Talk to me about pescitarianism

I'm vegan. 70% for health, 30% for ethics. However if I was 100% health motivated I'd be a pescatarian as a plant based diet plus fish is as good as it gets. Fish being such an efficient way of getting so many important nutrients.
That 30% won't pipe down though, so I eat more seeds than any reasonable person could ever wish to.

I’m more interested in the ‘gotcha’ mentality that would prompt that question.

It’s on a par with the kind of ‘That carrot died for your dinner’ witticism I associate with a certain type of middle-aged man.

People eat what they eat for all manner of reasons.

I'm vegetarian. Originally for ethical reasons as a teenager, but nearly 40 years on, honestly, it's just habit. Meat is simply not something that I would think to eat - I no longer miss it and wouldn't want to start eating it again because I think it would be bad for my health and bad for the planet. Plus it's expensive and I don't know how to cook it.

If I were to argue that I'm still motivated by ethical reasons now, then I would have to go vegan. I really respect people who do, but I like cheese and yoghurt and eggs too much to sacrifice them entirely. I do try to eat more plant based meals where I can - I figure it doesn't have to be all or nothing.

DH is pescatarian. He eats vegetarian meals at home but sometimes has fish when out and about. He was raised veggie but then lived in a country where they put fish/fish stock in everything, and it was just easier for him to adapt. He has never had any desire to eat meat as well, so he doesn't. He doesn't claim that his pescatarianism is a moral stance, it's just about what he chooses to eat and what he chooses not to eat.

I have another pescatarian friend who eats fish on the basis that she would be willing to catch and kill a fish herself, whereas she doesn't think she could kill and butcher a cow or a sheep etc. I guess there is a logic to that.

I also know former vegetarians who have chosen to start eating fish because they think it's good for them. And meat eaters who have given up red meat because they think it's bad for them.

I think lots of us make fairly arbitrary choices about what we eat, really. Lots of meat eaters would choose to avoid eating horse or rabbit for example. And in the UK, nobody would eat dog or cat etc. Mainly because we feel a stronger sense of affinity with those particular animals, I suppose, but perhaps some pescatarians feel a sense of affinity with cows/sheep in a way that they don't feel an affinity with fish?!

As long as people aren't lecturing others on the superiority of their choices or preventing others from eating what they want to eat, I can't see that it matters, really?

An ethical question for those who don't eat meat or fish for ethical reasons - how do you reconcile the number of small animals that die in the ploughing of fields to produce vegetables with your ethical vies on not eating meat/fish. Or the number of insects that die when the farmer addresses insect problem with the growing of vegetables e.g. pesticides or other forms of addressing insect infestations.

Is the ethical stance more about the consumption of the animal rather than the killing of animals/insects?

Came from Latin and religious custom - fish on Friday etc. it's just convention.

But op is being unreasonable for sure

I'm just baffled as to where the idea arose, though, that fish isn't meat.

Person 1: "I eat fish but not meat"
Person 2: "I eat pork but not meat"

OK, so you both eat meat, then, but choose to eat only one kind of meat - which is, of course, entirely your choice.

Amongst those who present their choice to eat fish but no other kinds of meat as an ethical choice - especially the ones who criticise and look down on other meat-eaters for having a different meat preference - it just makes me think of the middle-class folk who will show such judgmental disdain for the disgusting alcoholics who single-handedly drink a 24-pack of Stella every day, whilst they simply find that three or four bottles of fine wine on their own every single evening 'helps them to wind down after a busy day'!

OP I don’t normally point out spelling errors. But if you are going to start a whole thread on pescatarians, you could at least spell it correctly 🙏

I do think that people should just do as they like though. There’s nothing inherently wrong with eating fish but not meat so people should be allowed to just get on with it!

I don’t think anyone who calls themselves pescatarian demands fish with every meal.

But that's what makes it weird to grasp, though: it's exactly the same (logically-speaking) as saying that you don't eat any vegetables at all (for whatever reasons), but that you DO eat carrots. Equally, I'm sure that, for the vast majority of vegetarians, there are one or two kinds of vegetable that they don't really like and don't ever choose to eat.

It makes sense to me personally if the only meat that people eat is fish because they believe it to be healthier than other meat; they like the taste/texture but not that of other meat; they're concerned about the quality or welfare methods in farming meat from land-based animals; or simply because fish is an available food for humans and they like to eat it.

'Omnivore' doesn't mean that you eat every single available food item; it just means that you don't pointedly exclude any entire major food groups or categories on ethical/religious/health/other grounds from what you would be willing to consider eating.

I think weirder still, though, is people who don't even use the 'pescetarian' word and call themselves vegetarians, but happily eat fish - as though fish is a plant or something. It's an individual choice for everybody, but why deliberately claim to be something that you're not - especially the ones who moralise and criticise other people for eating the flesh of animals when they too routinely do the same?!

Why does it need to make sense? It's a preference. People might have various reasons for eating fish but not meat. Those reasons don't actually have to be logical. Lots of people's 'ethical' reasons for their dietary choices are no doubt really an emotional reaction to things they've seen (e.g. a programme about battery farming or abattoirs), rather thsn a thought-out philosophy. Expecting people's beliefs and attitudes about things like this to be logical and consistent is unrealistic tbh, and they don't actually owe you an explanation.

