

Marshmallowtoastie · 07/01/2024 13:49

wombats78 · 07/01/2024 13:23

But it's not your name...

Your name is the one you are called by for the entirety of your childhood, then suddenly you have to use this other name for official things. It can cost you too, if you forget, eg flight tickets.

It doesn't sound like you understand how awkward this is & want to fix your other issue of wanting a western name for your dc.

Fair enough but you were told...

I don’t understand. Hence me asking and trying to understand and weigh up the issues of both options.

OP posts:
Marshmallowtoastie · 07/01/2024 13:47

I've always been known by my middle name and it's been a faff on, always telling teachers that I use my middle name. Like others have said I have to remember that in medical settings it will be my first name that they'll use.
Thanks I think this is what I’m trying to understand, since dc will have a faff anyway, either explaining the name they want to go by, accepting the British name, and/or trying to explain their first name. Both dh and I have names from this culture and lots of people get annoyed, they are racist, they refuse to try, they make rude comments, and even people that are being polite just panic when they see the names.

The one we like is phonetic, all the sounds are known in English, it isn’t that difficult, but that’s the same for our names and people just react badly to a name they don’t recognise. So I suppose I’m trying to weigh up what is more of a faff.

OP posts:
Marshmallowtoastie · 07/01/2024 13:42

upsidedownheturnsme · 06/01/2024 21:55

My foster son has a non-English name. It's proved impossible for strangers as it's spelt very differently to how it's pronounced. People who know us take the time to get it right but others don't.

He got fed up with it being pronounced SO wrong. He's therefore shortened his first name to something which people can pronounce and is more "European".

In addition, he's now coming up to the age where he's going to be looking for a job and sadly he has a genuine concern that potential employers may just pass over his CV because of his name.

He therefore sticking with this shortened version. He shouldn't have had to do that and should be able to embrace his culture, but realistically it's worked well!

Thank you, this is exactly what we’re worried about. Sorry your foster son is dealing with this

OP posts:
wombats78 · 07/01/2024 13:23

But it's not your name...

Your name is the one you are called by for the entirety of your childhood, then suddenly you have to use this other name for official things. It can cost you too, if you forget, eg flight tickets.

It doesn't sound like you understand how awkward this is & want to fix your other issue of wanting a western name for your dc.

Fair enough but you were told...

Ruri · 07/01/2024 10:07

"Perhaps if you were happy with the first name and used to responding occasionally to the first name, would that have eliminated that problem?"

Like I said earlier in the chain I go by my middle name and have done so since birth. Another issue with using the middle name is people assume I don't like my first name, and in school some people would attempt to wind me up about it, not that it worked. I am happy with my first name and can respond to it, but the issue is it doesn't feel like my name. I think it would feel the same as if someone was randomly addressed by their middle name, I don't think they'd feel like their correct name had been used.

ChaosAndCrumbs · 07/01/2024 10:06

We use a middle name for one of my DC. It just flows better that way. We’ve not had any issues, but it’s common in our area.

Marshmallowtoastie · 07/01/2024 09:58

NewShoes · 07/01/2024 08:56

I’m confused by you saying that they’d have the option of using the ‘English’ name for jobs- would anyone change their name for a job? So they’re known as one thing by their family and friends and another name by work colleagues? I would just use the name they’ll be known by as their first name, to save confusion.

There’s a lot of evidence that when applying for jobs, names can prevent things like getting interviews or being offered the job. With the option of an English name we prevent that. They can still introduce themselves as their middle name if they’d like once they started but at least for application they don’t have the issues.
there are lots of other times when names can lead to racism and discrimination too, and at least they can avoid this when they want/need to. That’s what I was thinking.
even day to day as an adult I have gone places and just known it was going to be a problem as soon as I told them my name, and I knew the attitude towards me would shift. At least dc could give the British name in that case.

It’s interesting to hear from the people who go by their middle name, I’m interested that they say it’s a complete nightmare. It sounds like primarily the issue is that people call them the wrong name and it leads to some issues. Perhaps if you were happy with the first name and used to responding occasionally to the first name, would that have eliminated that problem?

OP posts:
SeatonCarew · 07/01/2024 09:30

Loveheartsandlockets · 06/01/2024 20:36

Don’t. I’m called by my middle name. It’s a f pita for all official admin, doctors and dentists, everybody. I don’t hate it. I loathe it and refused to follow the “family tradition” for my own DCs. Call your DC by the first name you want to call them and use the middle name for random stuff. They will think kindly of you in the future if you do this.

