What’s the point in the NHS?

I was diagnosed with Multiple Sclerosis this year. In the 9 months since diagnosis ive been seen twice by my consultant, been seen by an ms physiotherapist, 2 hour long appointments with a designated MS nurse, been advised via an MS helpline, had a support letter written for my studies, have a specialist nurse specifically for the medication ive been prescribed, regular phone calls to check response to meds, have medication shipped directly to my house and all via the NHS. I feel incredibly lucky to have been diagnosed in a country with access to the NHS

@Frugalgal has nailed it.

On the NHS you get the initial assessment for free. If it had been broken or needed surgery that also would be free. The NHS is no longer funded enough by the government to take more minor problems any further than this. If you’re not happy with this you can either pay privately or take out medical insurance. By contrast - In America you’d either need insurance just to be seen for the initial assessment or you’d have to have the means to pay privately. If you can’t afford the insurance you certainly can’t afford to pay private. For your problems you’d be paying approximately: Urgent Care Initial Visit & Exam: $100 – $250 (consultation fee) Ankle X-Ray: $85 – $300 (rules out broken bones) Brace, Splint, or Crutches: $30 – $100
Ankle MRI Scan (if ordered for severe ligament tears): $400 – $1,800 at an independent imaging center, or up to $3,000 – $4,500 if done via a hospital
Follow-up Doctor Visit: $50 – $150 per visit
Physical Therapy: $50 – $200 per session (often requiring 6 to 12 sessions if severe: $300 – $2,400 total) IF it turned out be a bad break and you needed surgery you’d be paying thousands for it. Plus extra for any nights you had to stay in hospital.
Thats the point of the NHS - medical care for serious problems is free. For everyone. Is it as good as it once was? No sadly not. Does it still provide care to keep people alive and deal with serious problems for free - yes! Remember you can still choose to pay privately or to have insurance here. But if you can’t afford it and have a real problem you’re still sorted on the NHS. It’s far from perfect but it’s still much better than many countries. And blame the government rather than the NHS that further help was unavailable for you because it’s them not providing the funding.

Oof. It’s great that some people have had positive experiences and I have too.

But in the last 3 months my mum has had two falls, the second time she was left on the ground for several hours waiting on an ambulance and was shaking and shivering with cold and pain. She had 2 broken bones. She then waited SIX hours in an ambulance before being seen.

The first time was worse as she was in a corridor waiting to be seen.

I seriously worry that if my mum had not had the assistance of passers by offering blankets and warmth etc that she could have experienced hypothermia. I also worry that if it had been something more life threatening that she would have died before being seen. And news reports confirm just that is happening all the time. I’m not surprised at all.

Think that 3k is a bit ott, ime an mri can be around £500 privately (xray would be less) with a consultant orthopaedic appointment starting around £125, physio sessions £55-65 for 30 minutes. Op has received the standard acute NHS treatment. A NHS physio can refer for scans and to a hospital clinician if indicated by the injury not recovering as expected.

Meaning sprained ligaments or fully torn? If fully torn and you had ankle instability, they would have referred you to fracture clinic for review plus MRI. If torn means sprained, then use crutches if you need to, wear an ankle support if you want to and otherwise crack on. It will be better within 2-3 months and no follow-up is needed. You also don't need to do specific exercises or have physio for a straightforward sprain.

I think you're reading too much into 'torn ligaments' and you probably just have a severe sprain, in which case the NHS has managed you completely appropriately.

@younknow @Dogdilemma01 I'm fairly sure crutches and scan wouldn't cost £1000's. I was in hospital in a European country shortly before we left the EU. Most of it was covered by being an EU citizen but crutches and a splint weren't, so I paid, and then reclaimed from insurance - small amount, from memory less than 100 euros in total. Alrhough the scans and x rays were covered, I saw the amounts on the invoice, and each scan and x ray individually were for modest amounts. A significant amount only because I had several. So I agree that a scan, bandage and crutches wouldn't be all that much.

My (grown up) son tore a ligament in his finger 2 months ago. Had an xray and a scan within 2 hours. Strapped up then a follow up appointment a few weeks later so no issues there.

You need to look at it as yes, you had a long wait, but you were seen for free, offered to be referred for physio and told where you could find some exercises sooner than that.

Admittedly I find being recommended chat gpt a bit strange, but no wonder NHS is struggling if people expect free crutches for a sprained ankle! Surely they should be kept for people who have broken bones?

According to google you would pay between £200 - £400 if you went private. Just buy a pair of £20 crutches if it's that bad!

People don't realise how fortunate we are to have an NHS.

