AIBU to ask what is happening in Middlesbrough at the moment?

I know Middlesbrough well. There are some lovely houses in Nunthorpe, like any area it has some wealthy areas. However in general the town is one of the most deprived areas in the country. I would describe it as small pockets of wealth rather than a 'town of two halves'.

What should society have done differently? Genuine question?

Oh come on.

I don't know the area at all, so I just looked on Rightmove to get an idea of housing.

You've got 3 bed semis in Ormesby selling for £80,000:
https://www.rightmove.co.uk/properties/169806932?utm_campaign=property-details&utm_content=buying&utm_medium=sharing&utm_source=copytoclipboard#/&channel=RES_BUY

Or you've got detached houses literally no more than a five minute drive up the road in Nunthorpe selling for a million:
https://www.rightmove.co.uk/properties/88038354?utm_campaign=property-details&utm_content=buying&utm_medium=sharing&utm_source=copytoclipboard#/&channel=RES_BUY

Don't say "Where are the beautiful houses and wealth".

Someone upthread said it's a town of two halves, and indeed it is.

If you were a young man, brought up in extreme poverty, with poverty and bleakness all around you, and parents or a single parent using drugs and alcohol around you, a school system that likely failed you, and you left school with no qualifications, had no college or trainjng course to go on to, no adults invested in trying to help or support you in finding the right path in life, couldn't get anyone to employ you for a job so earnt no money and found yourself trapped in the cycle of poverty, and on a 5 minute drive round your town you saw houses like the 2nd link I posted, saw their cars on the drive, knew how well they lived whilst you faced zero prospects....I think eventually you'd start feeling angry.
And anger combined with the feeling of an unfair life (these young men didn't ask to be born into poverty) and absolutely no hope for their futures whilst surrounded by organised criminals preying on them and dangling promises in front of them saying "Do this job for me and I'll pay you money for it" in order to lure them in......sorry, but you're going to take it. And once you do, you're trapped. Trapped by crime. Trapped by violence. Trapped by threats to your life, to your families' lives. Real threats that you know will be carried out if you don't do what they tell you.

A lot of people are looking at this from the comfort of their middle class lives, which is why they can't understand. I'm not for a second excusing what these 5 males in the car did. But they weren't born bad. Their lives and experiences and what they've been exposed to since birth made them the people they turned in to.
And in my opinion, that's the fault of our society and of our successive local and national governments.

Apologies, I’ve not read the whole thread but my understanding is that the 7 year old girl and her aunt who were the victims in the house fire murder were connected to one of the boys who died in the A66 crash and police are not ruling out that it could be linked to people who rammed the house of one of the boys’ father which was the start of the whole incident.

Low education, low aspirations, no regard for the law or sense of personal responsibility, yes. But I'm not convinced you can blame government neglect or lack of investment.

Did you miss the post where @GarlicAnything said:

"There's some grand-scale local government corruption going on. Someone's been caught running a flipping scam on land marked for industrial developments, but there's so much more. Billions have probably been spirited out of the local government purse over the past several years"

Throwing yet more taxpayer money at the same people doesn't solve the problem.

Your last sentence nails it.

Where are the beautiful houses and wealth?

Well, the driver! We can't say for sure whether the passengers were to blame too.

Not as easy to say “is it worth it”
obviously it’s not any right minded person can see that.

I grew up near though and the crime and violence is sneaky and insidious. Kids growing up with no prospect and no roles models are in it before they know what they’re in and then there’s no way out really. It’s truly sad

The NE has been neglected for many years, they regularly obtain the lowest qualifications of any region. Yes Middlesbrough is “technically” North Yorkshire but it’s the north east really. In some areas of Middlesbrough 35% of residents have no qualifications at all. Wherever poverty, low education and government neglect are, crime will follow.

They don't care. Our local drug dealer has just done four years inside and is carrying on dealing as before, with his family. Some families are awful.

I'm pinging various reports to the police so they can hopefully get him back inside as he'll be on probation.

