In a country where savings don’t seem to matter….

So you don’t think it’s worth saving, having a pension, owning a home because you may be one of the 10% who go in a care home decades in the future?

What’s your solution? Should we euthanise non-homeowners as soon as they get sick so only the homeowners and the rich can have care?

Why don’t we extend it to the NHS? Got cancer and you’re on benefits? We’ll leave you to die. Few quid in the bank and your own house? You’ll get treatment.

Your husband has swanned off and left you in debt? It’s off to the workhouse for you and your children.

I worked from i was 14 in a fruit and veg shop.
All through uni I had numerous jobs as my parents couldnt afford to fund it.
I started as a trainee in a professional career with Saturday training at 22 on £7k and worked in tesco along side that to be able to afford it.

I got an acquired disability at 28. I will never be able to work again hence benefits.

I bought my house, a small 3 bed semi before I became disabled. I struggle to pay the mortgage with what I get, there isn't much left over for food, heat etc.

My peers who bought similar properties at 25 are now in large houses, their children are in multiple hobbies, they go away numerous times a year. Eat out every week. Have wine collections
Nice cars. Pensions.

I should have had that life.

But I don't.

Most people dont end up on benefits as a lifestyle choice

Two scenarios for you:

Beryl has saved and has a nice little nest egg. She needs a care home and her family can peruse the glossy brochures of the local offerings, then choose a home that aligns with her needs and preferences. Once in the home, she can have her nails done, have her hair done, wear nice clothing, and go on trips, all paid for with her nest egg.

Gladys was unable to save, or perhaps she's just a bit feckless and didn't consider the future. She needs a care home and Social Services glance down their list of available homes, make a few calls and find the one that has a LA space. She is moved there. She is allowed to keep £31.60 per week of her income for personal spends. So she has choices. Does she get her nails done, or does she buy new knickers, or does she have her hair cut? She can't do it all.

I'm sure this exact question was asked a couple of days ago - "I went to a care home and some residents had sold their house to fund it and others had spent their money before that point"

That's not quite right. That may be the percentage of people who are alive and over a certain cutoff age who are currently in a care home but that's not the same thing as the percentage of people who will, by the time they are at the end of their life, need full time care in a residential setting (which last time I checked was around 30%, although a good chunk of those only need residential care for a few weeks or a few months, less than half of them need it for more than a couple of years).

There seems to be an assumption that a person in a care home with no savings/house to sell hasn't worked hard. That assumption is wrong for a some/many people.

There are many people who have worked full time in low paid jobs their whole lives, had bad luck in relationships etc or just felt there was "no need to buy a house", perhaps because all their family had always rented. These people have paid out rent their whole lives, which likely costs more than people pay out on a mortgage.

I know some of these people personally - retired, but not in a care home yet. They aren't "lucky" they are stuck with hardly any options and spare money, living on a state pension and pension credit, which doesn't cover the rent. With the high cost of buying a house and pitiful wages, the number of these people will only increase.

Save all you can, while you can, because old age care as you know it today is unlikely to be around when you need it.

Healthcare will change, the waiting lists will just get longer & longer

@Unap100- it’s been an hour since you started a goady thread and not posted again from your OP. Do think MN need to look at some of these, they seem to be pushing a particular political agenda.

Anyway id you are genuine- you are stupid. You are more likely to not need a care home than you would, and the majority of elderly people in care homes are there for less than a year. If you have only worked with those with dementia it may well have warped your view on this.

However, a good and healthy old age until death is much more likely if you have money. Money for taxis so you aren’t housebound when you no longer can drive. Money to pay cleaners or gardeners to keep you able to manage. Money to make moving into a flat easy to do. Money to update bathrooms and kitchens to make them easier to use when your mobility limits. Money to keep your home heated, maintained and comfortable for you. Money to buy in part prepared foods, money to pay for regular private physio or senior fitness classes. Money to pay for private health care to skip waiting lists.

Rich pensioners are having a much better retirement than the poor.

The “reward” at the end is the same for everyone OP, you die. Really don’t get the mentality of spending the last 20-30 years of your life having a shit time in order to beat the system for the last 2.

Only a tiny number of people end up in a care home.

If my mum ends up in a care home, I'll be glad she's got the money to pay for it. She has worked hard all her life (teacher and then head teacher) and as a result she and dad bought a lovely house that suited them, which they were able to do what they wanted with. If they'd frittered away their money and been in rented accommodation with no security of tenure, at the mercy of a landlord, then they would have been miserable.

