To be shocked at ‘school readiness’

The point, as several posters have said, is that it is statistically extremely unlikely that 90% of the class has SEN. You and others keep talking about children not necessarily being diagnosed at four. Everyone agrees that is the case, but it doesn’t account for the fact that most of OP’s class has these issues with school readiness. They can’t all have undiagnosed SEN.

It’s ridiculous

This just shows how out of touch you are though.

Plenty of people are dropping dc off to breakfast club or a childminder at 7am so they can then do their commute. My colleagues child would still be half asleep.

I can believe this. My neighbour's little girl has just started reception class. She won't eat anything unless she's sat in front of a screen and hits her mum if she tries to say no to anything. She walked on the kitchen table while I was there having a cup of tea. There is no bedtime routine and she doesn't sleep till after 10!

I can't imagine trying to control a whole class of children who have basically been "brought up" by screens!

Really? It’s because they didn’t wear coats over summer so they have forgotten how to dress themselves? For a start I think that is a very weak assertion. Also, did the parent not think it might be a good idea to give them a refresher course. This is one of the more minor points and it’s not just one issue.
Teacher after teacher is telling you this is replicated in other schools - not all - and you choose to refute one minor points. The issue is there are a collection of behaviours that demonstrate that these children have not been parent correctly.
Another point is someone said parents these days are time poor. Firstly, parents have always worked. Secondly, in the world before modern washing machines, dryers, dishwashers, air fryers housework took up way, way more time.

I was just agreeing with you really @owlsatnight

@DeftGoldHedgehogI could read (well) starting school and it really was not the norm. My school is still considered one of the “best” in London and I can guarantee today’s pupils are of a much higher calibre.

Ritalin prescriptions in the US became really mainstream in the 1980s IIRC, which was because people were seeing the behavioural issues of ADHD in school and searching for ways to help dc.

I have some interesting stats written down about children and behaviour problems from 1999 somewhere.

I think there’s a lot of romanticising about the past.

But the commute happens (at least to the drop off parent) after they get to school - can people not get up a bit earlier to have 10 minutes to teach their child to put their shoes and coat on before they leave the house?

These things that can really help a teacher out take such a small amount of time, for a small number of days, until you can just say “come on coat shoes”

It feels like many people don’t understand that a 4 year old has an amazing young brain in their head that is capable of so many things that with some guidance can pick this stuff up very quickly. Biology hasn’t changed.

It doesn’t take that long. It isn’t that hard and it’s actually fun seeing your child be pleased with themselves when they achieve things. Do parents not enjoy seeing their children do these things anymore? Or enjoy teaching them the basic parental stuff anymore?

You have to eat regardless of how busy you are, so why can’t some children use a fork?

It’s lazy, and depressing that so many parents don’t have the love and care to put in a small amount of regular effort to teach their child how to be a functioning human.

It’s not that hard.

Thanks @muminherts i misinterpreted your post!

What point are you trying to make @MagicUser1because things have changed? What was acceptable for me when I was dc are now considered neglectful and parents generally do not do them.

No, it isn't. Actual parenting has been in decline and gotten considerably worse over the past 15 years in many areas.

There’s another thread going at the moment by a mum whose 5 year old has been given one by their school to watch youtube on! some people are saying it’s normal

but yeh i don’t know any parents who would do that either

Nonsense. I recall well in 1980 each child having an image by their name in reception class and Y1 to help with name recognition, and not being able to read my name written down, even though I could read when I was 3.

Sorry I meant those little lists of school readiness parents get given. I remember one with things on it like toilet trained, can put on own coat, change for PE

Plus the TV channels were swamped with shows about bringing up children.

This is why we do the slow start( hated by so many parents!) Small groups of children at a time so you can show them where their coats go and lay down the expectation. Small groups expected to sit on the carpet and listen to a story and they do. Once they join together they know the basic rules.
If you have 30 arriving at once of course coats will go everywhere and if you having that even after several preparation days I would be rude enough to say you haven't done your job very well.

Just to add for the people having a pop at the op . My family have been in scouting all their lives. One relative 50+ yrs . They can unbiasedly describe the change in the children who attended. Crafts that they have done for years taking much longer as the children can’t do it like the could 10 / 20 years ago. Children who struggle to use scissors and simple hand to eye coordination.

Then there’s parents who think they can not reply to messages to pay for camps and then tuun up on the day and pay with no concept that you need the payment to lay out for the trip. They have little concept of the word no themselves. Threats to volunteer to complain about them for their own inept shitness . At least the volunteers can walk which they are doing. Locally 1980 18 cub packs in town 2026 2 cub packs . Lists as long as your arm to get kids in zero’ volunteers for leaders .

Romans did not realise Rome had fallen!!

I've never seen why this is seen at all relevant.

Firstly, most countries where the compulsory school age is older, the vast majority of children go to kindergarten, which often is far less play based than our early years.

But also it's not a teacher saying "children of this age are too young always", she's noticing a change in the children of the same age.

So this age children used to be for the majority school ready, and now the majority aren't.
That's a concern.

If you haven't taught any if the 5yos how to recognise their own name, then it's no surprise they can't. If you've tried to teach them all and 28/30 can do it, it's reasonable to assume those two need more intervention. If you just say not to worry, you are missing an opportunity to help them, and it's their disadvantage, however comforting it might be at the time, for you to pretend it's totally fine.

My observation from my children is that expectations have gone down. That might make life easier for children at the time, but it's either shifting the problem until they're older or ignoring it.
Having got a dc with adhd and asd, yes it can be tough, but I also noted that if I lower the expectation, then he didn't wake up one morning and was suddenly able and willing to do it. He then didn't think he could do it, so didn't put in any effort to try, so couldn't do it.
For example my determined dd with one hand learnt to put her socks on at 18 months. Ds was asking me to do it at 4yo, until I insisted he tried. Yes the first few times he did need to be shown how, and a bit of help, but if I continued putting them on for him, he'd have continued expecting me to do it. As it was, within a week he could do it and rarely needed help.

It isn’t about being ‘asked’ if they recognise the name though is it…
I am sure your DC and my DC would have recognised their own name by reception because we had spent time with them, they had things like mugs or books with their name on, writing it out for them when we did craft and painting, cards they got sent by friends and family, the little pictures they have on their wall etc. I don’t think the OP means that she sat them down and said do you recognise it….more that do they see something they’ve seen already and associate it with their name .

I am not making decisions for my children based on the potential for being judged should something happen to them. And if other people are, thats batshit.

I definitely did get judged for allowing ds out and about in year 5. A few parents made comments to me. Tough shit. Yes, there were risks, but i judged the importance of him learning in the relatively safe environment of our community outweighed those small risks.

You cant protect them forever so you need to equip them with tools.

Me too. It has steadily got worse every single year since I started. They cannot do a single thing independently. It’s exhausting isn’t it.

What era are you referring to as new parents 20 years ago were offered loads more information about child development, guidance and active help from professionals especially at the baby stage but also in school?

Yes yabvu I’m an ex eyfs teacher and I’ve had kids this age myself. The whole point is to teach them these things, like how to be at school.