@younknow anyways OP I hope you got yourself on Amazon and chat gpt for all that you need 😂😂 your attitude stinks which might be why you didn’t get the responses you like

No that’s not true. You were seen. The NHS works on the premise of need at the time. Life threatening down to bumps & bruises. Tendons take a long time to heal sometimes need surgery. I’d suggest going to your GP asking to be referred to an Orthopaedic Consultant. The NHS does a good job most of the time with what they have. They need more Doctors Nurses but most Trusts say the same they don’t have the budget due to monetary restrictions. If you had to pay for that X-ray it would have cost you about £3,000. Be grateful you don’t have to pay it you could always go Private.

And is all that treatment free at the point of need?

You answered your own question.
What happened between 15 years ago and today?
We voted the Tories back into power to destroy the NHS. Again.
When Labour got kicked out the NHS was at its highest ever approval rating after they spent their entire time in office fixing the wreckage the Tories had made if it
And repeat.
How can you not know this?

But even 30 years ago you would not have been offered a scan for a basic sprained ankle.

I went over on my ankle on the way to work and it was throbbing but I was resllly busy and didn’t look at it until after a few hours and it was the size of a football and I could barely stand on it. Grabbed a taxi to A&E - they sent me to the minor injuries section for an x-ray.

As no broken bones they sent me home with instructions to rest, elevate and ice it and follow up with GP if not easing over the next few days. Would not have even occurred to me to want a scan for a sprain.

You got seen in 4 hrs. Lucky. A trip to A&E in northern ireland is at least an 8 hour wait and consulations in corridors. We are now a 3rd world country in terms of healthcare.

It sounds to me that you were given good care. You were examined, told there was nothing broken and there was a severe sprain and likely torn ligaments. That simply requires rest and in time, physio. If your injury was more serious, you would have had more intervention. Get over yourself.

There are no private emergency services in the UK that are accessible to everyone

I cant wait till there is no nhs, at least then we will be able to get an appointment and not have it cancelled multiple times then i can uae all the nhs money that would have been taken from my wages that i was unable to use because i could not get an appointment that was cancelled all the time to pay for it privately !

The NHS is stretched, we all know it. OP I don't think the person you saw sounds terribly helpful, and it could have been phrased and delivered better. I was with a family member in A&E recently. Family member was one of around 4 people who obviously or visibly needed medical attention due to pain or injury - I know not all things are obvious and Dr's sometimes tell people to go to A&E if something has been persistent etc as its best way to get referred if required quickly. However, (not eavesdropping, promise...couldn't help but hear) a fella came in with hus g/f having been hit in the face playing football earlier that eve. (A charity match, he enjoyed adding that into the info) He wasn't in great pain, didn't even arrive with a bag of peas on his face. No loss of consciousness or anything alarming. He'd clearly just gone there instead of actually considering some basic home First Aid, like ice and ibuprofen. He was in for a long wait, but frankly serves him right, he didn't need to be there! If there were even a few more people like this, no wonder the system is stretched! I am sorry you didn't get a bit of a better delivery of how to help yourself. I do think a scan xray is pretty good and should be done to ensure no breaks though if something could be broken.

That is almost exactly what happened to me when i sprained my ankle about 13 years ago, (no Chat GPT then of course). Went to A and E, had it x rayed, no breaks but a severe sprain. Had it strapped up and followed the intructions about RICE and slowly it recovered.

I think this says it all. The NHS is amazing for complex and emergency conditions. Specialist surgeons are worth their weight in gold.
its the other stuff which is lacking.
i hope you continue to thrive.

Have dealt with the NHS a lot during the past 2 years with my son having cancer plus some serious complications and I've had a largely positive experience. They saved his life and I'm not in massive debt like I would be in other places.

NHS isn't perfect but I don't know where I'd be without it.

Not if it was your fault!

Well, thanks to the NHS, and the incredible bravery and selflessness of a family who made a decision during the worst time imaginable, my transplanted heart is doing well.

Part of the problem is that a lack of other services and under-resourced GPs mean that all sorts of issues are being batted off to A&E. A&E have to triage them low to maintain a service for life-threatening conditions and when you are eventually seen, they don't have time for aftercare and arranging follow-ups.

You had the treatment warranted by the urgent care setting - they ascertained nothing was broken and you have a sprain.

Your next port of call is your GP who will guide you on what care you might need next including referrals for PT. And if it doesn’t respond to the regular treatment for a sprained ankle you will be referred for a scan if needed.

If you had been in the USA without insurance your ER consult and x-ray alone would have cost you about $500 for the consult and up to $2000 for the x-ray alone.

With VERY good insurance that you pay about $500 a month for you’d still have a $75 co-pay for the ER visit.

My husband was flown a short distance in an air ambulance for a serious emergency - it was touch and go. The insurance company claimed it wasn’t an emergency and he should have gone by road ambulance and sent us a bill for $50,000.

And that’s the point of the NHS.