How would you pronounce Dahlia?

I know a Dalia and it's pronounced dar-lee- ah.

Pretty name.

But how you get Da leer from Dah lia I will never understand ?!

Americans and Canadians most certainly pronounce the R in car or dar!

Day - leer

No! It's only in a few accents that people choose not to pronounce it. There's no need to teach this!

Are you seriously suggesting that people choose the features of their regional accent?

Besides, I wouldn't call it 'only a few accents'. According to a quick Google, Scotland Ireland, America and Canada are mostly rhotic. England, Wales, Australia, New Zealand and South Africa are mostly non-rhotic, along with some parts of the southern and eastern U.S.

Adding an R to Da makes it a decidedly long-sounding vowel.

Not necessarily. In my accent, 'ma' and 'pa' have exactly the same vowel sound and length as 'bar' and 'car'. And indeed the same as the a in 'path' and 'grass'.

We weren't taught about the letter R in different accents, but maybe we should have been.

No! It's only in a few accents that people choose not to pronounce it. There's no need to teach this!

Bugger me, 7 pages????
Quite obviously DAY LEE A

Job done 😁

You're not wrong! English is not taught as well as it could be here, based on what I'm told by my English husband and his family. It is such a shame. My English teachers were all excellent, but I think that could be down to luck and the fact that some of my education was at a private school with teeny class sizes, rather than that English teaching is generally better in Ireland.

Ah right. I was trying to find a parallel to help explain silent letters and thought the silent e thing worked well. I wasn't suggesting any of it is taught in schools or anywhere else. Sorry if I confused you at all, Drogo.

I was joking about the R thing, Fatkins. Although, now we're on to the subject of schools, I do think it would do Brits good if English language was taught more thoroughly here.

IV

I think drogo meant that the E thing is taught but the r thing is not.

The r thing is not taught because it is not a universal rule in the English language, even in England . If we had to teach children all the various pronunciations for the whole country and beyond, then it would take a very long time.

@Drogosnextwife That's a shame. The "magic e" was one of the few English language-related things we were taught in primary school. I'm in southern England, so it was definitely taught in some schools here, at least.

We weren't taught about the letter R in different accents, but maybe we should have been.

@Fullmoons it does in many non-rhotic accents, which is what I was responding to (someone asked). I know it doesn't do that in most accents. I'm not sure where that bit about it being taught in schools or not has come from, tbh, as it wasn't something I mentioned at all.

Daylia like the flower.

Just like adding an E to the word man makes it mane - you don't pronounce the E but it changes the preceding vowel sound.

Yes, this is a general rule. Foreign learners of English learn this rule, regardless of accent!

Adding an R to Da makes it a decidedly long-sounding vowel

No, it doesn't necessarily nor is it taught to English learners!

Just like adding an E to the word man makes it mane - you don't pronounce the E but it changes the preceding vowel sound. No becomes nor. Co becomes cor. Adding an R to Da makes it a decidedly long-sounding vowel

Im pretty sure no one is taught this in school.

You do when writing a pronunciation of something that sounds like car/far/bar/tar etc in your accent.

That's because they are actually spelt like that

No, I don't think you're weird or in the minority IV. Most people got what the op meant, including Irish people like me. But some didn't and asked for clarification which pissed some RP English speakers right off for some reason.

I got told off my a posh old lady for calling the flowers Darlias not Daylias so the latter may well be correct but definitely open for confusion!

@Sakura7 Fair enough, I genuinely do think about these things, but I get that I'm weird like that and definitely in the minority (I find accents/language interesting generally, so that's probably why).

It would make sense if each of us, when writing phonetically in comments, also wrote where we're from/what our accent is. Even then, I'm not sure it would stem the inevitable tide of "why do you put an R there if you don't pronounce the R"/ "why don't you realise that the R shouldn't be pronounced". Some things on Mumsnet are eternal, and this argument seems to be one of them.

I don't pre-empt a Liverpudlian writing down a word with added consonants, or try to read a thread in a Liverpool accent instead of my own. I'm amazed some posters don't seem to get that.

I do get that it's probably not something most people would think about until something like this thread crops up. They do seem to crop up on MN a lot though! I probably think about these things a lot more than your average person as I'm a linguist. It just always surprises me how indignant people can be about perfectly correct ways of pronouncing things in an accent other than their own.

These kind of threads that keep cropping up make me wonder if we in England hear more Scottish and N. Irish accents on TV than vice versa, making us more familiar with them and more aware of accent differences.

Seems unlikely! There's obviously a lot of American accents on tv and in films though - and American accents are almost always rhotic.

Day-lia or Dar-lia

These kind of threads that keep cropping up make me wonder if we in England hear more Scottish and N. Irish accents on TV than vice versa

No, we hear plenty of English accents, don't worry.

It has been explained why it's confusing to a rhotic speaker. I do think there is a difference when it's a consonant as well, as there's a bit more variation in the pronunciation of vowels.

I know what a Liverpool accent (for example) sounds like, and I can recognise it when I hear it. However, I don't consciously think about the mechanics of the accent and what specific features cause it to sound different to my accent. I don't pre-empt a Liverpudlian writing down a word with added consonants, or try to read a thread in a Liverpool accent instead of my own. I'm amazed some posters don't seem to get that.

I think most people do assume what you do ivy. Most people got what the op meant, including me (Irish). But some didn't and asked for clarification, which is really fair enough. Can't people ask? I wouldn't take the hump I you couldn't pronounce Aoife and asked for clarification.

Then others (English) said "I don't see how there is any difference between dar and dah", suggesting that despite all the Irish and Scottish accents they hear in the media, at least some English people also can't imagine accents other than their own, even after it's been discussed on the thread, or "I hate these disengenuous comments asking where the r came from. You all MUST know what she means".