This, I've always been known by my middle name. In an internet age it is an absolute nightmare, please don't do it.

NewShoes · 07/01/2024 08:56

I’m confused by you saying that they’d have the option of using the ‘English’ name for jobs- would anyone change their name for a job? So they’re known as one thing by their family and friends and another name by work colleagues? I would just use the name they’ll be known by as their first name, to save confusion.

MabelQ · 06/01/2024 22:38

I don’t recommend it. I have a very common first name, but due to its length + my maiden name + just preference, I have been known by my nickname since I was a toddler. My nickname isn’t truly a derivative of my legal first name, and while it’s a common girls’ name NOW it was very unusual for a couple of decades. Few people even knew what my legal name was.

The issue arose when I became a full-fledged married adult. Suddenly I was in the hospital, seeing the doctor, filing paperwork, going to appointments, and meeting all sorts of new people. Nearly every single one of those scenarios used my LEGAL name; the issue was that you could call me by my legal name and it wouldn’t occur to me to look up. You’d call out my name in a waiting room and anyone else with my very common legal name might look up, but I wouldn’t! Changing my address involved complications as well, as I had to file and specify as if I was two people. And eventually receiving checks became a pain - once the bank I’d used from childhood experienced enough staff turnover AND I moved across the county, I no longer was allowed to use my nickname and thus when anyone wrote a check to my nickname I’d need to endorse it as if a third party was signing it, and everything was delayed.

Today I use a nickname that encompasses both my legal name and my lifelong nickname. I don’t even like the name, but it’s got enough of BOTH in it that it catches my attention AND people connect it with me either way, whether they have always known me by my nickname or only known me by me legal nickname. My husband still uses my original nickname as well as my own family, and those who have known me my whole life… but I don’t frankly feel like her anymore. She had a lovely childhood nickname but constantly spelling and explaining ruined her name except for nostalgia. And yet I’m not brave enough to ask those I’m closest to to just use my new nickname.

Banking and moving and taxes and doctors and new friends and in-laws (I couldn’t do a “formal” style wedding invite with my middle name and all because nobody would’ve known WHO that legal person was!) and such might seem far away when you’re naming a child, and might be okay into the teen years, but the disconnect became extremely annoying in my adulthood!

Ruri · 06/01/2024 22:23

I wouldn't recommend doing it. I've always been known by my middle name and it's been a faff on, always telling teachers that I use my middle name. Like others have said I have to remember that in medical settings it will be my first name that they'll use. Being known by my middle has had other issues like people booking me on flights in my middle name, cheques written in middles names and at work organising that email addresses are set up in middle name. Just choose the name you'll call them as the first name, much easier for them as they go through life.

DillDanding · 06/01/2024 22:21

I had a boyfriend who was known by his middle name. In his family, it was customary to name the first son James and then use the middle name as their given name. So his dad and grandad were James David, both known as David and he is James Matthew and goes by Matthew. Don’t think it ever caused an issue.

modgepodge · 06/01/2024 22:17

I just can’t see any benefit to it? (Other than where someone has decided to change to their middle name themself when older.) call the child the name you’ll use. Give them an English middle name if you want. If they want to use the English name when they’re older they can do, and dealing with the hassle of being known as their middle name will be a choice they’ve consciously made, rather than been saddled with by their parents.

Whiskerson · 06/01/2024 22:11

I think when considering anecdotes on this topic, it's best to rule out any regarding much older generations.

Two reasons:

  • First names are used much more often now. In the past, professionals and strangers would call you Mrs Smith and not need to know whether you preferred Elizabeth, Betty or Rumpelstiltskin. Nowadays, everyone is on first name terms, so the issue is unavoidable.

  • Computerisation and stricter rules give less flexibility.

ObviouslyNameChanging · 06/01/2024 21:58

If you want to call them that name, then use it! We had a friend who was known by his middle name, he said it was a pain for his job as had to have legal name, getting called at the GP and hospital post op by a name you don’t recognise, just really awkward. He legally changed his name to make it his first.

upsidedownheturnsme · 06/01/2024 21:55

My foster son has a non-English name. It's proved impossible for strangers as it's spelt very differently to how it's pronounced. People who know us take the time to get it right but others don't.

