AIBU to wonder whether ADHD is normal and society is the issue

I'm pulling just shy of 190kg and would still struggle without the meds. I told myself for years that I was fine without them and after a couple of years back on them I wish I'd never stopped.

Could I cope without them? Yes. I did all throughout my 20s. However, my life was immeasurably harder and I missed out on a lot of good times through always being stressed and having to spend my evenings catching up on work.

A lack of dopamine isn't something that can be fixed through routine IME. That's probs why so many ADHD sufferers are dependent on self medicating with cannabis to address their emotional difficulties.

can’t edit - depends on the child but also many other circumstances around them too - it’s so very individual. But I believe that the options should be there and all things trialled.

The issue can be the consistency of environment when they move from primary to secondary. At a key point in development, puberty. So much can happen at that stage as the brain goes through enormous changes- the right support can make a huge difference. Lack of support can be disastrous.

I meant 'neurotypical' not 'neurological'.

From Naomi Fisher on Twitter:

In 2020, a student heard about object permanence in his undergrad psychology course. Object permanence is an early developmental stage when children come to understand that an object is still there, even when they can’t see it. It is acquired around the age of 18 months. Without it, we’d be profoundly disabled. Dogs have object permanence - if they didn’t, they would not chase after balls.

That student made a TikTok video, claiming that object permanence was actually a symptom of his ADHD. He said when he couldn’t see things anymore, it was like they did not exist for him. Others picked it up and more videos appeared. It spread. Blog posts were written which described fairly typical forgetfulness, and called it object permanence. Walk into a room and forget what you came for? Perhaps you lack object permanence, and therefore have ADHD. The more it was talked about, the wider it spread. Infographics appeared. Losing your keys could, apparently, be a sign of poor object permanence.

By 2025, parents were telling me that their teens had poor object permanence, and that’s why they couldn’t keep up with friends.

By 2026, author and influencer Alex Partridge wrote in his bestselling book that object permanence was a symptom of ADHD.

Object permanence went from one undergraduate’s TikTok video to mainstream acceptance within a few years. Most people now have no idea where it came from, or what the original concept of object permanence was. It’s become part of ADHD.

And that’s how new ideas are emerging and gaining credibility in neurodivergence. No science, no scrutiny - all it takes is a TikTok post and a catchy name.

Owen Chevalier tracked the evolution of object permanence in his paper, referenced below.

Are there other terms like this that you’ve noticed emerging?

Chevalier, O. (2024). "It starts on TikTok": Looping effects and the impact of social media on psychiatric terms. Philosophy, Psychiatry, & Psychology, 31(2).

https://x.com/naomicfisher/status/2087909841394081943?s=46&t=A2fpFNgDRyXF2d6ye97wEA

@maleficentyou describe behaviour that I recognise and in such circumstances would agree that, after careful consideration of wider context and support, I believe medication and diagnosis could be very helpful. At the same time I’ve taught children who when they came to us at y3, were able to access the strategies so well that their impulse control improved enormously. It very much depends on the child.

Yes it is.

I’m sorry I haven’t been following the thread

Also if this has been posted

this is exactly my experience though I’d say I struggle more than the author!

But I also know how plastic the brain is. My career has been helping children overcome the difficulties where possible. And many do. Without meds. I’ve seen it. For the most part anxiety and unhappiness is the largest barrier. We change the environment and they start to blossom.

I’ve experienced extreme poor cognition and brain fog at an early age as I was very unwell and wasn’t diagnosed with a condition which directly affects memory and cognition. I have feared that so much (it’s an actual phobia for me) I’ve spent years trying so hard to over come my issues that yes, I’ve had burn out, but actually I’ve learnt so many skills that I’ve become very efficient (except when menopause hit.)

For that reason I don’t want a diagnosis. Id get worse. I don’t want the meds to affect my weight and libido. I’d rather nerd out to the latest Huberman on how resistance training improves memory and cognition and go and lift some weights.

For children I’m conflicted. Some really do need the medication. For others it’s the school system being an arsehole.

I’m a doctor — I was diagnosed with ADHD. Here’s why I don’t accept it

https://www.thetimes.com/article/81a9a8c2-ce2e-4529-84b1-7b1d4ec52ed2?shareToken=01fefc7a7649ae654a1affc1745e5e7e

Is this not just the social model vs medical model of disability?

I think a lot of people actually seek out an ADHD diagnosis nowadays and as the Panorama episode showed it's possible for a neurological person to get misdiagnosed if they say the right things, as would likely be the case with things like anxiety and depression too.

