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Would you help in these circumstances

256 replies

Mamma1383838 · Yesterday 15:14

Friend did a massive favour for me a while back. It didn’t cost them anything, but it saved me thousands. At the time we didn’t have much so I bought a small gift as thanks.

They recently asked me to lend them a significant sum of money, repaying over a long time period. It’s a lot, more than we‘d want to give away, but we could afford to lose the sum now if it came to it. I don’t want to mix friendship and money but I want to help. It’s for a nice to have rather than for something essential.

Would you lend them the money? Curious as I know the general advice here is not to.

OP posts:
OffTheMap · Yesterday 18:04

Mamma1383838 · Yesterday 15:27

Amount is about half or two thirds of what we saved because of friend.

Yes, but I am guessing your friend didn’t put capital etc at risk to help you?

Unless they did something like make you a bridging loan so you could buy before you had sold, for example

Gmhopkins · Yesterday 18:04

So in an example, your friend saved you £10,000 a few years back. She’s asking for a lend of £6000.
You’re quibbling about it, mostly because you’ve read too much mean minded mumsnetters over the years.
Your husband is about to buy a car for £40,000.
Yes, of course you should lend your pal this money. Isn’t that the whole point of friendship? Helping each other out?

sweetpotatopie2 · Yesterday 18:04

There is a big difference though, since the help they gave you didn't cost them or at least didn't cost them much. Now they're trying to cash in on it, hmm. Something about this just doesn't sit well with me, personally.

At the same time, I can see why you'd feel somewhat obligated. It seems a bit complicated, with several factors to consider. And just you asking her shows you're not completely comfortable with this request.

So, I think I'd opt for something between a flat out "no" and lending them the large-ish amount requested. I'd say you don't have that much money at your disposal right now but that you'd be happy to GIVE them a smaller amount (after you decide what that should be).

That's nice and neat, with no risk to the friendship and hopefully more in your comfort zone. Then you can consider the favor repaid.

Mamma1383838 · Yesterday 18:03

Keepitsimples · Yesterday 17:50

Which leads me to believe we aren’t talking about a substantial amount here

I’ve said it’s a substantial amount. But it wouldn’t impact us in the medium term if it’s repaid. It would be repaid over a couple of years.

OP posts:
Mamma1383838 · Yesterday 18:01

DuckbilledSplatterPuff · Yesterday 17:48

There's a big difference between half or two thirds.

Well it depends on where we would have spent the money without the favour - if we used our own money at the time it may also have changed our decision making.

OP posts:
Kipperandarthur · Yesterday 18:01

Did they let you live rent free for a period of time?

It's so hard to judge this. It sounds as though you feel morally obliged to provide this money which is not a nice position to be put in.

They did you a favour which did not actually cost them money.
Now they are asking you for hard cash as a loan when they could formally arrange a loan. You are hoping they pay this money back.
It's already affecting your relationship with them otherwise you would not having made this post on here.

MyEasterBonnet · Yesterday 17:57

If you didn’t have much when you thanked them, but can afford it now, would you have given them that much as thanks? Do they know you’ve got the money, and why are they asking - have you come into money and they’re asking for some of it? It depends how much for me: hundreds maybe, thousands no.

PyongyangKipperbang · Yesterday 17:57

Have they said why they can't borrow from a bank or credit card?

Mamma1383838 · Yesterday 17:55

DuckbilledSplatterPuff · Yesterday 17:41

You've sacrificed other things to make those savings and been careful to stay debt free.
It's not luck but judgement.

DId you say things to the friend like.. Thank you so much ... you've saved me £XX.. and then she's suddenly asking for a loan?

It sort of sounds like you want to lend it to her because you can't think of a good enough reason not to, because you feel a bit beholden or guilty? And she would find out that DH wants to buy something indulgent (Its your joint money.. why can't he and why would you feel guilty?)

Is she asking for a loan for something worthwhile? That she really needs? Are you sure she can't just get a loan? Would it be impossible for her to get an interest free credit card?

