Not selling alcohol at football is not "discrimination"

You’re missing the point. It’s not about managing without alcohol.

a cricket fan is legally allowed to have a beer in that 45 minutes. Whether they can manage without one is neither here nor there

Cricket matches usually take a bit longer than 45 minutes per innings. You're not comparing eggs with eggs.

What problem are you trying to solve by allowing alcohol into the stands at football matches?

Have you ever been to a football match?

I only attend Women's Rugby matches so can't comment on that, but I am a season ticket holder at one of the big County Grounds and go to Test Matches, ODIs etc when I can. I also attend football regularly.

The difference I see is that at the football grounds, there are an element of people that go simple for the tribal atmosphere and to antagonise the opposing fans. You simply don't get that at cricket (nor the little rugby I have seen). People are at the ground much longer for cricket, and beer is readily available. Some people drink ludicrous amounts but nobody gets abusive or violent. Nobody 'hates' anyone else in the ground. Fans of either side sit together and there is sometimes some banter, but never any aggression.
At the (professional) football matches I go to, there is always aggression and it feel tense. It is a completely different atmosphere. Adding more alcohol into that can never be a good thing.

Mainly though, as has been said earlier in the thread, I don't want to be covered in flying beer every time there is a goal or missed chance, or controversial challenge, as people leap out of their seats and fling their arms in the air.

Yes I’ve been to many as I have said

the whole point in the law is supposed to treat everyone equally, not decide alcohol is ok at cricket not at football. Which is the point AB is making

Exactly, I don't want to be covered in flying beer every time there is a goal or missed chance, or controversial challenge, as people leap out of their seats and fling their arms in the air.

Me neither. Standing at a football match is a physical experience. You stomp, clap, sing loudly, cheer, gasp, wave your arms.

What bit of that experience is improved by having a plastic cup of lager in your hand at the same time?

FWIW I don't find the atmosphere threatening or aggressive, and I wouldn't go if it were. The word I would use is rambunctious. The experience would definitely not be improved by a bunch of men chucking their beer on you and each other as they react to something on the pitch. It's a delicate balance.

Spectators at the women’s game manage to have that physical experience and hold a pint at the same time.
Perhaps we’re just not willing to waste our beer by chucking it about!

Oddly even though I've played myself and watch it on TV I've never been to a women's game other than watching DDs play. Quite a different crowd though, much more of a family atmosphere and far more women. I would trust most women not to chuck beer over me though. Middle aged men my age and older, not so much.

That’s the point i’m making!

People are discussing football fans as one homogeneous group who can’t be trusted to drink alcohol at a game. Clearly some groups can be trusted more than others!

That’s the point i’m making!

People are discussing football fans as one homogeneous group who can’t be trusted to drink alcohol at a game. Clearly some groups can be trusted more than others!

I don't have strong opinions one way or the other about Burnham and am not a football fan. I am old enough though to remember the hooliganism of the 80s. Let's not go back there.

(I would also ban the practice of watching football in a beer garden and throwing your drink all over everyone else when your side scores)

Who is being discriminated against?

Is it discrimination if a theatre prohibits glassware in the main theatre room?

So do you want to change the rules for the men's game or not?

To all the PPs extolling the behaviour of rugby fans, I take it you've never been to a St Helen's v Wigan game (for example)?

Agree with this. Burnham, clearly isn't old enough to remember the hooliganism in the grounds and bad behaviour especially in local derby days. If he thinks people have changed since then he's sadly mistaken. Especially in today's climate when people are kicking off at the drop of a hat.

Would the people who can be trusted more than others happen to share your social background? Or that of one of those middle class politicians who know what is best for us?

"‘Comrades,’ he said, ‘I trust that every animal here appreciates the sacrifice that Comrade Napoleon has made in taking this extra labour upon himself. Do not imagine, comrades, that leadership is a pleasure! On the contrary, it is a deep and heavy responsibility. No one believes more firmly than Comrade Napoleon that all animals are equal. He would be only too happy to let you make your decisions for yourselves. But sometimes you might make the wrong decisions, comrades, and then where should we be?’"

And the 5% of rugby or cricket fans? What do we do for them?

I’m not talking about social background. I’m saying a predominantly female crowd at a WSL match seem to be able to drink alcohol without being violent or disruptive.
The issue isn’t all football fans. It’s a particular type of male football fan who would be violent regardless of whether football is involved.

I get your point the men in WSL crowds might be a different demographic to those in mostly male crowds. If such men are violent regardless of football being involved then the issue becomes one of the extent to which alcohol if making them violent, or perhaps more unable to control their underlying violent tendencies. If that violence happens regardless of football then should such men be allowed to drink alcohol at all?

I think they mean middle class rugby union, the type of "rugger" they play at private schools. Not the sort that glass-makers and pie-eaters might watch.

I get your point the men in WSL crowds might be a different demographic to those in mostly male crowds. If such men are violent regardless of football being involved then the issue becomes one of the extent to which alcohol if making them violent, or perhaps more unable to control their underlying violent tendencies. If that violence happens regardless of football then should such men be allowed to drink alcohol at all?

For info in many countries (including many in Europe) it's possible to take a beer/alcoholic drink to your seat, or even get a drink (including beers) from the vendors who roam the aisle per match and during half time.

That doesn't seem to result in widespread problems with drunken fans....

I would counter that it’s not particularly the alcohol at all- before or during the game at least (the coke- probably- but already illegal)

I had a school friend who was a proper 90s football hooligan- At one point he was banned from all football stadiums and going abroad- but it was all about fighting rival gangs, not booze. Who can win a punch up smashed? They arranged the fights weeks before the match. It wasn’t random “he stepped on my foot” stuff.

How could they afford coke in the 90s? Must have been mostly asprin. Was he one of those "casuals" wearing Tacchini? The hoolies at my school in the 80s who claimed to be in the Head Hunters, or the ICF where skinheads with Harrington jackets and drainpipes. They did drink alcohol, but the craze was for sniffing glue. Such innocent times. I think the appearance of CCTV in grounds made offenders identifiable.. I think they went to lower league games for a bit of aggro, before they started getting cameras too.