Unreliable daughter - do I put my foot down?

if you expect someone else (who is working full time and has numerous other commitments) to facilitate that relationship for you?

So basically if grandma doesn't make 100% of the effort to look after the kids while mums at work, mum is too busy to make time for her own mother and grandkids to spend time together.

So no relationship unless grandma does the child care. Nice!

How is your daughter unreliable?
Being honest you don’t sound like someone who is glad to have grandchildren at all .
I’m not saying you should be always there to fall back on , but to say you will never help her out at all , well it’s mean , she is your daughter her children are your grandchildren.
You guys are Family.
Why wouldn’t you want to help your own daughter out ??

@rainingsnoring You might be right! I’d still help out this time, but make it clear that she needs to be more organized going forward.

When I got pregnant the first thing my Mum said was “If you think I’m going to babysit or help out either childcare, you’ve got another think coming.” I never asked her. She never really built a relationship with her grandchildren.

By all means set boundaries but I could never sit back and watch my dc struggle no matter how old they are. Plus I’d like to think that one day god willing I’ll have grandchildren who I can actually form a great bond with. My own memories of my time spend with my grandparents are so special to me. Being tucked in, read to, made special dinners, playing in their garden. I want to be able to do that in many years to come.
While I’m fit and able to do so, I’d always help my dc.

Lots of nurseries are open through the holidays. Ours is. You can choose between term time or full time. So a first time expecting child care to be open isn't ridiculous. Quite frankly it's ridiculous for childcare to close because the local state schools are closed.

I agree with you fully in principle but this isn't an emergency. This is the DD being disorganised, possibly deliberately, and just expecting her Mum to step in and look after her DC.

Being unwilling to help your own child in an emergency, essentially out of spite, not inability. So you want a relationship with someone's child, on your own terms, fully facilitated by their working parent. It's just not going to happen. If you want a relationship with someone, anyone, you tend to have to contribute something, do things for them, help them, enable the relationship yourself.

So yeah "I will never help you, even in an emergency, and never spend any time alone with my grandchild" does not foster a good relationship with a grandchild or an adult child.

If you don't want to bother then neither will should they.

I think there’s a balance to be had . My parents didn’t want an every day obligation, but were there when nursery was closed or the children were sick if neither oh or I could .i help friends out , if help my daughter if they were in a bind.

Why don't you want to help your daughter? I don't understand this mean attitude.

You sounds really kind. As someone who never had GP help, there was no option of not checking nursery schedules, etc when I needed to arrange childcare for any of my DC. Of course it's hard but that's a basic level of organisation and the responsibility of a parent. I suspect the DD hasn't bothered because she assumes that her Mum will just step in.

I think it’s unreasonable to say no childcare ever, but as for next week, your DD has obviously booked a term-time only nursery which is unsuitable for her (unless she’s a teacher who has holidays off, which presumably she is not). Not sure how she has “only just found out” that the nursery is closed next week, term-time only vs open all year round is surely one of the first things that you look into when arranging childcare. I think given the late notice, I’d agree (if you’re free) on the proviso that she arranges more suitable childcare going forwards. This one time shouldn’t turn into an arrangement for every school holidays.

@rainingsnoring No, it’s not a genuine emergency but I’ve been assuming that this is her first baby and first experience of nursery care. Perhaps the nursery didn’t give her the full holiday schedule until they started last week?

I’m being a softie, but I know how hard it can be returning to work after your first baby and she’s probably in a muddle. If she were my daughter, I’d help her out this time.

I think the OP is getting an unfairly hard time here.

I'm usually the first to criticise the grandparents who have no interest in their grandchildren at all but I don't this is one of those situations. I read it that the DD has been, perhaps deliberately disorganised, and then just assumes that her mum will step in to sort out her mistakes, regardless of what commitments she may have. That reads to me as selfish and entitled. In principle, I absolutely agree that families should help each other out across the generations though and that strong relationships take effort on both sides.