If you do go ahead. Make sure you get a proper, signed loan agreement which details a timescale for repayment. But personally I really wouldn't do it. Do something else nice for her instead.. like she did for you, something that doesn't cost you anything but is a real favour and then perhaps you will feel that you have repaid the debt, but without feeling squeezed.

DId you say things to the friend like.. Thank you so much ... you've saved me £XX.. and then she's suddenly asking for a loan?

No we didn’t out a value on it. Friend did not offer me a professional service. There is a period of years between the favour and the request for the loan.

It sort of sounds like you want to lend it to her because you can't think of a good enough reason not to, because you feel a bit beholden or guilty? And she would find out that DH wants to buy something indulgent (Its your joint money.. why can't he and why would you feel guilty?)

I want to lend it because it will probably have a positive impact for them and we can afford to do it. I have reservations because the risk of not getting the money back is small but not zero, and yes I’m worried it will change things between us. I think we could sign an agreement, set up a standing order and then I would try to put it out of my mind until the repayments are over. I don’t know how friend would feel about the loan on their side but being able to make the purchase would be very positive for them.

OP posts:
Chilly80 · Yesterday 17:55

Who asks a friend for a loan to buy something thats just a nice to have item. Can't they just get a zero credit card to buy it?

Gmhopkins · Yesterday 17:54

Mamma1383838 · Yesterday 15:27

Amount is about half or two thirds of what we saved because of friend.

That changes everything. I think you’re morally obliged to lend her the money as she saved you way more money

Mapletree1985 · Yesterday 17:53

Mamma1383838 · Yesterday 15:14

Friend did a massive favour for me a while back. It didn’t cost them anything, but it saved me thousands. At the time we didn’t have much so I bought a small gift as thanks.

They recently asked me to lend them a significant sum of money, repaying over a long time period. It’s a lot, more than we‘d want to give away, but we could afford to lose the sum now if it came to it. I don’t want to mix friendship and money but I want to help. It’s for a nice to have rather than for something essential.

Would you lend them the money? Curious as I know the general advice here is not to.

Nothing ends a friendship faster than a loan.

The great favor she did you should not be calculated in monetary terms. I am sure if you are ever in a position to return the favor, you'd it in a heartbeat. But lending money is not returning the favor. Is it for some kind of plastic surgery?

everyoldsock · Yesterday 17:53

DH is about to spend several times what friend is asking for a something that isn’t immediately necessary, just a nice to have that will pay off longer term.

But he’s paying for that from money you or him have earned (family money). Your friend wants some of that money as a loan for THEIR nice to have thing / hobby / activity. It’s completely different.

DuckbilledSplatterPuff · Yesterday 17:52

Its coming across to me now that this is almost the same as them asking you for payment for the favour that didn't cost them anything,
because they know it saved you money and how much.

and its a considerable sum for something that's not essential (like stopping them from losing their home) but just nice to have.

They said they would do an agreement and pay interest - why not just go to a bank? or credit card?

There's just something a bit off about this.

PyongyangKipperbang · Yesterday 17:52

I am always suspicious about people who ask friends for loans because it suggests that they dont have a usable line of credit. If they have spent up to their lending limits or have bad credit so they can't get a loan, why would paying a friend back be more of a priority if they have unpaid debts to companies in the past?

It would be a no for me.

Kipperandarthur · Yesterday 17:51

In many ways it's very difficult to offer an opinion as you don't say what the amount is, what it is for and what they are suggesting as repayment terms - how long etc.

But the crux of the matter is if they are professionals (as they must be from what you have posted) they could arrange a suitable loan but have chosen to ask you instead for the money. Why is this?

Keepitsimples · Yesterday 17:50

DuckbilledSplatterPuff · Yesterday 17:48

There's a big difference between half or two thirds.

Which leads me to believe we aren’t talking about a substantial amount here

DuckbilledSplatterPuff · Yesterday 17:48

Mamma1383838 · Yesterday 15:27

Amount is about half or two thirds of what we saved because of friend.

