Please or to access all these features

AIBU?

Share your dilemmas and get honest opinions from other Mumsnetters.

to leave ten year old twins in a cafe while I swim?

929 replies

justkeepswimminginalake · 03/09/2026 20:45

I’m a single parent to ten year old twins and I was hoping to start open water swimming again. There’s a swimming lake near me which has an onsite cafe and I was thinking about leaving the boys in the cafe by themselves while I swim. We’ve been to the cafe a few times and it’s fairly chilled, mostly swimmers (and their friends/families), young families and old people. It’s also next door to the reception area for the swimming lakes so if they feel uncomfortable there’s somewhere else they can go.

Would I be unreasonable to order them breakfast and a drink and leave them there for half an hour while I swim. They’re generally pretty sensible and I’d pack Yotos with headphones, and some games and books for them to entertain themselves. There’s no one else who can take them.

OP posts:
LimpRat · 05/09/2026 07:35

Near open water?! With presumably half naked swimming men wandering about(?)

No way. I'm fairly relaxed, but absolutely no way. If you got into trouble in the water, who would sort them out? You will have to sort actual childcare or wait a few years.

TheEdgyMoose · 05/09/2026 07:33

SquirrelGG · 05/09/2026 04:22

Is this a UK thing? I live elsewhere, near two primary schools, and often see quite little kids getting themselves home from school, either alone or with their friends. I was off to high school at 10 years old and had been walking to school by myself for years before that.

It's an England thing I think. I'm in Scotland and children walk to and from school themselves from age 7/8 here. For some reason they are much more cautious in England. Must be a new thing though because I grew up in England and was definitely walking home by myself before age 10.

cannynotsay · 05/09/2026 07:30

Wouldn’t leaving them at home be safer? If they’re this sensible.

FoldItIn · 05/09/2026 07:30

Do not waste your time debating with the nutjobs @justkeepswimminginalake

Go swimming, the kids will be fine. Be thankful you have raised two children capable of independence.

JassyRadlett · 05/09/2026 07:28

Peakyblinder18 · 05/09/2026 00:50

@justkeepswimminginalake two 10 year old twin boys left alone in a cafe while you indulge yourself. Fine I hope it works well and it was worth the risk.

Can you explain the risks to us?

JassyRadlett · 05/09/2026 07:21

Pantomime2 · 05/09/2026 03:06

Why are you pretending not to understand simple concepts?

As stated "If ten year olds walk into a cafe, the owner/servers gets to decide if they want to serve unaccompanied minors and know exactly what's going on. If an over entitled middle class mummy does a bait and switch and leaves little Jasper and Jemima behind that's incredible over entitlement. Cafe workers are not your au pairs and did not agree to be your unpaid childcare."

It's not complicated. If she wants, she can send her kids to the shops on their own with money. She can leave them home alone.

She doesn't want that. She doesn't think they're ok on their own. She wants cafe workers to be their proxy childcare.

So send them out to the shops with money to spend, or leave them home alone, but do not try to pull a bait and switch so you have unpaid carers around. She does not trust they will be ok on their own. She wants backup. And she's decided the cafe owners can be her unpaid aupairs.

She's trying to sneakily ensure they have unpaid carers around because she does not think they're ok on their own. If she thought that, she'd leave them home alone for an hour. It's just not complex.

I always love it when people are so determined to stick to their own narrative and ascribe the motivations to an OP that they desperately want to be true, that they ignore inconvenient facts that fatally undermine that narrative.

Like the fact that OP does already leave the kids home alone sometimes, but rightly thinks that length of time left and parental proximity are relevant at this age.

Moonnstarz · 05/09/2026 07:12

If the OP simply asked would it be ok for two 10 year olds to go to the park unsupervised then everyone would be telling her it's fine and that their kids have been playing out since they were six and how overprotective she must be! As already mentioned the thread where it was fine for a 12 year old to supervise a 5 year old at the park got many people saying that's fine, which to me is higher risk.

I agree with the person who said its because she is doing something for herself. Either people are jealous about that or resentful for some reason.

justkeepswimminginalake · 05/09/2026 06:53

jacks11 · 05/09/2026 01:11

No, it’s not ok to leave minors in a cafe and this responsibility with the staff. I’m sure they are sensible, but you aren’t going to be immediately contactable if something goes wrong and at 10 years old they may well not be equipped to deal with anything that does go awry- however unlikely that might be.

My dd worked out an activity centre and they had an issue where 2 children were left whilst a parent was busy doing something. They had a tiff and one walked out into the car park, where there was sn accident; the parent was not immediately available- not far, but was doing one the activities and staff could not immediately identify them/they had to be alerted an make their way back- ambulance called and it was really awful for the children involved and the staff too. I also know that police had brief involvement (as staff could not identify the responsible adult initially) and there was a referral to social work. That is just one unlikely, but potentially serious, scenario of what could go wrong- even with normally sensible and well behaved young children. It’s not a risk I would take, personally.

