To think Dsis is overeacting after SS hit niece?

Realistically, this wouldn’t be acceptable behaviour between my 12 and 9 year old girls, and it absolutely wouldn’t be acceptable between my 15 year old nephew and my 12 year old girl, and they are actual blood related, spent time together since she was born relatives. I wouldn’t accept it, and his mother 100% wouldn’t.

It sounds to me like the girl is a manipulative brat, and has probably heard her mother calling the SS a baby, as that's not something I would expect a 10 year old to say to an older boy, simply for fear of the reaction that she might provoke. She was obviously bored, and rather than deal with it herself, her mother chose to leave her out of the activity that she didn't want to do, by dumping her on the OP. She then proceeded to antagonise the SS, and quite frankly if this were a family situation, ie, she was SS's little sister, she would have got a clump or a shove, so I actually don't think the OP is being unreasonable to defend him. Of course I agree that a 15 year old boy shouldn't physically lash out at anyone, especially someone smaller than himself, but realistically these things happen among siblings, and while yes of course I KNOW he's not the girl's actual sibling, they were in that sort of situation.

There’s no way a 15 year old boy hitting a 10 year old girl he would have resulted in anything other than expulsion at my school.

Violence is not a proportionate response to being taunted by a child.

@OneQuirkyPanda somehow I don't think that social services will find secure accommodation for a teenager who knows to take himself off out of a situation when he gets overwhelmed.
They might just have slightly bigger problems to deal with.

Ultimately, I don’t think he’s safe to be around smaller children, unless he is heavily heavily supervised, if a claw machine in an arcade gets him angry enough that he needs to leave and go for a walk to calm down then he’s going to end up assaulting someone again.

I appreciate he has a troubled background, but he cannot control his anger and small children will not understand that, hence, how this situation happened in which he hit a 10 year old girl for teasing him. The responsibility cannot be placed on much younger children to understand he is violent and can’t control his temper, as his parents you need to supervise him much better or not create/allow situations where this could occur to begin with.

Saying/implying that the 10 year old is equally to blame is downplaying the issue and won’t do him any favours at all, at 15 years old he should be able to control himself enough to not lash out at much younger children when they annoy/upset him.

He had already had a meltdown earlier and had to leave the venue to regain control, he has severe mental health problems due to his past, OP sat across from the incident using her soft voice. She should have told her niece to sit down or put the baby down and blocked her, knowing that he has a terrible temper, they allowed it escalate.
If I was her Dsis, I’d punish DD for being cheeky. I would leave and would never socialise and my sister again if she was bringing her DSS.

Again, nobody has said the SS was ok to do this. But unlike the sister, the OP and SS recognise the behaviour is wrong and are working hard to correct it.

Just like the neice doesn't have the guidance to behave in an age appropriate manner
Nor does DSS, he’s 5 years older, as we’re placing her near 11, how close is he to 16?

Yeah, I'd love to hear the school's reaction if she taunts a child at secondary and mum demands their permanent exclusion.
I would imagine a day for the shov-er at most and possibly a detention for damaging property for the shov-ee.
(Just a guess. Happy to be corrected by secondary school teachers!)

Obviously we don't know how street smart this 15 year old is but I agree with PP that the lesser risk could be that they just run right out of the room and building if that's what's necessary to stop them lashing out.

We are not discussing a year 5 child here. The OP has said the girl is starting secondary in September. It does seem feasible that if the parents continue to encourage her foul behaviour, and she behaves like this towards older children in secondary, this situation may repeat. Nobody is saying a child should behave that way, but sadly some children don't have that guidance. Just like the neice doesn't have the guidance to behave in an age appropriate manner. Maybe by an older girl, given that some posters do not think girls should be parented at all.

Not one person on the thread has said he was right to shove her, even op. Not one.
Two things can be true. He should not have shoved her. She is old enough not to partake in a nasty vicious act. No she doesn't deserve to be hit. But she needs to understand that rightly or wrongly actions have consequences. If she goes into secondary and behaves like this she could come off worse than a shove.

He was wrong to hit her!

We were always taught no matter how much someone annoys you, you don’t turn things physical. Especially a 15 year old boy against a young girl.

I can’t believe anyone would say he wasn’t in the wrong.

So you tell me - what was the alternative at that point? The girl continues to follow him and goad him? Or - what? What should he have done?
Keep on walking. This is OP fault, it shouldn’t have got to this point.

I don’t know why an adult didn’t step in much earlier. Siblings and cousins who are younger are annoying, the parents need to be supervising.
She was wrong to annoy him, his reaction was far worse. You must tell him that he can never do this again. I bet he’d have thought twice if she was a 13 year old boy. He would be controlled his temper.

Your comment shows why there's so much violence in our society.
You can't possibly fathom an alternative to physical violence.

That's why I asked 'what else could he have done to make her leave him alone?'

So you tell me - what was the alternative at that point? The girl continues to follow him and goad him? Or - what? What should he have done?

There’s a lot of posters saying she deserved to be hit by a 15 year old boy because she was teasing him and he shouldn’t be expected to control his temper. If a 15 year old is justified in hitting a much smaller child when he loses his temper, but a ten year old isn’t allowed to be an annoying brat then I would say the expectation is that she needs to be more mature than him.

At 10 DN knows that her behaviour is annoying and unacceptable. I am not saying that SS should have hit her

The irrelevant was in relation to whether someone had "violent tendencies"...by which I mean a violent act had happened to tendencies is pointless to discuss whe we've moved into actions.

The rest I fully understand (being a lawyer) though I was out of date about DV in under 16s being treated as child abuse / youth offending work 2021 Act (I'm mid 50s and didn't work in criminal law defence) ...everyone is editing to suit their agenda...as you did when you ommited the violence OP describes at school

I sincerely appreciate your kind communication though 💐

He should not have hit her. Something needs to be said to him about this and also about the serious consequences that could occur. Niece sounds like a right PITA. I think.id leave

Your comment shows why there's so much violence in our society.
You can't possibly fathom an alternative to physical violence.

You need to picture what a 15yo boy looks like, and imagine how much younger emotionally and physically a 10yo girl is. There is a significant difference which would never ever make a physical altercation a fair fight. You seem to also miss the point that he is replicating learned behaviour and at 15 with anger issues he is very much at risk of ending up in the legal system.

As a parent of a 10 year old daughter, this is the conversation I would have felt was my responsibility to have with my child prior to the holiday (or obviously much earlier if they frequently spend time together)

”Fred has had a very tricky time. People who were supposed to love him and keep him safe, hurt him and were extremely unkind. This means that he can’t always do the things that other children his age can. Aunty X and Uncle Y are teaching him how.

He can find busy, noisy environments overwhelming and may sometimes need to be alone or move to quiet spaces to help him calm down. We can help him by being extra kind and giving him the space and time he needs.

If you ever feel unsafe with Fred or are afraid, it is very important that you move as far away from him as possible and tell an adult you need help. I will make sure that I am in the same room when you are together and you can come and tell me any time you feel worried. My job is to keep you safe and that will always be my priority.

(I appreciate some of this may sound simplistic for a typically developing 10 year old. My daughter has some learning difficulties, but if the situation was explained to her this way would have no difficulties understanding).

There are ways of developing empathy and understanding without making your children victims. I’m guessing the sister didn’t do this or indeed anything similar…