Middlesbrough is really showing it's arse.

Local media is saying another house was rammed overnight. I expect this will continue

Well yeah, wherever you live you have to actively parent your children.
The people I know who have raised successful happy teens in that area all made sure they had absorbing hobbies and weren't roaming the streets - scouting, swimming, climbing ... None of these need to be expensive

Scouting in particular is very cheap and I know leaders in the area who always made sure costs were covered from those who were struggling

But it's the same issue across the country. We live in a very affluent area and drugs are a big issue if parents check out but give their teens access to lots of cash

Having 'fuck all to do' is not an excuse to get in trouble.

Even that area though for young people growing up there there is fuck all to do. So they get in trouble.

i know quite a few families who move to that sort of area picturing some sort of rural idyl for their children to grow up in.

in reality it’s boring, no public transport so can’t go anywhere without parents driving, which restricts hobbies and after school clubs, if there even are any within a reasonable drive. Schools are huge and impersonal, it’s easy to not engage.

alcohol and drugs are a huge issue even in the “posh” parts.

Because you need evidence to arrest people. Seems like the dead lads’ phones are proving a goldmine.

Thank you , Garlic & Purple. It breaks my heart every time I see the town in the news for the wrong reasons. The spirit in the town, even though we’ve been trodden on for decades, is amazing. There are some lovely areas, like Nunthorpe, Marton & Brookfield. I wish people would talk about the whole Teesside area much more positively.

I don’t know what other locals think, but I’ve long wondered if Cleveland Police should be done away with. Areas to the north of the river would come under Durham Police and south go with North Yorkshire, the old county set up. I suppose my thinking came from the days when there was a lot of corruption in the constabulary. I’m sure locals will know who I mean!

Its always been the case that killing or injuring a police officer is treated as incredibly significant because they are keeping law and order, if society goes after the people charged with keeping us safe, its completely lawless.

I used to live in the town centre decades ago. Was an eye opening few years. My neighbours either side were well known burglars. One night a large gang of guys came to get one of them….he scarpered out the back door and down the alley leaving his wife and kid behind.

I ran out during a slight lull when people had left temporarily to get weapons, and rescued them into my house. We had no landline and it was before mobiles so we just had to sit upstairs with about 50 people milling around outside with an assortment of weapons. Police did come eventually.

I blame the judicial system and lack of custodial sentences. Why these lads were still milling around with their list of convictions is why they carry on with impunity. I get there’s no space in prisons…..well they need to build more don’t they!

I'm familiar with the area. I can't think of any houses I would put in the "beautiful" category. But tastes differ.

Outside in the countryside yes there are some beautiful houses (and the North York Moors are lovely)

In response to OP
A lot of County Lines, Organised Crime, Poverty, Substance Misuse and Neglect.
A rise of gang related activity is impacting across the region not just Middlesbrough and a high proportion of young people are currently being linked to such activities.

I suspect the criticism of the police is largely unfair. 4 of those in the car that killed the officers had previous convictions.

The average police officer on the ground would like nothing better than to see criminals like this locked up.

It’s the wider judicial system that’s failing them.

The fact it’s national news and there have been deaths probably means it’ll have been easier for them to get warrants etc.

Even had it been an innocent family rather than police officers in the car the deaths will have given them more powers. As others have said there may have been evidence and devices from the crash that they’ve not had before.

Just because they know who and what these people are doesn’t always mean they have enough evidence of serious offences.

Simply blaming the police for not doing their jobs is unfair; there are much wider societal and political issues that allow a criminal underclass and gangs like this to operate as they do.

Mainly around Nunthorpe some beautiful homes. TS7/8 postcodes I think they will be.

However I believe there are drug issues around there also just not as obvious as the likes of Ormesby, Grangetown. Brambles Farm and Central TS1 postcodes.

I have seen a lot of ordinary houses and some pitifully bleak houses. I can't say I have every seen a "high end wealthy beautiful" house. And I spent a lot of time going all over the town for work