Children being allowed to go to the toilet at school

Former teacher here. I am sympathetic to anyone with any kind of digestive complaint - adult or child - and recognise time is of the essence when an attack hits.

But control around toilet breaks and classroom absence is not solely predicated around that. To ignore the fact that - given the chance - some pupils will (mis)use the toilet for nefarious purposes, fag breaks and classroom avoidance - is naïve. If a teacher (or teachers in general) are informed of a condition or an ailment, then of course they will be sympathetic. But then you hit the issue of pupils asking why can SHE go to the toilet but not me ? Do you then inform said pupil that the other pupil has a digestive complaint ?

There is no right answer here.

Disregulated kids being followed around by their TAs are not the ones trashing the toilets to the tune of three to eight grand a pop with their mates, having made excuses that they're really, really desperate to go to the toilet ten minutes into the start of the lesson at exactly the same time their friends are doing exactly the same thing with their teachers.

Why do people seem to want to blame the worst behaviour upon the more vulnerable kids rather than anybody else?

Parents would be the first to complain if they werent considered as having SEN, but regardless, the children I work with who do have challenging behaviour which is distructivbe twithin school are either already with an EhCP, or in the process for one, or need one or are on the pathway for assessment for SEN.

Lots and lots of exclusions with lots of schools unable to meet need but often unable to find an alternative, plodding on, unable to fully permanently exclude, PRU places have all been used up, round and round it goes

I just dont know why there is such a desire (on here) to ignore what teachers and professionals are working with every day and seemingly pretend any non SEN child is more likely to be destructive than a child with SEN. That isnt the case.

SEN pupils often have time out/ reset cards.
Plenty of these pupils spend most of the day walking round school, refusing to engage with their TA. And yes, a lot escape to the bathrooms.

Most schools add all children with behavioural issues to the SEN register BECAUSE of their behaviour. It usually gets added under SEMH or similar. Therefore, 100% of children with behavioural problems will be logged as SEND because the fact that they have behavioural problems is enough to put them on the register.

Im a statutory front line worker for children and families and I see this day in and day out unfortunately.

Bollocks.

It's not the kids with SEND that are the issue, no matter how much parents would like to claim that it is.

You're deluded if you believe this. All of these students are in mainstream.

No one is saying they are all hooligans. But those of us with experience of managing 1000+ teens all in one place at the same time have reluctantly had to take these steps to try and preserve working toilet facilities for all. Sorry if that upsets you. In reality, in lots of schools, most of us will absolutely let most kids pop quickly, especially girls, or will not discipline for being a few minutes late after break if there was a queue. In the ops case, there is a solution for her child's needs, she just hadn't taken it yet.

Ok fucked up you win kids to be stopped from going the toilet because they are all hooligans.

This makes no difference in most schools. It doesn't prevent the problem, it just allows you to identify and punish the student who did it. Some students actively want to be excluded because when they are their parents pamper them, buy them treats and give them the days to play on their xbox. So a child who wants some time off school can revel in destroying a toilet block, knowing the school will have no choice but exclude them when they look at the cameras.

That will be most schools.
looks like you are homeschooling.
All the best with that….

Totally agree.
No one questioned me when I was a Nursing sister. I am shocked that school staff get so much abuse from both pupils and parents.
Parents know nothing of the reality of day to day school life. And it’s got much much worse since Tik Tok and since Covid.
If certain parents were such experts, why are their kids so badly behaved at school?

And do you know the instances of vandalism and poor behaviour after that point? Did they publicise that info? Likely not. Why is that teaching is the one profession that everyone thinks they can comment on despite having no direct, current experience? What happened in times past or what it looks like from the view of a parent is not on a par with knowledge and experience of people who are dealing with this every single day right now. I dont have all the answers, every school has different factors but I'm damm sure I know the impact of the disruption a free for all policy causes inside and outside the classroom. My 30 years of continuous classroom practice actually DOES mean I and others like me know more.

Im sorry but this is absolute nonsense. The vast vast majority of challenging behaviour is from pupils with SEN of some sort. Both in mainstream but also (obviously) within specialist settings.

This is outrageous, the school is out of line with such inhumane rules. Can you please name the school so that we don’t send our future kids to this school!

Your right I don’t know but I’m going off my own experience when my dc were at secondary school the toilets were locked then a new head teacher turned up and changed this policy for the kids own health. So just because you are a teacher doesn’t mean you know all the answers either.

Strangely enough, it is almost never children with SEND that cause thousands of pounds worth of damage for the TikTok views. It is almost never children with SEND that film others in the toilets and share it online. It is almost never children with SEND who took all of the sanitary towels and stuck them to the walls, shoved them down the toilets and threw used ones out of the windows.

The overwhelmed children with SEND may have been found having locked themselves into a cubicle, but the only damage they were doing - and often as a reaction to the behaviour of children without SEND either around them or directly towards them - was to themselves.

Oh and the same thing goes for uniform, coats on off lunch boxes water in classroom etc etc.

As a classroom teacher I just want to get on with my work. I don't make the rules about toilet access. The high ups do that. I don't appreciate it when I have to argue with a child or a parent for enforcing those rules nor do I enjoy it when using my judgement I allow a child to go out and then have to justify that with a member of SLT who has found out that I disobeyed their directive. If you want to argue about this take it up with the SLT. Ordinary teachers have no time for these debates.

No, they're in mainstream schools. As are the ones who vape.

A minority of kids might be the type who do this. They would be children with problems making themselves unsuitable for mainstream school.

Again, adults at work not generally pissing on walls, shitting on seats, ripping cisterns off walls, ramming all sorts down the toilets...stop comparing. The two scenarios are totally different.

Where I work, we don't have notes. It's a centralised system, each visit is logged - it's not a negative behaviour point, but to triangulate where there has been vandalism, vaping, bullying and assaults. The students know this, and incidents have reduced.
I always let students go if it seems genuine (especially girls) and then I tune out the 5 others immediately asking, and the parental emails accusing me of favouritism.
I don't believe I've ever been reported to the Ministry of Human Rights, though 😉

OP apologies if I am repeating what has already been said but I became furious before I got to the end of the first page.
I am a teacher and have never refused a request for a student to go to the toilet. The lack of toilets in secondary schools is outrageous considering most schools have between 1500 and 2000 students. I always write a note for kids noting the time and what classroom they are coming from. Saying no as an adult to a child that is obviously desperate for the loo is a health and safety risk in my opinion.
of course there are a few character who will take the pi** but they are few and far between.