To find middle class parents insufferable?

As someone who went to a fairly crappy school and has done "well" for myself, I don't really recommend it.

The constant really really poor behaviour in almost all classes meant that the majority of most lessons was about behaviour management, handing out detentions, sending kids out, calling for senior support etc etc. It is such a horrible, depressing environment to be in. And what you learn as a bright kid is to keep your head down, don't draw attention, keep your mouth shut etc. Is that really what you want for your children?

ostensibly left wing etc but also seem to hold these reactionary views when it comes to their kids.

'Twas ever the case with the left, don't do as I do, do as I say!

I will add that we greatly benefited from that stupidity, in that we own a four bedroom house mortgage free because house prices in this area are generally low.

Do you think it is also possible that your positive experience of a 'pretty crap' school has coloured your views on things? I mean, surely it's very possible that there were other kids, even middle class ones, who had a bad experience in that school? It's worth considering as well that some people are really aspirational and highly value education. A school might achieve ok grades and have a decent Ofsted rating, but some families are aiming high. Maybe they want access to sport or arts or a rounded education that isn't just exam-focused. That's great isn't it?

I think most parents can tell the difference between a socially deprived school that does really well in spite of the circumstances and a socially deprived school that is just bad. Where I am the middle-class parents are falling over themselves to get their kids into the former.

Also there is nothing wrong with not wanting to be surrounded by anti-social behaviour and drug-taking. You might think it's fine but it's normal to think it isn't!

This is definitely the case, but there's also an issue that if a whole group of parents congregate together and segregate their children from other children based on income etc, then that greatly exacerbates the problem. It causes ghettoisation and increases perceptions that certain areas are 'rough' - which in turn is a self-fufilling prophecy.

The area I currently live in was featured in a series of Channel 4 reports as one the most 'deprived' areas in the country. Anyone living down the road in the 'desirable' area probably nodded their heads sagely and said 'yes that area is very rough.' Meanwhile those of us actually living there sat with our mouths open at how misrepresented the place was. It was absolutely ridiculous. One of the people interviewed was complaining about having to cash in 'one of his pensions.' How they didn't pick up on that I don't know - but the same guy owns his house outright and fixes vintage cars at the front of his house. He is rolling in it and yet he was presented as a poor pensioner struggling in penury. He just wanted attention and I can't blame him - if they're moronic enough to put him on tv, more power to him.

The British tendency to look down on areas and believe that drug dealers roam the streets strikes me as bordering on stupid tbh.

Are these people you “speak to” friends? If so where are you meeting them?

My kids went to the local primary and comprehensive (admittedly I targetted where I live so that my kids could go to the best school possible) and am glad that they didn’t have to attend the worst schools in our city.

I think it’s pretty rude to assume they only middle class parents make an effort to fight for schools. They may have a reputation for sharp elbows but I think it’s not unusual for people who aren’t middle class to consider the local schools when moving house.

The thing about schools drives me mad as I guarantee most of these people have zero experience of attending or their kids attending a challenging city comprehensive.
I don’t understand this. Most people would choose to avoid a challenging area regardless of whether or not they had experience.

You dont give up do you

Some hefty generalising going on there.

I would never feel guilty for trying to better my financial circumstance or my environment for my family or myself.

If that makes someone upset, who cares? They can fill the space I leave open.

To each their own.

I taught in a school like that.

The truth is... there were excellent teachers. There were children who wanted to learn.

But we also had to do Lockdowns for real due to Gang problems spilling over into the school. My "top set" was those predicted higher than a C. High levels of absence.

Frankly... I wouldnt have sent my children there.

But my children do now attend their local Comp. Its catchment ranges from million pound houses (in Yorkshire!) To temporary housing. Its a very supportive place. In a location many would speak dispargingly about.

I know but I can try to cut the odds. Knife crime is far more prevalent in inner London than it is in rural Hampshire.

Nowhere is completely safe though. We all live with that fact.

But genuine question - do people often rub you up the wrong way and you struggle to forge friendships?

I went to a mixed local comp in the 90s/2000s in a small town with it’s fair share of depravation and social issues. I never felt unsafe at school and I did ‘very well’ for myself.
That same school in that same area today is a completely different place, there are known problems with knives, drugs and the exam results have fallen off a cliff.
My point is that when we were at school, even in crap areas it wasn’t unsafe and schools were able to work it so that those who wanted to learn still could.
Over the last 20 years schools have been stripped of all of their power and most of their options when it comes to dealing with problems while at the same time being handed more (too much) responsibility for their students and being penalised financially if they fall short. Therefore lots of schools focus on behaviour management first and education second (or third, fourth, fifth).
I’m paying through the nose so that my child can have basically the same school experiences and education today that I had 25 years ago for free

Like you, I also went to a fairly mediocre school but managed to pass exams and went to uni. My only experience of this has been friends and acquaintances that have been privately educated having concerns around the state system.

Tbh it doesn't really surprise me - you can only go on your own experiences.

I feel conflicted, I want my DDs to experience different walks of life and become well rounded individuals, but I also want them to have the best opportunities - and to go a "better" school than I did.

It's not all about private school, many would say the same things precisely because they grew up in a deprived area and went to the type of school you describe and don't want that for their dc.

Is that your experience? Try being more polite

It’s these view that makes me glad to live in a one secondary school town, 95% of dc attend it with just a few in special schools or a couple boarding because it’s a slog to get them to private day schools, there is a bus but it’s apparently over an hour. The schools here are rated outstanding and even a professional footballer (championship club so well paid) kids attend local primary and secondary. The more choice you have the more segregated it becomes

You can get stabbed anywhere. Primrose hill pretty posh

their holidays, not there holidays.

It sounds primarily like you just have different opinions to some of the people around you about education. That's fine but I don't think your sweeping negativity about their point of view does you any favours either.

Being rude about people of a different social class... meh. Tbh I can't get het up about a bit of mild bitching. Humans are tribal and life is boring if we're all just false nice about everyone and no one says what they really think. I guarantee the mum with the fags and the ten kids has plenty of opinions about the middle class arty bores.

I do remember from when mine were at school this kind of thing can get tiresome, OP.

But my gripe with MC parents was different. I'm WC, but educated and professional, and the thing I used to roll my eyes at at the school gate or at parties was the endless competitive MC chatter about travel and holidays.

I'm not the world's most enthusiastic traveller, I admit. But, oh God - the middle classes and there bloody holidays! I sat through so many conversations about flights, hotels, amazing excursions, food, etc etc and I could never quite get why other people were interested in someone else's holiday. Still can't.

I go on holiday quietly and if someone asks about it I say 'It was lovely, thanks. Anyway, did you manage to find a decorator?"

I would say thats more of a private school v state thing than a middleckass thing altbough lots of middleckass people do aspire towards private