To be shocked at ‘school readiness’

Agree .

I wonder how many kids have been in full time nursery since less than a year old though.

Admittedly I don’t have kids and I’m sure lots of you will come along saying “my kids went to nursery at 6 weeks old 7 days a week and they all turned out fine” but realistically, how much parenting can parents actually do if your child spend most of their waking hours as one of a dozen or more kids with multiple different carers.

We hope that kids are learning all this stuff at nursery or at the weekend with their parents but are they really?

Blair's government had basic TV adverts showing parents how to teach toddlers and four and five year olds basic skills such as counting in everyday life e.g. counting steps aloud as you walk up them.
Now they would be tracing parents how to teach their kids even more basic skills.

I think it's not something they are expected to do often. Manners and basic courtesy aren't seen as a necessity.

I also think lots of parents talk negatively about teachers/tutors/other adults in front of children and set a bad example by the way they treat people themselves.

I encourage them to use basic manners and have ended tuition due to really rude behavior a few times as I got fed up with children refusing to join in conversation or even acknowledge a question, not even bothering to reply when I said hello or goodbye. (I'm not including those who genuinely find this challenging - I have a selective mute who sends me little messages or emojis to communicate.)

I've just finished tuition with 38 students (as they were ready to sit their 11 plus).

Five or six said thank you and goodbye.

The others simply ended the Zoom call. I said goodbye and good luck. They clicked a button...

Two parents have messaged me to say goodbye/thank you. Two!

I would have been utterly ashamed of my daughter if she had done that.

Before anyone says, it's not because it's on zoom. I experienced similar when I taught in person but got utterly fed up with the behavior of parents and children at my house.

My disabled son could read his name long before starting school (hyperlexia) but he was completely unable to put his coat on. His 1:1 LSA finished her ‘shift’ before the end of the school day and the class teacher refused to help him. So he was being despatched into the playground in midwinter with no coat on. Even though the school knew he had a problem with maintaining his core temperature. When I raised this with the teacher, she claimed it wasn’t happening. She was a fabulous teacher in terms of actually teaching, but was clearly not remotely interested in SEN or meeting the needs of those pupils. Fortunately this was just one teacher - but it was a shame she was in Reception!

Brilliant for them, mine were early readers too. But as I’ve explained already, literacy rates in England are not impressive so not all parents have the skills or the time to teach their children to read and therefore expect it to be taught at school. I’m surprised anyone would be surprised a that!

As we’ve established, guidance is in fact that children can recognise their name rather than read it, or any other words.

I’m not sure what you’re achieving by pointing this out. We have daycare for tiny babies here too, my response was in the thread about children starting school earlier in the UK than elsewhere and the suggestion that this was about getting parents back to work. There are more working parents in Finland but formal schooling (ie must legally attend) begins later.

Lots of good evidence from Finland that nursery is very positive for kids, likely because is much better funded and therefore consistent (which is one of the principles of Finnish education after all!) and accessible.

But not the point that was being made.

How lovely for your DD to have the skills😊 What did your daughter do before nursery? Was she just at home with you?

Why? My DC2 could read simple chapter books at age 3. They were taught some early phonics at nursery school and just took it from there, for fun. Don't underestimate what children can do. Children are not all the same, obviously, but plenty of people push them down with a culture of low expectations. Lots of other countries have higher expectations.

Recognising your name isn't reading really, it's recognising a single word.

I literally grew up in Soviet Union. You could leave your babies even before 12months at a 24 hour kindergarten - one of my uni friends done that. I went to one from around 1 year old. Mum used to drop me off at 8am and pick up at 6pm.

Maybe not 1 but a bit older actually, but still - I was a toddler. I remember missing her like nothing else.

Did you read the age attached to the comment I quoted.. 🙄

Apparently something like three-quarters of children attend preschool before reception these days. So in the event OP's claims are actually true, this would be the preschool's fault as much as the parents'. Unless OP happens to work in an extremely deprived area where the parents are all rubbish and preschool take-up is exceedingly low?

Being babysat by an iPad is not a consideration approach to parenting, it's not Gentle parenting, it is at best accidental parenting, at worst, neglect!

https://yle.fi/a/74-20187063

Yes because it's not actually reading. They don't have to know the individual letters and what they mean, but it is simply recognising their name written down. In the way I might be able to recognise a name written in Arabic, although I can't read Arabic.

And Finland will have a higher proportion of latchkey kids as school hours are shorter but childcare provision in doesn’t really extend to the older years of Primary.

Pre-school is from 6.

I don’t understand this as a reason. My children (now aged late 20s/eariy 30s) also started school at 4. Pretty sure this wasn’t an issue then. So all the people saying it’s due to the school age being so young - why is this a growing problem now?

My guess (and I may be wrong if someone is able offer up a better, logical reason) is the rise of permissive/lazy parenting. Parents seem increasingly scared to put appropriate boundaries in place. Parents seem to have low distress tolerance thresholds & are unable to sit with their child’s emotions (eg. at being told no). Therefore. they give in to demands rather than providing a safe, secure and consistent boundary around appropriate behaviour and expectations.

I work with teens (mental health) and I’m seeing the growing fallout from this. Oh and a trend for pathologising these behaviours. As well as expecting professionals to wave our (imaginary) magic wands to fix the issues that they created/exacerbated.

Fair enough, as I said not been my experience but I looked up the DfE guidance and says ‘recognising the pattern of their name’ https://startingreception.co.uk/

Do you think schools expect children to be able to read their own name on arrival? Of course some can but it’s not an expectation

It is an expectation, and a reasonable one.

Most 4 yo's should definitely be able to recognise their written first names. Assuming no SEN and that parents have bothered to teach them to.

As an ex-teacher of 25 years it has absolutely been a basic expectation for starting reception.

Read your own name.
Go to the toilet independently.
Get dressed independently.
Sit and listen.
Follow instructions.
Eat with cutlery.

Yes - and go to nursery/pre school prior to that.