I once worked with a vegetarian who ate chicken because "chickens are ugly and have weird beady eyes"!

It's an interesting question if you're up for an open minded and fair discussion of ethics, OP. But in my experience as a pescatarian for 40 years, people just like to pick holes in your beliefs as a point-scoring exercise so I view your question with some caution.

My own reality is that I loathe farming methods so won't eat farmed meat. I'd prefer not to eat fish and - especially - dairy but honestly I can't go the whole hog (carrot?) so pescatarianism is my compromise. I do try to buy organic dairy as organic farming methods are much kinder but don't always manage that either so my ethics are pretty diluted.

Now waiting for a hundred people to criticise me...

@BootMaker

Not everyone avoids meat for ethical reasons.

For some people, the lives of the animals are irrelevant to their choice.

Some people feel they have a healthier lifestyle if they cut out meat (but eat fish.) That's the logic behind it.

Personal preference makes sense.

Ethical reasons - doesn’t make sense. The sea is terribly over fished. Farmed fish have a horrible life and the industry is bad for the planet. Why would you choose this for ethical reasons?

Health reasons - makes some sense but you still have to limit consumption of some fish due to heavy metal contaminants etc.

This was part of my original decision too. I couldn’t afford decent meat at the time. I realised I was eating Tesco value chicken breast but buying free range eggs and realised that was mad. So gave up chicken/meat.

I’m pesci, have been since 1999. I am not completely opposed to eating meat as we are omnivores, but I have no desire to do so myself. I find meat is mostly not very nice (so much chewing?!?). When I gave up the limited meat I used to eat, I kept eating fish as frankly it’s easier, especially when eating out or abroad. It’s easier these days and there is occasionally more than one veggie choice on the menu. Back in the day eating out was really restrictive and various holidays were miserable (think constant omelettes in Paris).

Ideally I would eat no meat, fish or dairy. But I am pragmatic, a pp mentioned harm reduction which I am practicing, and the environmental aspect has become much more important to me over the years. Eating less is better than doing nothing. I also don’t care much about rennet or gelatine - I am quite in favour of ‘use the whole animal approaches’. And I wear leather shoes for a similar reason plus the fact that many vegan leather alternatives are made from plastic (although I think this is changing too).

pescatarian doesn’t necessarily mean a free for all on fish either. I won’t eat shark, swordfish, octopus, squid etc for conservation reasons (shark) and intelligence reasons (squid etc). I don’t each much tuna as it’s a bit problematic too, but will eat some tinned tuna on occasion. What I eat evolves as my understanding grows and tastes and options change.

I don’t feel guilty for eating a mussel or something, and a fish that’s lived wild feels okay to me to eat. I’d be comfortable eating an insect also.

What another pp said above also resonated they say they are vegetarian because they don’t like most meat. It definitely was part of my decision to give up all meat as people just don’t seem to understand that if you technically eat meat, you might not like all types/ want it all the time. It’s just more simple to give it all up and then I never get presented with a plate of lamb when I’m round someone’s house for dinner (boak).

people can be complex, they can have complex reasons and lots of distinct logical decisions underlying what they call to the outside vegetarianism or pescatarianism. And they make compromises, they are human.

We raised our kids pescatarian as we didn't want them to eat poor quality meat but wanted them to have the health benefits of eating fish.

Im a pescatarian and unlike others on this thread I do see it as a logical moral choice. I don’t eat meat because I couldn’t slaughter a cow or pig etc and if I can’t do it why should I be ok with someone else having to do it? I could if necessary dispatch a fish and could harvest muscles without any anguish. I won’t eat larger fish eg swordfish.

Collagen maybe?

I think a sensible person would just call it “cutting down”. Which is fine, but it doesn’t need a poncy label.

I don’t call myself pescatarian (motives set out above), I just say I don’t eat meat.

I’m a pescatarian

it’s not a moral or ethical choice at all and I’m surprised you’ve met a many pescatarians who think it is.

it just describes diet.

I gave up eating meat because I know we need to eat less meat as a species, not necessarily none, and as I’m not that fussed about meat it seemed a reasonable contribution to cutting down.

Since I gave it up, I don’t fancy it any more.

I didn’t give up fish because I am that fussed about it - I don’t eat much of it though, just occasionally. Mostly eat a vegetarian diet.

In theory I think dairy farming is incredibly cruel but I cant face giving that up either.

My view is that we need to stop factory farming and industrial type fishing, not so much that we should never eat meat or fish.

Dp has been a pescatarian for many years. He thinks it is less damaging to animal welfare than eating meat. I am an omnivore but eat the same diet as him 99% of the time, but my motivation to reduce meat is environmental. Eating fish doesn’t fit with that given overfishing etc, neither does eating dairy, but in my view it’s still better than no action.

One of the most annoying human attributes is to give people who make part of a change, or a compromise, with contempt, while ignoring those who make no change at all.

I dont really get the term flexitarian which ive seen written down , although ive never heard anyone use it to describe themselves.
As far as I can see its basically the same as an omnivore...?

Or…. They can choose to eat however they want? Why does anyone need to justify it to anyone else?