I would be contactable. I was always going to bring my phone in my tow float so I could hear it ring, but posters upthread suggested a watch which I would definitely get if I choose to swim with the boys in the cafe. They could message me, would ping on my watch and I’d probably be able to be with them in two minutes. It’s a small lake and probably no more than a minute to the cafe (though I’ll ask to head down to the lakeside and time today because it’s been a while since I’ve been).

I’m aware that people can act unpredictably and no one can say for sure how they will react in a given scenario, let alone someone else, but if I though a situation like that was remotely likely I wouldn’t do it. I hope the kids from that situation were ok in the end.

OP posts:
justkeepswimminginalake · 05/09/2026 06:44

Pantomime2 · 05/09/2026 03:06

Why are you pretending not to understand simple concepts?

As stated "If ten year olds walk into a cafe, the owner/servers gets to decide if they want to serve unaccompanied minors and know exactly what's going on. If an over entitled middle class mummy does a bait and switch and leaves little Jasper and Jemima behind that's incredible over entitlement. Cafe workers are not your au pairs and did not agree to be your unpaid childcare."

It's not complicated. If she wants, she can send her kids to the shops on their own with money. She can leave them home alone.

She doesn't want that. She doesn't think they're ok on their own. She wants cafe workers to be their proxy childcare.

So send them out to the shops with money to spend, or leave them home alone, but do not try to pull a bait and switch so you have unpaid carers around. She does not trust they will be ok on their own. She wants backup. And she's decided the cafe owners can be her unpaid aupairs.

She's trying to sneakily ensure they have unpaid carers around because she does not think they're ok on their own. If she thought that, she'd leave them home alone for an hour. It's just not complex.

I have said multiple times on this thread I don’t want cafe workers to be childcare because the kids don’t need any amount of caring to eat their breakfast and read a book. Some posters clearly don’t believe me on this point and I’m running out of ways to say it. If taking an order from customers, bringing the requested items to the table, then clearing the plates afterwards is unpaid childcare, then apparently I still require an au pair in a cafe too.

There are no shops for them to wander around by the lake. I’ve explained several times why my initial thought was them to be at the cafe rather than home and none of the reasons was that I expect anyone at the cafe do do anything for my children beyond what they’d do for any other customer. The lake and cafe is probably a mile from the nearest village, and given the village is small and the roads are narrow and winding it’s not the kind of place where kids would just wander into, and if refused service it’s not like a shopping mall where they could try Costa next. I dare say that two ten year olds walking in on their own wouldn’t be refused service regardless of the cafe’s policy because there’d be nowhere else for them to go. But if I was with them initially and they’re not happy for the boys to stay them they can just say that to me and I won’t leave them.

OP posts:
Bjorkdidit · 05/09/2026 05:52

cheeseomelette · 04/09/2026 22:30

Christ, we’ve just returned from Asia where tiny kids were running around the town on their own in the evenings. Totally different attitude there and no dramas that we saw.

2 sensible 10 year olds should be absolutely fine for a short period of time.

There's a programme on Netflix called Old Enough that's about 6 YOs in Japan learning independence and doing things like taking themselves to school and being responsible for their own house key. I always think of that when half of MN insists their 10 or 14 YO isn't old enough for basic life skills.

SquirrelGG · 05/09/2026 04:22

BrighterDaysAhead2026 · 03/09/2026 22:21

Round here it is generally not until Y6 they start walking home.

Is this a UK thing? I live elsewhere, near two primary schools, and often see quite little kids getting themselves home from school, either alone or with their friends. I was off to high school at 10 years old and had been walking to school by myself for years before that.

Pantomime2 · 05/09/2026 03:14

CypressGrove · 05/09/2026 03:12

Pretty sure I suggested she'd send them in on their own and let the cafe decide rather than pulling the 'bait and switch'.

Then there was no need to quote me, since I had already stated that children entering on their own was a different issue, as that ways the employees get to choose from the outset if they are ok with unaccompanied minors. It's not OPs place to make that choice for them.

And the only reason I quoted you was because you were pretending it was insane or unreasonable to object if people sneakily choose to use you as a creche without telling you.

CypressGrove · 05/09/2026 03:12

Pantomime2 · 05/09/2026 03:06

Why are you pretending not to understand simple concepts?

As stated "If ten year olds walk into a cafe, the owner/servers gets to decide if they want to serve unaccompanied minors and know exactly what's going on. If an over entitled middle class mummy does a bait and switch and leaves little Jasper and Jemima behind that's incredible over entitlement. Cafe workers are not your au pairs and did not agree to be your unpaid childcare."