There's a big difference between half or two thirds.

spanishcheese · Yesterday 17:47

DogsandFlowers · Yesterday 15:28

Rich people problems

It's all relative. Anyway the amount hasn't been mentioned so you have no way of knowing if they are rich.

Mamma1383838 · Yesterday 17:45

LizzieSiddal · Yesterday 17:34

So you saved several thousand.
Are they asking to borrow a similar amount, a bit more or significantly more?

Less, half or two thirds.

OP posts:
Kipperandarthur · Yesterday 17:44

It's tricky. I'm guessing they gave you their professional advice whether it be legal or accountancy which meant you did not have to pay your own fees.
You then mention this went on for a period of time so perhaps for your own business when you were starting up.

This cost them their time only but no actual monies.

Now everything is getting confused because they are asking for hard cash which puts a different spin on it all.

But if their professional advice was offered for free - why was that?
If their professional advice saved you thousands they are in a decent profession.
Why are they not getting a normal loan for whatever it is they need now?

It seems very transactional and that they are asking for payback time from you.
There is always a problem mixing financials with friendships as you are discovering.

(ps I run my own business and mixing the two is never a good idea.)

DuckbilledSplatterPuff · Yesterday 17:43

Also. Why do you have to lend the entire amount requested?

Mamma1383838 · Yesterday 17:43

IchiNiSanShiGo · Yesterday 17:18

If you were to say no, do you think it would have a negative impact on your friendship?

If you say yes, is it likely to feel awkward when it comes to repayments? Are you confident they have the funds to stick to the repayment plan they’ve suggested?

You say the “nice to have” is somewhat time limited - when do you need to make the decision by?

I don’t think this is a particularly easy decision, so I can see why you’ve asked.

Is your DH’s expensive purchase of similar value to the loan they’re asking for - if so, would DH consider deferring the purchase until you’re confident your friend is paying you back regularly?

I don’t know if it would impact our friendship - I hope not but it would probably affect it a little on my side. I’d feel guilty that I could help and I didn’t. The nice to have could have a very positive impact on their life - it’s not a frivolous purchase. Friend has a few months to decide what to do but I should probably let them know yes/no soon so they have other options. I’m not their only option, but I wouldn’t charge the interest rates of a credit card or bank loan. I guess we might lose out a little by not investing it aggressively.

DH is about to spend several times what friend is asking for a something that isn’t immediately necessary, just a nice to have that will pay off longer term.

OP posts:
DuckbilledSplatterPuff · Yesterday 17:41

Mamma1383838 · Yesterday 15:30

Not really rich but we have savings and no debts. I appreciate we are very fortunate.

You've sacrificed other things to make those savings and been careful to stay debt free.
It's not luck but judgement.

DId you say things to the friend like.. Thank you so much ... you've saved me £XX.. and then she's suddenly asking for a loan?

It sort of sounds like you want to lend it to her because you can't think of a good enough reason not to, because you feel a bit beholden or guilty? And she would find out that DH wants to buy something indulgent (Its your joint money.. why can't he and why would you feel guilty?)

Is she asking for a loan for something worthwhile? That she really needs? Are you sure she can't just get a loan? Would it be impossible for her to get an interest free credit card?

If you do go ahead. Make sure you get a proper, signed loan agreement which details a timescale for repayment. But personally I really wouldn't do it. Do something else nice for her instead.. like she did for you, something that doesn't cost you anything but is a real favour and then perhaps you will feel that you have repaid the debt, but without feeling squeezed.

Darck · Yesterday 17:37

Mamma1383838 · Yesterday 17:32

It wasn’t that but does it matter? The favour they did inconvenienced them slightly but saved me several grand and gave me peace of mind.

I’m not cavalier about money or I wouldn’t have any. I want to say yes but I’m thinking it through. A few posts have made good points.

Was it along the lines of qualified legal advice?

I've probably missed it upthread - I've had to skim read a bit - but why are they not just borrowing from a bank? Whatever the other circumstances, if that route is closed to them, then there's usually a reason for it, none of which tend to bode well for lending/borrowing money.