A NHS diagnosis is much harder to get as they usually want to speak to your parents and see school reports etc. It's the reason why there are so many threads online with people raging about how the NHS won't accept their private diagnosis.

Yes of course there is. But the majority on mumsnet believe it's caused by society, according to this thread anyway. Some of them have even been given an ADHD diagnosis. It's incredibly depressing. I'm starting to wonder if it maybe is true that some people are being misdiagnosed while others genuinely have the very real neurodevelopmental condition that wouldn't go away in any society with a slower pace of life.

I thought there was already a scientific consensus that it's a standalone neurodevelopmental condition?

People who don't know much about it tend to focus on the lack of attention span/hyperactivity element. For me emotional dysregulation and impulse control were by far the biggest issues.

I was removed from mainstream education for a while prior to secondary school due to my violent behaviour. Almost always an older male bully who tried to pick on me not expecting me to go from 1 to 100 in a very short space of time. The incidents that finally triggered it were stabbing a metal technical pencil all the way through another child's hand (sort of between the knuckles) and throwing a metal ruler at a boy, splitting his lip and breaking a front tooth. And also hitting somebody over the head with one of those massive hole punches.

Very interesting that there's a link between type 1 diabetes and ADHD. Supports the other evidence that while society might be making things worse or causing the entirety of issues for some people, for some of us at least, it's a physical condition that has nothing to do with society.

I think male violence is more 'normal' tbh. Humans take a long time to evolve and in centuries past aggression would have been a useful tool.

I also struggle to sleep. Been driving a loading shovel today after getting only three hours sleep two nights in a row, which is really asking for it tbh. But the area I work in is pedestrian free so nobody else is at risk. I say I'll go to bed early and then just somehow don't.

Honestly, I don't know. But you're twice as likely to have diabetes.

Before going back on the meds (after not using them since childhood) my sugar cravings reduced massively overnight. When they wear off the cravings come back. I don't want to eat until I'm full. I want to eat until I can't continue as it's the taste and stimulation that I crave.

I ate a lasagne for two and a whole trifle the other night. 🤣 I've also eaten a 1.2kg pasta bake in an evening before. I train really hard so I can mostly mitigate it but it's not healthy. I'm deadlifting just shy of 190kg now and have visible abs. I also don't drink as I can't stop. Smoked weed every day from about 16yo to my late 20s.

There is also the apprenticeship route. Apply to be a physio assistant, and if do well, a few staff are offered opportunity to do degree via apprenticeship, which has the benefit that also paid while doing.

I'm not sure he'll get the science grades for it. His MTG is 6-6 but he's currently predicted 4-4 (though I think he'll have achieved 5-5 in his Y10 mocks when he gets his results). He'll need 6 or above to continue science at 6th form.

It's the medication primarily. But he'd also need to show that he can cope without it, and that there is no anxiety, or other mental health conditions associated with it.

Physiotherapy is another good option - several members of our team have ADHD and excel. Yes, there is some desk work (writing notes) but it's for a few mins at a time, then actively moving and engaging with people. A couple struggle a bit with time management, but their laptops have reminder prompts set to keep on schedule.

Yes, I'm sure some of them were. All very sad though.

Yes and much later contributed to accepting that we need free medical care (NHS)

Ive got a lovely poster encouraging people to sign up for the First World War at the bottom it says 'bad teeth not a barrier'.

People in poverty in this country in history and around the world now live with various deficience, are underweight, have rickets and all sorts. Believe me though they are doing (or were doing) manual work.

Some deficiences in the old days would have literally killed people off so they wouldnt be the ones surviving and carrying on but you only have to look at pictures of people from 'olden times' to see they looked hugely unwell, deformities, bowed out legs, white as a sheet sometimes, the lot.

It varies on a case by case basis. ADHD often has co morbidities such as OCD, autism etc.

The key thing is young people getting the help they need. Hiding conditions and avoiding treatments is dangerous as regards MH and being in the forces.

I have to say, the life of a 1960s housewife sounds like utter torture to me 😅

Weren't half of them on valium or bennies just to cope with it? And chain-smoking (nicotine is actually a v effective treatment for ADHD apparently, just much too addictive to prescribe clinically unless there is no other alternative).

But also with my point about a lot of people in previous generations with ADHD being "hidden" you're assuming that someone even got to the point of being a housewife. That means a fair amount of being respectable and having a husband who was respectable enough to hold down a job. A lot of people with ADHD are drawn to others in relationships who have similar personality traits. You only have to look at something like Call the Midwife (which I know is not a documentary) to see there were plenty of other things young women did other than being dutiful housewifes who spent all Tuesday scrubbing a step because their neighbours were doing it.