It's not complicated. If she wants, she can send her kids to the shops on their own with money. She can leave them home alone.

She doesn't want that. She doesn't think they're ok on their own. She wants cafe workers to be their proxy childcare.

So send them out to the shops with money to spend, or leave them home alone, but do not try to pull a bait and switch so you have unpaid carers around. She does not trust they will be ok on their own. She wants backup. And she's decided the cafe owners can be her unpaid aupairs.

She's trying to sneakily ensure they have unpaid carers around because she does not think they're ok on their own. If she thought that, she'd leave them home alone for an hour. It's just not complex.

Pretty sure I suggested she'd send them in on their own and let the cafe decide rather than pulling the 'bait and switch'.

Pantomime2 · 05/09/2026 03:06

CypressGrove · 05/09/2026 02:44

What? The cafes around here have no issues taking money from children for their milkshakes and cakes etc. If they don't want the custom they are free to turn it away.

Why are you pretending not to understand simple concepts?

As stated "If ten year olds walk into a cafe, the owner/servers gets to decide if they want to serve unaccompanied minors and know exactly what's going on. If an over entitled middle class mummy does a bait and switch and leaves little Jasper and Jemima behind that's incredible over entitlement. Cafe workers are not your au pairs and did not agree to be your unpaid childcare."

It's not complicated. If she wants, she can send her kids to the shops on their own with money. She can leave them home alone.

She doesn't want that. She doesn't think they're ok on their own. She wants cafe workers to be their proxy childcare.

So send them out to the shops with money to spend, or leave them home alone, but do not try to pull a bait and switch so you have unpaid carers around. She does not trust they will be ok on their own. She wants backup. And she's decided the cafe owners can be her unpaid aupairs.

She's trying to sneakily ensure they have unpaid carers around because she does not think they're ok on their own. If she thought that, she'd leave them home alone for an hour. It's just not complex.

CypressGrove · 05/09/2026 02:44

This reply has been deleted

Message deleted by MNHQ. Here's a link to our Talk Guidelines.

What? The cafes around here have no issues taking money from children for their milkshakes and cakes etc. If they don't want the custom they are free to turn it away.

Pantomime2 · 05/09/2026 02:40

This reply has been deleted

Message deleted by MNHQ. Here's a link to our Talk Guidelines.

CypressGrove · 05/09/2026 02:38

Might be a good idea to send them in on their own but wait outside to see if they cafe owners are like some of the horrified people on this thread or more reasonable/sane. If they are served etc you can then go swimming otherwise you'll have to arrange something else.

Pantomime2 · 05/09/2026 02:26

If ten year olds walk into a cafe, the owner/servers gets to decide if they want to serve unaccompanied minors and know exactly what's going on. If an over entitled middle class mummy does a bait and switch and leaves little Jasper and Jemima behind that's incredible over entitlement. Cafe workers are not your au pairs and did not agree to be your unpaid childcare.

So obviously, don't do that.

If they're fine to be left alone leave them home.

wandawaves · 05/09/2026 01:45

My initial thoughts actually weren't from safety perspective; as I think that is fairly ok IMO.

My thoughts were about the impact on others, ie wasting a table at a cafe, and if they get loud and rowdy and bother other customers and the staff. But as you said you would buy them breakfast and only be half an hour or so, that solves the concern about the table. So it's whether they can behave and sit nicely would be the only thing I'd worry about.

jacks11 · 05/09/2026 01:11

No, it’s not ok to leave minors in a cafe and this responsibility with the staff. I’m sure they are sensible, but you aren’t going to be immediately contactable if something goes wrong and at 10 years old they may well not be equipped to deal with anything that does go awry- however unlikely that might be.

My dd worked out an activity centre and they had an issue where 2 children were left whilst a parent was busy doing something. They had a tiff and one walked out into the car park, where there was sn accident; the parent was not immediately available- not far, but was doing one the activities and staff could not immediately identify them/they had to be alerted an make their way back- ambulance called and it was really awful for the children involved and the staff too. I also know that police had brief involvement (as staff could not identify the responsible adult initially) and there was a referral to social work. That is just one unlikely, but potentially serious, scenario of what could go wrong- even with normally sensible and well behaved young children. It’s not a risk I would take, personally.

Timeforachange26 · 05/09/2026 00:51

Swarthysandwich543 · 04/09/2026 16:48

You’ve never seen the sign, “no unaccompanied minors”? Really?

Not in a cafe no. In pubs yes⁸

Peakyblinder18 · 05/09/2026 00:50

@justkeepswimminginalake two 10 year old twin boys left alone in a cafe while you indulge yourself. Fine I hope it works well and it was worth the risk.