Also, no one needs two homes. If she's in a care home and has to sell her property, she's still got somewhere to live.

Good luck having that attitude in 20 years when the country is completely fucked and if you can't pay for your own care you will be in shit the likes of which hasn't been since since before the 1950s

People are looking at how things are today and picturing it being like this in 20, 30, 40 years.

Boy are they in for a shock!!!

Save all you can, while you can, because old age care as you know it today is unlikely to be around when you need it.

Or, hey, go spend everything you have and keep your fingers crossed. 🤷‍♀️

A 'fair' system would involve either everyone paying, or everyone getting free care.
So, if everyone pays, what do you think should happen to elderly people who worked hard all their lives but never managed to afford to save or purchase a home?
And if we make it free for all, what do you think all the people in the care homes paying fees would be doing with their money if they were getting free care? Because there's not a great to spend it on once you're in a care home, and they cant take it with them. So what is the benefit to elderly people of not paying for their care?
Because before I can agree with you that the system is horrendously unfair and flawed, I'd like to hear your views on the alternatives.

If you both work full time you get full housing benefit. If you don’t you don’t.

its around 7% last time I checked.

Not really no.

Plus all the bloody Royals and hangers on, landed gentry etc.

And you begrudge me a HA flat? After I've paid for a week in Benidorm and HP on a ford focus with my lifetime of savings??

I grew up from the age of 11 on benefits, before that despite being literature, dad earned good money. Mum left school at 14. There were no jobs outside of cleaning/canteen work for women.
We bought our house on 17k between us, as my wife worked for a bank the subsided mortgage was 8%. Dad died a month after we got married, mum had died when I was 17. It took 10 months to sell Dad's house. We were fucked financially. We got £35k for it

So I've always grafted. I'm not reliant on anyone, not the government, not the state pension no one. As soon as I could I pulled my money from the defined benefits pension (yes your told not to, but it was due to pay £7k a year) and got good advice...if I bought an annuity tomorrow I'd get 25k a year.

I'm now worth over £3 million, even with Iran....so yes it's worth working hard. I retired at 55 and never have to worry about money again

So would that be for anyone who receives housing benefit because we have a dysfunctional housing market that penalises the young.

Across your whole life, the reward for savings is choices.

Having financial security- whether it's equity in the house, or ISAs, or other savings, or a good pension - gives you choices down the if things get tough.

You lose your job? If you've paid off the house you're not at risk of losing the roof over your head. If you've got savings you can take longer to find the next job rather than jumping at the first thing that comes along.

Your kid is having a mental health crisis? You can get private help rather than having to wait years for NHS help.

You need dental work? You have more choices around speed and quality of treatment.

The roof is leaking or a major appliance breaks? You've got better options.

You can choose to live a more comfortable retirement with more choices of how to spend your time.

And if you're one of the minority who end up in a care home, you have the ability to choose where you end up, rather than just what the council is willing to fund.

That's the reward. And it's a pretty good one.

I think the safety net should be safe but far more basic. If you want to be housed by the taxpayer it will be in hostel style accommodation etc. you shouldn’t live in a similar accommodation to those that have worked all their lives. That’s not just.

Right?! Essentially 500k saved, not really allowing for interest on the mortgage. Say 15 years working, that's 33k after tax saved every year. That's a huge amount and definitely makes you wealthy in my books!

I see elderly people struggling in their own home because they don't want to pay for care/ or will struggle financially once they pay for it.
While others get the same care for free

But this is true of many benefits, either we have a safety net or we don’t.

Only 10% of the population end up in a care home. If you are in the 90% you will be living in your own, comfortable, familiar home.

Your savings will buy home comforts, better food, holidays, taxis and outings, personal care if you want it. That's what I'm aiming for anyway.

You currently have to pay NI for 35 years to be entitled to state pension. I have paid in for 50 years. Would it not be fair for people who have paid in for longer to get incremental increases in their pension.

50 years will be common for many under a certain age.
I think it should be linked to what you pay in &/or means tested like in other countries but some would be outraged.

This is the problem.

Unless you've saved huge amounts with huge pensions.

Most people are working just to get to the same level as financial security as those who have never worked at all.

I work and save because then we can pay off our mortgage and have lovely holidays and pay for our DCs to have extra help with school work and do fun things like swimming, Scout camp, music lessons, a climbing wall in their playroom, our lovely house.
Surely the point of earning and saving money is to have a nice life now and help your DCs to have a nice life?