Amhlaoibh

nice name, use it

Have only seen names like Bent (Scandinavian) and Precious/Princess/Innocent (African Anglophone) remarked upon disparagingly. Though Fritz as a nn got shot down in flames here a while back (too German, as in 'don't mention the war'). So not for the same reasons as Irish names. I haven't seen any poke funnish comments made about Scottish or Welsh names, nothing that I can remember anyway.

The 'scrabble tiles' comments are ironic because, as mentioned upthread, Irish orthography and pronunciation are very regular and predictable, moreso than English.

thank you TLC.

i wonder what it is about irish names that people think they are fair game to poke fun at. i mean, they do realise that actual people have these names? it is real people they are making fun of when they say things like that about their names.

is it only irish names or do french/german/asian names etc get the same sort of sniggering aimed at them?

I did wonder whether it might be pronounced amoeba

Olaf is nice.

This thread is very interesting.

OP - if the name is very important to your family and to you then use it. It's a fine name with history. Seeing it written down might fox people a bit at first, but once they hear how it is pronounced then the polite and sensible thing for them to do would be to remember it when they are addressing him or speaking about him.

Boo - your DS2 has one of my fave ever Irish names!

I remember vaguely that Phil Schofield got into bother when he remarked on This Morning a few years ago that a guest had a name like letters on a Scabble board. It was an Irish name too, it was that guy from X Factor Eoghan Quigg.

Math thanks for that - I think I'd say something like "Dovv-nit" (though I've been out of Ireland too long and if I ask any of my siblings they'll know straight away we'd be thinking of a girl's name, with subsequent opinions on the matter!). And that link is hilarious - Frank Kelly - pure class! The mother is in a home for the bewildered

Boo I'd also say something "LAY-un"

I fear the Gobnaits of the world (all 6 of them) might be offended by a Gobnait thread. .

I have heard Damhnait pronounced Dove-nit/Dove-nut and Dovv-nit/Dovv-nut (slender T/ proper Irish T sound are important to avoid 'nit' connotations)

math i always thought the same WRT the 'Lay-n' pronounciation but as he was the only person ever called me it i wasn't sure.

Math I have been tempted in the past to start a Gobnait name thread on here just to see what reaction it would get . I like Damhnait too (also like Blathnait) - out of curiousity, how you would pronounce Damhnait - Dev-nait? I like the detail you provide (sorry to OP for slight hijack!).

To me, Léan would be 'LAY-un' or maybe closer to 'Lay-n' (long A sound followed by slight schwa). The difference might be down to the Ulster Irish accent, which mine is not.

ooh a question for math or SCOTT (whilst we are on pronunciation) without wishing to hijack OP's thread.

in school i was told the translation for my name is Léan, which the teacher (ulster irish) pronounced Len as in Ken. is this right?

The trick might be to keep non-Irish-speaking friends from seeing the name written down until they have heard it for a while and learned to say it. My own Irish name causes no problems at all pronunciation-wise when people first hear it, but after they ask me to spell it for them it all starts to go south.

Flip -- I knew a Gobnait too! nn Gubby [gaaaagh]

Damhnait is much nicer imo.

I really like this name - agree it's unusual but that's no bad thing, especially with the family connection. This thread has brought back fond memories of Irish college in Ballingeary [wistful] - l love West Cork Irish. The spelling may take some explaining/getting used to for those coming across the name for the first time, but it's straightforward to pronounce (having said that I have English friends who can't properly pronounce simple names like Padraig or Orla or Cliona so you may need to let some of it wash over you!).

I think we'll be going with Finbarr if I have a boy this time (no surprise to say I'm from Cork City ). I'm married to an American, currently living in London but planning to move to the States in 2012 so we want something relatively easy to spell & pronounce (plus I love the name Finbarr).

Gobnait is a desperate name and I'd have thought no one named their girls that except that I knew a girl named Gobnait at Irish college (nn Gubby, the poor thing). Shame really, as I love bees/beekeeping and would love a name with that connection but Gobnait is just too awful...Bit like the name Dorcas - I know 3 women called Dorcas despite me wondering how you can hold a newborn and think "yup, we're calling her Dorcas"!

