Furious at ds work dismissal

And that maybe unnecessarily inflexible if there is no operational impact. Hence why I asked.

Surely they have given him a contractual start time, that is clear indication when they expect him to be there. Did they expressly confirm it was fine or where they just giving a little leeway to settle in & see if it improved & he has assumed? The “everyone at my place does it” isn’t really relevant.

What is wrong with you? I said in an earlier post everyone apart from you and your precious boy seem to understand the rules. When you get a new job you get there early presentable and full of enthusiasm. If he won't there are hundred that will. If you feel that he has been treated so unfairly why dont you phone them and give them a good talking too? You must realise you are being completely ridiculous and over the top. Its a life lesson but really both of you seem to live in a little entitled bubble. I have owned a business and I wouldnt be I.pressed by your baby boy not working out that he needed to get up earlier to arrive on time.

Well whilst I agree with you, considering his mum was furious I think hearing it from a neutral authoritative voice might help them both.

Yeah my thoughts exactly ! You can’t be late every day and tbink that’s ok. Why wasn’t he getting an earlier train in the first place.

I suspect the "they were fine with me getting the later train" was more along the lines of:
He turns up late on first day. Manager asks why he's late. "I was on the train."
Manager assumes that no one would be so silly as to turn up on the first day planning to be late and says something along the lines of "oh don't worry. Things happen."
Meaning to be reassuring to a new member of staff, that train being late once in a while happens.

But the Op's son takes this to mean it doesn't matter about getting in on time, so continues getting this train. After however long of being late, manager probes and finds he's getting in late because he's choosing to do (out of interest, was he making the time up by staying late?)

We sack people for being late. There is a reason its called a 'start time'.
Its bad enough that your son didn't have the initiative from the word go to get on a train so that he could actually get to work on time. But its even worse that you as his parent couldn't offer him this advice from the outset and now thinks that hes been badly done to.
Hopefully you can both learn a lesson from this!

It is set to reduce to under 6 months next year btw....but that still wouldn't help people in DS situation as he has less service than this.

It is unusual for new starters to be granted extended holidays during probation btw, the OP said he 'informed' his employer but not that he requested & was granted this according to the usual process.

Due to the amount of time & money involved in recruitment & onboarding an employer would usually only dismiss during probation if it is clear things are not working out. BTW there is often a structured induction and training process within strict timescales to get new starters up to speed; if someone turns up repeatedly late for this it inconveniences everyone else involved.

The employer is perfectly justified in requiring their employees to start work on time.
I can’t believe that’s even up for discussion 😆

A 40 minute train journey to work is nothing. That’s actually a short commute! My commute is double that, and I still manage to get to work on time.
Can’t believe you’re fuming about this….!

He's 19 and has shown himself capable of getting a job, surely he didn't need his employer to tell him to get an earlier train in order to not be late to work every day..he's been unreliable despite being able to catch an earlier train that will get him into work on time, surely he knows being early would have been better than being late

That’s why I asked if DS was customer facing. As in my job it would have zero impact. So it’s perfectly workable. I don’t know if the employer is justified due to the nature of the work or being unnecessarily inflexible.

I would advise your son to go to his employer with a proposal for improving the situation. Show them
that he does really want the job and outline the ways he can make changes going forward. He should have been getting the earlier train, but if he had the holiday booked prior to employment then that should have been honoured.

The reality is they may be using it as a way to get rid of him to cut costs and therefore whatever he does will not make a difference or they may have been underwhelmed with his performance but might give another shot.

Im sure hus colleagues were thrilled that he was late everyday. As a manager in a previous life I had someone ask if they could could leave half an hour earlier to catch an earlier train home rather than have to wait an hour for thd next one. My reply " you accepted thd job knowing the start and finish time so no Im afraid you cannot leave early". They didn't ladt long as we're also "unreliable". I'd rather br an hour early than t minutes late 🤔

I think if OP actually thinks about it she’ll realise that this was likely what got him sacked. The employer had to email him to tell him to get the earlier train - clearly indicating that he wasn’t making enough effort to get in on time. It does make me wonder if the lack of initiative was evident in other areas of his work and maybe this was just the last straw.

I know you think its nasty if people tell you the truth. It should be commonsense that if you start work at 9 you get there 15 mins early to get yourself organised and ready to start work at 9. Getting into work late everyday just isnt done unless you've been there for years and have a proven track record. There are so many parents who think their kids are so wonderful the whole world is going to agree, sadly the world doesnt give a fuck about your DS. They probably were understanding on day 1 but expected yr adult son to work out that he needed to get an earlier train. Your entitlement is breathtaking. He was on his probation period they can sack him without cause I dont think getting outraged and upset on his behalf is helpful you are just reinforcing and enabling his entitlement.

The thing is you only have his word for this. It would be understandable for him to down play it. You can’t really know all the details. You feel aggrieved for your boy, but he is no longer a boy. Relax and let it be a lesson learned for him.

And also being a few minutes late due to unavoidable delays is very different to being late every day because you either can’t get out of bed in time, or it’s never crossed your mind to get a earlier train.

Yeah, that’s how l took it too, but in practice, l would think walking through the door at 1-5 minutes late necessarily means several more minutes while you sort yourself out to actually start work. On occasion l think it’s fine if it’s unavoidable, but it’d be unworkable on a regular basis.

I’ve worked in a place where some employees had a formally agreed later start time because of their commute or child care arrangements but no one was allowed to just turn up late because they couldn’t get up earlier.

Is it possible your DS told them that the train he got was the earliest one possible - thus they were okay with a few mins late (likely expecting him to work extra at lunch or at the end of the day) but perhaps they then discovered that there was an earlier train? Possibly another employee travels from the same place and gets there on time? Was your DS working extra at lunch or at the end of the day?

Also there is a big difference between something being formally agreed and just letting something slide in the hope and reasonable expectation that the employee will get their act together.

It's very different being a few minutes late to work when you've been there a while and already proved yourself. Your DS should have been on time from the outset, even if that means getting in too early.

And that's the lesson he should learn from this and take into his next job.

I was just responding to the info OP shared (1-5 minutes late.)

I suspect we’re talking about much more than one minute here though. And nothing makes for a toxic working environment faster than employees taking the piss and not being challenged. I worked flexible hours in my last two jobs. If you weren’t at your work station and ready to start by the start of core hours then you were recorded as late. Everyone knew what was expected of them and no-one bucked the system.

I think it pretty much says it all that DS only managed to turn up on time once, and that was after the employer emailed him that morning and told him to get an earlier train.

OP did they actually agree to him being a few minutes late everyday, or did he just assume they were ok with it because he wasn’t met with an immediate negative reaction?

I think for a lot of youngsters fresh out of education not being reprimanded on the spot for things like lateness as you would be in school once you’re in an adult environment can be misconstrued as “they don’t mind me doing it” which is most often not be the case.

A hard lesson to learn unfortunately. If the only public transport that gets you in before the start time means you’re early, then be early, or use the inconvenience as a motivating factor to save up for driving lessons, a car etc.