To think it’s crazy that National Minimum wage is £27k

However, the low paid in the UK pay through the nose for accommodation. Putting a roof over your head is stupidly expensive. But this is a smallish country, yet economic opportunity seems limited largely to the SE. I don't really understand why the rest of the country doesn't seize the opportunities.

These are illegally low wages, are you self-employed?

You are lovely parents. Your children are so fortunate you were so generous.

I do not know wealthy people, every person who is taking these trips are/were working class until they retired. Every one of the people I am talking about worked low wage jobs and live in a poor part of the country. You can tell me over and over that this isn’t the case, but it is. These people barely went on a holiday before retiring, now they live the life.

Here is a list of the jobs in no particular order:

• part time supermarket X2
• early retired design engineer
• sheet metal worker
• care home staff
• low level council office role X2
• nurse
• clerical worker X2
• cemetary caretaker
• not working due to disability

Tell me which of those is wealthy?

The average working household has disposable income BEFORE housing costs of approx £600 more than pensioners…have you seen how much rent or mortgages cost now? What about how much it costs to raise children? And the extra costs for transport to and from work? Extra car needed because you can’t share easily? Any activities being paid for 4 people instead of 1 or 2 in pensioner households…that extra 600 a month isn’t going to touch the sides is it

Inflation. It's tempting, but it usually escalates and escapes beyond the value in the economy, which is why it's a bad idea.

What’s even more crazy is that it’s only double minimum wage that you’re into higher rate tax.

Yep, it's insane. But it's less than £26500, I think. Not surprising given inflation but silly. What is the point of everything 'increasing' all the time when it's just relative to everything else?? Just keep numbers the same!! Haha

I am a pensioner and I have to make own wine using kits I buy online. Concentrated grape juice, brewing sugar, oak chips and yeast. It turns out at about 8 per cent ABV, not the 13 per cent that you get with the French stuff. I have started making my own bread and yoghurt and ice cream.

I might get a Salter's Steamer from Maidenhead to Windsor races or maybe a riverboat from Tate Britain to Tate Modern and both would be massive treats.

@Papyrophile no. I was just explaining to a poster that you cannot assess a pensioners wealth based purely on the job they did before retiring. For every person like me who barely inherited anything, there is another who inherits a lot of money.

@HardFuckingBird how much of your income goes on housing?

I think it's a fine level for minimum wage.

Entry level, unskilled work.

It's enough to live on. Obviously not enough to live in luxury but you wouldn't expect that for unskilled workers.

Is this satire?

@Constantrunner , and if they inherit at 67, after working their guts out, would you begrudge them a couple of lovely holidays rather than putting their inheritance away for the possible care home fees?

Most people inheriting now are fairly elderly. We were 67 and 68 when we inherited from our parents. We had made our way in life, and having been self-employed, we saved. We did deeds of variation and passed our total inheritances down a generation.

Our mortgage is less than £700 a month but we have a basic 3 beds house in a semi rural big commuter village. It's not a new build. We could have a bigger house but we don't want to stretch ourselves.

about half of pensioners are paying rent , and a significant fraction can claim pension credit/ universal credit because they are so poor

i think you have a skewed idea of pensioners

and a lot are used to living frugally to free up money for their treats

a lot who could claim the benfits they are entitled to don’t because they are used to paying their own way and living frugally

Sorry, the housing thing is total and utter nonsense.
in the 22 years since we bought our house, in london, adjusted for inflation it has gone up 30% adjusted for fee’s its more like 20%
by comparison the money i put in my pension is up 200% adjusted for inflation
Yes between 1992 and 2006 massive increase, since then basically nothing

I think whether it is enough to live on depends on where you live. Currently in London so you couldn't afford to rent anywhere and pay bills etc. Whereas when I was in a rural area of Wales this would have been enough.

When first started working after I left school around £1.50 an hour was average and if you manage to get a job that paid £2 an hour you would be delighted. Things are a tad more expensive these days.

Yes it's monthly pensions. £145k is average pension pot for 65 to 74 year olds.
I don't know anyone taking five holidays a year except one couple. You know pretty wealthy people. It's not just about salary. Plenty of well off people inherit a lot, often close to retirement age.

Where are you getting your figures from? Someone working a normal 35 hour week (lunch not paid for ) it’s £23,132. My son is on minimum wage and could not afford to pay rent, council tax, bills, his phone etc. Ok if he was a couple, but he’s not.
So £1793 take home after tax and national insurance. Now take away average council tax (inc single person discount), average utilities, phone, insurance, internet/cable tv you are at about £1300/month. Food - £200/month excluding alcohol if careful. Transport? Car (after purchase) is about £220/month for petrol, insurance tax, MOT. Could be a lot more! No car? Then £120-150 for public transport. So a bit of savings there. Work pension? My son contributes £53/month to his. £827. £50/month clothes. £30/month hair. £100 for odd drink or takeaway, movie or dinner out. Ok now left with £677. And if you want Netflix? Amazon Prime? Most people have one or the other and maybe another like Disney Plus, but not essential. But let’s take care of our teeth! NHS are hard to find so £100-120 for a hygienist and annual dentist check. £647 left. Got any family or friends you want to buy a birthday or Christmas present for? Maybe a weekend away? Can’t afford a week! Why? Because there’s rent! What’s the average rent? The average in the uk (excluding London) in a shared house is about £700. Oh dear. So can’t afford average do better move to a cheaper than average area.

Theoretically it should be enough to get by but if you are living and working in the SE, it isn't. Elsewhere in the country, where the work and opportunities are even scarcer, what do you do? We subsidise our one DC £1000 pm so that the training stage is affordable. It's okay, we manage, and it won't be forever, but most people can't pay.

I mentioned DH and I spent £21.5k in the last financial year, and we live in an expensive area just outside London. However, I pointed out that we own our own home and our adult children have left home, which are the two biggest expenses. When our mortgage finished and our DC finished university, we suddenly felt rich, after years of expense and frugal holidays!

It’s hard. I’m also a single income and on 28.5k

Honestly, how do you manage that, with new cars and holidays on 20k a year? No mortgage/rent?

edit: I see others have asked! Ignore me :-)

Yeah I don’t. I only know people who did manual labour or office jobs etc…but the pensions were very lucrative so they’re taking cruises multiple times a year. My own mum only worked part time, my dad retired through ill health just as his career was taking off (at around 50) and yet she takes around 5 holidays a year now on hers.

Is your figure looking only at those who take a monthly pension, because many don’t have it set up like this and will instead have pension pots worth 100s of thousands, just drawing down on it when needed. Are they skewing your numbers downward because they show as receiving 0 or very little a month?

My take home is £2600 of which £1000 goes on mortgage - I’m a lone householder so no one to share the bills with and am struggling
On the average household income I could not survive