He got fed up with it being pronounced SO wrong. He's therefore shortened his first name to something which people can pronounce and is more "European".

In addition, he's now coming up to the age where he's going to be looking for a job and sadly he has a genuine concern that potential employers may just pass over his CV because of his name.

He therefore sticking with this shortened version. He shouldn't have had to do that and should be able to embrace his culture, but realistically it's worked well!

ShadyHook · 06/01/2024 21:40

My uncle was Thomas Arthur aka Arthur
His oldest son as Thomas Arthur aka Thomas
His younger son is John Arthur aka Ian.
The grandfather was Thomas.

My mother was Mary Catherine aka Kitty
Our daughter Catherine aka Kate

In your case call her by her second name and at school introduce Mary Anne as Ann, Anne, or Annie, whatever she has been known as for 4 years

LadyJelly · 06/01/2024 21:37

Loveheartsandlockets · 06/01/2024 20:36

Don’t. I’m called by my middle name. It’s a f pita for all official admin, doctors and dentists, everybody. I don’t hate it. I loathe it and refused to follow the “family tradition” for my own DCs. Call your DC by the first name you want to call them and use the middle name for random stuff. They will think kindly of you in the future if you do this.

Same. It's so, so annoying.

LolaSmiles · 06/01/2024 21:35

I presumed the British name would be the first name on all official documents, but the middle name would be a preferred name.like choosing to go by a nickname almost

I can't remember the legal technicalities but I'm sure I read that technically anyone in the UK can change their name on different things as long as there's no attempt to be fraudulent.

So the easiest thing to do, and the one that is the most common sense, is to have a birth certificate with a legally recognised name, use the legal (as in birth certificate name) for all important documents, and use your middle name as a preferred name day to day.

wombats78 · 06/01/2024 21:33

It really is a pain.

Say your name is Sara Jane. You're known by everyone as Jane, so you use that on official stuff but then you have to show ID and it causes so many issues. It's actually worse now that everything has to match and is computerised than when I was younger.

My first name is never used so I miss to hear it when people call my name in places like the Gps as they cannot get around the middle name thing. You spend more time explaining you're known as than describing your issue too.

badlydrawntoy · 06/01/2024 21:32

It's totally fine. Every education setting I've worked in has had kids with different names used to their given Christian name. Some bear no resemblance to anything on their birth certificate!
Often the kids will move up from nursery to primary so the kids will already associate them as 'Hettie' rather than 'Jemima Harriet'.
Supply teachers occasionally get caught out when they're using the register (which may have official names) but it's all part of the fun.

Such a non issue. I know loads of kids and adults like this.

Marshmallowtoastie · 06/01/2024 21:28

LolaSmiles · 06/01/2024 21:21

For example, I've taught at least 5 boys whose official name is Muhammad/Mohammed but not a single one of them went by that name as they're named after older males in the family. All go by their middle name in school
I was going to give the same example. It isn't a problem at all.Their legal name is on the system and their certificates are in their full legal name, but day to day they go by their middle name.

I would imagine passports and driving licences will be in their full legal name too.

If they get to adulthood and start mixing and matching on different documents then that's not an issue that's from using a middle name. It's a not putting important documents in their legal name issue.

I think this is what I’m thinking. I’m surprised pp have been able to get licenses and qualifications in their middle name.
I presumed the British name would be the first name on all official documents, but the middle name would be a preferred name.
like choosing to go by a nickname almost.

OP posts:
ErrolTheDragon · 06/01/2024 21:26

All hospitals ask for preferred name

MiL always went by her middle name (her choice because she detested her first name).

But when she started having to go into hospital near the end of her life - sometimes in a confused state - they seemed weirdly unable to use her middle name despite being told. Though come to think, that was in the unit recently in the news for nurses drugging their patients so hopefully not typical.

One of my DBs has always been called by one of his middle names, afaik it's never been a problem for him.

LolaSmiles · 06/01/2024 21:21

For example, I've taught at least 5 boys whose official name is Muhammad/Mohammed but not a single one of them went by that name as they're named after older males in the family. All go by their middle name in school
I was going to give the same example. It isn't a problem at all.Their legal name is on the system and their certificates are in their full legal name, but day to day they go by their middle name.

I would imagine passports and driving licences will be in their full legal name too.

If they get to adulthood and start mixing and matching on different documents then that's not an issue that's from using a middle name. It's a not putting important documents in their legal name issue.