I can believe that nursery didn't point out to her they were closed. This was years ago but my husband turned up at about 3 pm on New Years Eve and all the staff were waiting, they hadn't told us they were closing at 2:30 that day. I was working til 5 and he had unexpectedly been allowed to go early. It was a bit of a shock!
If she is working and no option to take it off what is she meant to do? She's probably not yet developed friends who she can swap child care with.
I struggled with no help from grandparents for years, only once they were at school did grandparents manage a few hours very occasionally. We paid for all care. That's absolutely fine. I know they are allowed to decide this but we are expected to drop everything for hospital appointments or shopping because they can't take a taxi and they don't want carers. It's give and take.
Say no to regular care and yes to emergency care. Especially if you expect your daughter to be there for you in emergencies. That's what families do.

This isn't an emergency situation though. It sounds like the DD being completely disorganised, not bothering to arrange childcare for her children and assuming that @AyiaNanna would pick up the pieces for her at the last minute. Who enrols their child into a nursery and doesn't find out when it is open/closed?

In an emergency situation eg illness, most grandparents would help if they possibly could, although, of course, nowadays, many grandparents still work themselves.

Maybe tell her she gets a certain number of “last minute emergencies” per year, so use them wisely because once they’re all used up, you won’t be coming to the rescue.

I know these days most grandparents are still working FT, so if you can't get time off, it's not unreasonable (emergencies aside). The problem is that it's really the first generation where most grandmothers worked FT. Also, if you have health issues, sometimes people don't understand-I have seen grandparents pushed into taking the kids when they have cancer treatment appointments, because their son/daughter threatens to band them ever seeing them again if they refuse.

But personally, if I am well enough, and if I am only working PT or retired when/if my kids have their own (which should be a couple of decades away, probably!) I will help where I can, because when I chose to be a parent, I accepted the likelihood I'd be a grandparent IF they choose to have them-and I want our family to be close, so I would if I could.

the only way to have a relationship is for grandma to look after the children when mum is at work?

Where did I say this?

The truth is that most people are far too busy and burnt out to spend hours sitting in their parent’s house regularly. Especially those who are working full time and have young children in school and nursery. Like the OP.

There are times when I am too busy to see my mum, but I text or call her every other day. I think that’s quite normal.

The way to have a good relationship with anyone is to spend time with them. And that includes grandchildren. If a parent isn’t able to facilitate that for you (see why above), then you actually need to put some effort in.

“Hey - would you like to drop Oliver off for a couple of hours so you can get some cleaning/shopping/x/y/z done?”

No one needs to be providing childcare through the week. The majority of children are in nursery, and then school, anyway.

Christ.
She’s probably feeling overwhelmed, guilty and really sad going back to work, and she ( and her partner?) missed the nursery closure.
Not everything has to be a lesson, sometimes it’s ok to be kind.

Families should help and support each other, if you won’t help her then don’t expect her to help you.

It's sad that you don't want to help with any childcare.. I had my grandaughter for a week at our home .
It's been a lovely week I feel blessed I have special time with her and that I can help my son.

So the OP's daughter is too busy to see her own mum, with the grandchildren and the only way to have a relationship is for grandma to look after the children when mum is at work?

Ok. Wow.

Agree.
I'd say no if that's what you want but I imagine you will see less and less of your daughter and that means grand kids too. So if you are happy with a very casual, see each other a few times a year relationship then continue on.

My parents couldn't wait to be grandparents and very involved in our lives. I believe I'll be the same although I'm not a kid person my grandchildren will be very different because I can hand them back.

I get you don't want to take on minding them as a regular thing but if you aren't even going to help them out ever then I'd be keeping my distance from you too... And remember later in life in old age when you need help getting to appointments or just tough chores at home you'll have already set the standard on helping and she will be too busy.. As you'd deserve.

Also can't see how she's unreliable.. I'd say you're unreliable before she was. But I hope she is later in life when you need help. I'd tell you to sort yourself out...

You’ve always been clear about not providing childcare. You aren’t obligated to, and yes, she needs to sort things out herself. Do not feel guilty for this. That said, helping in a genuine emergency would be ok I would hope, but it’s defo up to you to set boundaries around that. The responses on here are genuinely shocking - the op has been clear she won’t be doing childcare. The daughter is frankly being a total CF to ask, and try and guilt trip her.