To think academics are seriously entitled??

This in spades. DH is a semi retired lecturer - in his mid 70s he still works writing books and researching. He really wasn’t well paid for the number of hours he put in, but entitled, certainly not. In RG universities there is huge pressure to publish, give conference papers etc on top of teaching and tutoring.

And? A lot of people wouldn’t last a week in a school, not just academics. Same as most people, including teachers, wouldn’t have the skills to be an academic.

Where are you that a Reader gets £82k? Most professors in my RG university are not on that.

This. And it's perfectly possibly to be both a pleb and an academic.

My parents are a retired binman and a hospital cleaner, I grew up very poor and went to a shit sink estate school, was the first person in my family to stay in school past 15, but was able to get grants and scholarships all the way through to my DPhil.

DH (former academic) is from an identical background. We do exist.

Everyone moans about their job- you should hear us( retail!) They’re just luckier than most and to be fair when I was in college to get a lecturer position you had to have over a hundred scientific papers written so it’s not like they didn’t earn it in some way!!

But you do have to deal with pupils calling you a fat bitch to your face and things like that, which we do not. As well as being on your feet for up to five lessons a day with only 13 weeks respite per year. I couldn't do that personally and would burn out. I teach 6 hours a week for 20 weeks of the year (although with marking and admin, it's full-on all the time but personally I find face to face teaching the most draining). You do have better pensions, although academics at post-92 unis are also in the TPS so have equal pensions to you. Pay-wise it varies. I'm on 62k as a senior lecturer. Top of the scale is 67k. If I was promoted to Reader, the salary scale would go up to 82k. So I'd say permanent university lecturers (not fixed term or teaching fellows or hourly paid) earn at least as well or better than teachers and, for me at least, have better working conditions.

Academics are not teachers. I work with both. Believe me academics wouldn’t last a week in a school.

I am a PGR, I am also very far from privileged. So far my student loan is sitting at £60,000 with another £20,000 to be added. I am working full time in addition to researching towards my EdD. I think it is important to reach PhD level in some cases. In my area of research it shall be the only way that change is genuinely implemented for those it impacts. The alternative is to stay without the status quo and continue to have legislation, policy and practice dictated by those who no lived experience of the situations. Therefore, I agree partly with what you are saying in terms of privilege. However, I originally graduated in 2008 and could not re-start (2016) and complete my MA until 2019 then had a short wait for the PhD loans to be offered. In that way at the playing field is a tad more equal than pre-2016. When you were excluded if you did not have the financial means no matter how academically capable you are.

Did you discuss politics with them?

Have to say as a teacher I am not remotely envious. Sounds like we earn more and have significantly better pensions and job security ...

Yes and No

DS is an academic. He brought home firsts and developed his PhD into a four star monograph swiftly. He got two Post Doc roles in the UK but has had to move to another continent fir a oermanent job in the Humanities. He is an active researcher and regularly publishing. With his quals he could have entered a different sector and could be earning double or triple now. But he didn't want to. He works long hours but loves his discipline and agrees when he works, outside of teaching and faculty commitments, he can work very flexibly. He is eligible for a sabbatical.

However, I also work in the sector and whilst there are many academics who give it their all, there are an equal number who are not publishing much of quality or quantity or even bidding for research funding. They are the ones who decline alternative duties and complain bitterly about taking on addituonal teaching because their research allowances have been cut after several years of being non productive. I shall not comment about how some of the second cohort speak to support staff. It is excrutiating.

I've worked directly with academics for 15 years and there are academics and then academics, like in most industries. Some of them are absolutely brilliant and grossly underpaid. Some of them are incompetent and grossly overpaid. The brilliant ones end up being asked to do more, because they will do it well, and the rubbish ones tend to be given as little as possible.

You have no idea what it’s like to be an academic and your naive judgement isn’t cool.

You don’t know or understand the hours of prep, the hours of marking, office hours, lecturing, study groups, supervision of masters and phd students, constantly under pressure to publish and apply for grants and money, entitled children who think they should have better grades, entitled parents who barge into offices and demand grades for their kids, low pay etc etc etc.

YABVu

I think this reveals your real issue.

It's ok for people to be more educated than you. It doesn't mean you are 'less than' and it doesn't mean they despise you (though you clearly feel chippy about it).

The hours are not minimal!

my dad was a uni lecturer until he retired and the marking was insane.

The egos are absolutely hilarious, the pettiness unbelievable. And yes, you're correct, promotion doesn't always depend on merit. Pathetic indeed.

A lot of academics have long commutes – before I was able to get a job where I live, for example, my commute was two hours each way. There are lots of reasons for commuting, including that many academics have to shift university if they want a new job – and that may mean moving to a different part of the country, or indeed world. Over time it can be increasingly difficult to simply pack up one's life and relocate, so people will accept a lengthy commute instead.

At my previous university, I had a supportive timetabling officer who did his best to schedule my teaching so it was concentrated over 2-3 days during term time. He also tried to avoid early morning starts, although at times this was impossible, so I'd have to leave home at 6.30am and pay £££ on a peak train ticket for the privilege of conducting a 9.00am lecture to 30 students (for a class with 150 students enrolled).

As others have said, academics undertake a huge amount of unpaid overtime. The workload is relentless and, frankly, impossible.

The pay ranges from miserable to decent, although in some areas (I'm in one – law), one would be paid hugely more to be in industry/practice. It is quite depressing to think that recent graduates are on six-figure salaries at Magic Circle firms when they can barely be left unsupervised to write a legal letter!

To this we can add that many academics are facing redundancy due to existential threats in the sector.

So no, academics are not entitled, and the complaints are fair enough!

only if you’re a lazy academic

Why? It's a horrible thing to say.

Some people are lazy. It was not in academia that I met the worst offenders on that front, personally. Especially because job security is the way it is now.

I work for a consultancy that did a project at a uni once. What surprised me is the academic ego is vast, and mountains are moved to soothe the ego. Having always worked in private companies where people are driven by a profit motive, it’s odd to hear grown adults having a hissy fit because prof x has more people working for them / a bigger office / less teaching. Quite pathetic.

They are surprisingly poorly paid on the whole unless you move up the ranks, and I’m not convinced the promotion up the ranks is entirely based on merit either. Seems like a crap environment to work in.

But there are those people 'in academia' who get away with doing the bare minimum. We all know at least one of those, surely? Research is a broad church.

I don’t know who you met, but my father was an extremely skilled research chemist and was not remotely entitled. He did not receive a promotion or pay rise for many years due to being the kind of modest and hardworking person who would never ask for this kind of thing. He did not get university holidays off, contrary to what many people seem to think, because scientific research happens all year round. He was genuinely paid very little by the end of his career compared with what he would have been paid in industry, however he was a relatively shy and retiring person who would not have uprooted his family to follow his own career.
I’m sure all academics are different, but I believe many do amazing things, especially on the scientific side, and they are generally not especially well paid, and nowadays don’t even have permanent contracts.

Whaaaaat? OMG, that is the limit!