Aswellasyou, I have a lot of family in Carlow, where my mum came from. (Actually from near The Rower in Kilkenny, where I understand Irish was spoken into the 19th century. Just to complicate things, my grandparents, who went to school before Irish was taught in schools but picked up Irish at Gaelic League classes, both pronounced some of their DHs in Irish as V, which I have seen mentioned as a characteristic of the old SE Leinster Irish that has fallen victim to school Irish and increasing standardisation.)

I think the internal MH in Amhlaoibh may have just got swallowed up by the L but remains to form a sort of diphthong with the A -- A+mh = ow.
(Highly scientific explanation there [not]).

Broad MH is pronounced 'V' when it comes at the end of a word or after long vowels or diphthongs in Munster Irish, and the 'U' or 'W' sound for end BH and MH is normal in Connacht Irish. WRT 'Niamh' the Munster pronunciation seems to have pushed the Connacht and Ulster end MH and BH pronunciation out. I suppose with a name as opposed to a common noun more standardisation of pronunciation is to be expected and for some reason the Munster pronunciation won in the case of Niamh.

However, the Irish V sound is softer than the labio-dental V sound of English. This gets lost in translation somewhat when people who normally speak English use an Irish word or name and the more plosive English V replaces the softer (for want of a better word) V of Irish, which can veer into approximant U or W territory, especially when the MH or BH are broad, and in the Connacht accent in general. (Generally, broad and slender distinctions are also lost in Irish names when pronounced by English speakers.)

i like it.
didn't know the name, but immediately assumed it was an irish name.

admittedly, it might make your life and his life a bit complicated - my DD has a name with an only slightly uncommon (ethnic) spelling, and i have had to have documents reprinted, etc, etc which can get irritating.

i like finbar olaoibh too.

Ooh, good question.

math might know this.

Here's my take on it (non-expert):

mh (or really m séimhiú) can be pronounced as either v or w. This can depending on whether it is broad or narrow.

So the vocative "a Mhíchíl" (a veeheel) and "a Mhuiris" (a wirrish).

This rule is pretty strictly observed in Ulster dialect, but in other canúintí a broad mh can be a v sound, particularly where it is the final sound of a word.

e.g. "ag snámh" would be ?eg snaaú? whereas in southern caighdeán Irish that would be ?eg snawv?.

So the standard pronunciation of Niamh ends with a v sound (even in Ulster), although arguably Nyeeú would be valid too.

Amhlaoibh would not be Ovleev, because mh following a like that in the middle of a word is an ow (or oh) sound.

Wow this thread has moved on!
While there are a few of you who are obviously very familiar with Irish spellings/pronunciations, I've been wondering about the 'amh' sound. My daughter's middle name is Niamh which I usully pronounce 'neev' to be honest, but like 'nyeev' if I'm saying it 'properly' (or so I thought!). So Amhlaoibh is pronounced with an 'ow' sound at the beginning and now I'm confused about why that is a completely different sound to the -amh in Niamh. Is it the 'i' that makes the difference? My family is from Carlow, so I guess the pronunciation there would be different to yours, but I'd still like to be educated.

Ah! That is good to know. Cheers

you will have no trouble registering a name with a fada.

I think you may have trouble registering a name with a fada so may be worth checking (I had Heloise on my short list fot what became DS2 and later found out the original spelling I would have liked was not allowed).
As someone with a name from a foreign language who lives in a English speaking place please please think carefully before you choose. My name should be quite simple but I work with Americans and everyone gets it wrong. The Indians at work laugh at me

It's a gorgeous name, but I'd echo the other posters who have suggested it as a middle name. I have a very unusual surname which I spend my life spelling/correcting the pronunciation and it gets very irritating - I can only imagine having to do that with my first name.

Ah now I do no accents on the iPhone as a matter of policy, sorry:) I can read French even minus accents so presume an Irish person would have similarly little problem.

It takes a fada on the final "i" which gives it the "een" sound at the end.