BringBackCatsEyes · 05/09/2026 00:49

PixieTales · 04/09/2026 23:03

My point is if they are sensible enough to sit on their own in a cafe for half and hour then of course they are more than fine to be at home for 1 hour where they are much safer and probably happier!

But let’s be honest OP says she doesn’t expect staff to look after them but she is assuming they will keep an eye. What if there were no staff it was just a seating area would she be happy to leave them then? I doubt it.

I think 2 10 year olds sitting on a bench near a lake are probably safer than being at home.

maudelovesharold · 05/09/2026 00:43

Cornucopia55 · 04/09/2026 23:25

Prize for the most ludicrous response on the thread so far! Unless you were being sarcastic, which I kind of hope you were....

Edited

I’ll stick my neck out here and take a wild stab that @Cherrytree86’s post was not meant to be taken seriously, other than as a comment on the number of posters on here who seem to think that treating your 10 year olds to breakfast in a cafe while you have a swim for half an hour is the act of a mother who is shirking her duty and putting her children’s lives in danger for her own selfish pleasure!

ReadingSoManyThreads · 05/09/2026 00:41

justkeepswimminginalake · 04/09/2026 07:56

Wow a lot of responses, so here’s some answers to the most common points. Their birthday is in February so pretty much in the middle of the academic year. In terms of what independence they have, they walk down the road to friends, to the park, to our local sweet shop in town which involves crossing our minor road and using a zebra crossing, and if we need a few bits from a shop on our way home I often pull up and one of them goes into to the shop on his own. I’ll leave them at home to nip out to the shop, if I walk maybe 20-30 minutes. I see them going into town and buying sweets as more risky than sitting in a cafe. They haven’t used public transport alone and their independence other than the park seems to mostly be walking to places rather than staying in places. I need to start working on public transport because one wants to try secondary school next year and I think his brother will follow so I need to get them both confident on the bus together and separately.

I can’t go while they’re at school because they don’t go to school. They’re home educated while I work from home. Even if they were in school, I can’t take 90 minutes from my work day to go swimming. It’s just me and the boys and there’s no family nearby who can watch them while I swim. We have local friends I would happily call on in an emergency but a weekly standing childcare arrangement in the evening or at the weekend for 90 minutes at a time, which probably wouldn’t need to be reciprocated feels like piss taking to me. I’m not convinced there are many childminders who would want those times either and calling on a local teen I don’t know feels riskier than them being on their own. As for going for a swim while they’re in a class, it’s 20 minutes away from the nearest town where there’s anything happening and they’re quite busy with activities already and one of them in particular would really resist the idea.

They are generally sensible boys, and while of course they have their moments with silliness and winding each other up, I have no doubts about their ability to sit at a table for half an hour while I swim and if I did then I wouldn’t have thought of it. There was no expectation that the cafe would be childcare because at ten years old, they don’t need looking after for such a short period. This plan only just occurred to me today when one of them asked to go to the cafe, so I hadn’t considered other options which have come up such as leaving them at home, or getting an Apple Watch so I could see calls and texts coming in from them.

IAs for if they can swim with me, I double checked the lake’s rules because I had in my head they were too young and they can’t swim until 11. One of them would call the police on me himself if I suggested getting into a lake in February, the other might be up for joining me but they feel safer together to me and all the times we’ve been to the cafe by the lake, neither have been interested in swimming. That might be because they prefer to go paddle boarding though.

I could drown, or they could choke but those risks seem tiny. They’re old enough to go to the kitchen and grab snacks without me knowing, and I could drown in the bath. We could all get injured in a car accident on the way over. I just don’t consider those risks high enough to outweigh the benefits of them having more independence and me getting to swim.

I still haven’t decided what to do. I was pretty shocked by the initial blanket negativity and posters saying I should be arrested. Even though I thought it would be a discussion I didn’t expect the strength of feeling about it. I was thinking fifteen minutes after I posted that it was a totally terrible idea, but now the thread is more mixed, I’m considering it more again. I think my plan is to go to the cafe with the boys, give them some money and let them order and sit alone in the cafe while I’m outside (in the cafe outdoor seating out of view) to test run and see how it works when I’m out of sight, but also there. Then take it from there. I feel confident they’ll be fine because they have the carrot of breakfast out and cake every week if we do go ahead. I think it will be good for them to have that extra independence, and also to see me doing something I want to do and they have to sit and wait while I do will be good for them as well. I can’t see how it would be a problem for the cafe if it became a regular thing either. They’d be two extra regular customers who would be as much bother as any other customer.

I think that’s most points answered.

From one home educating parent to another - just go do it. Don't let the ones freaking out put you off!!