Aibu to not insist DS and his friend come home?

I think 15 year olds are attributed more maturity in France than in the UK. For example, 15 is the age of consent in France. Also, the school system means that 15-18 year olds are in the same school (lycée) which makes another sort of "grouping" of those ages (as opposed to 11-14 year olds who are in "collège").

Sorry OP but you did say he "kind of agreed to a 1am return". So that is why people took it as a curfew and not a let me know by 1am what you're doing. Either way, he did neither. He wasn't home and you didn't know by then what was happening. I don't think that's great behaviour from him, and you shouldn't be blaming yourself for it because you're british.

I would have been at the very least telling him "let me know now what you're doing so I can go to sleep". Not checking in regularly til 2:45. That's not healthy independence, it's him being a PITA.

See I don't recognise that at all. I was a teen in the 90ies and very much had a curfew, did not get night buses, had plenty of rules etc. 'Naice' area as well, so it wasn't due to the location. My friends were the same.

Yea, I have read threads before where people describe their youth in the 80s-90s in UK and it sounds nothing like what it’s like for teens now with 10pm curfews and practically babysitting teenagers. I moved away from home at 16 to live in a flat share, imagine if up until that point I had had almost zero freedom. I would have either been petrified or gone completely off the rails.

@MintoTime
If you are still there op I just wanted to say that I too have parented teens, and obviously young children too while living in a Mediterranean country.
It isn’t easy parenting in a different culture to the one you grew up in, and reading regularly on mumsnet gives you a British centric view.

Where I live teens stay out late at night. When kids come to sleep over, you aren’t really “responsible for them” at 15 in the way that if they choose to sleep somewhere else, or change arrangements at the last minute, that’s their business.
Where we live you are the “responsible adult” should they need anything while in the house with you, but before they arrive home, I am responsible only for my own children.
We too have a location app and check in with our children, but I don’t feel responsible for their friends because they all live locally.
My children would always contact me if plans changed and they were sleeping somewhere else, but it’s on them to do so, not the host parent.

It depends entirely on the situation. My child (year 8) has 2 good friends
A - he's been friends with since the first day in reception
B - lives across the street and joined my son's primary in year 2

If in year 10 him and B had gone to As and were going to sleep over, then they'd decided to come up to Bs for something (maybe the playstation with widescreen TV) or the hot tub! and they decided to stay at B's instead - I'd be fine with it.

If I thought he was staying with A and then they ended up at Cs who I don't know much and barely know the parents, and wanted to stay I'd be annoyed.

I think if impromptu sleepovers aren’t unusual for them anyway I would remind him to make sure V had let his mum know about the change of plans and leave it at that

I agree. I think at 15 even a 1am curfew was totally ridiculous tbh. And then he didn’t even respect that. I just can’t even imagine a world where I would be okay with my 15 year old just deciding to stay out overnight anywhere without getting explicit permission. Is this the norm now? We’re all different but I really think that the OP should have just text her son and asked him to come home as she felt uncomfortable with the situation knowing V’s Mum was under the impression her son was sleeping at their house. If the son is so well behaved and this is all so chill and everyone is so respectful of one another then a quick text asking him to come back wouldn’t be an issue would it?

Sorry OP, I’d have driven to get them. Was this an option for you?

I am British and was a teen in mid to late 90s and nobody had a curfew. We went on night buses in London at 16, definitely t each others homes impromptu sleepovers at 15 after parties or just hanging out. We were in pubs at 16/17. Equally, none of us were ever 'grounded' or anything like that, I think that was American culture imports and nobody spoke or acted like that in the past.

My Dutch nieces behave like this. I find it very hard to wrap my head around. There’s no way I’d let my own 15 year old out till the early hours, but the culture is different on the continent. Kids there do have much more freedom from a very early age.

I think if you had explained in your original post that you were in France and that teen expectations are a bit different to British based teens, it would have been easier all round.

I think some people hear the term 'it takes a village' and assume that includes the streets. Honestly 1am for a 15 year old is a hard no. Worse is his friend lying and you covering it up. Your child has far far too much freedom.

Culture is irrelevant in my mind when they are kids and not 25. A 15 year old and a 1am curfew is mental. Letting them message at 240am with in-flight plans is utter madness. I wouldn’t expect that of my DH tbh because it’s really bloody inconsiderate. Does your son have zero respect for you? You wouldn’t text the other mum at this time so it clearly isn’t the norm.

Boundaries are needed.

This is ludicrous. As a parent of a 15 year old, you should not be allowing your child to be out until 1am (even 10pm would be a big push for me, and that would only be if I knew exactly where she was and assured she was doing something productive). What is he doing at that time? As for allowing another Mother to think her child is at your house when they are not.. that is incredibly irresponsible.

Reminds me of the days me and my mate told our parents we were sleeping at each other’s houses and really were getting drunk in a field 😂

I'd be fuming if I was V's mum that you 1. Let my child stay out so late (I think 9/9.30pm is reasonable for a 15 year old to stay out) 2. Let them stay out at someone else's house without asking me if that'd be alright beforehand. Yabu.

She kind of has lied to the other parent. Shes told that kids mum her child is staying at hers when clearly he isnt, just like her own kid isn't staying at home. Whether they had a 10pm home time or this ridiculous 1am home time they've taken the piss and are texting her hours past their agreed time saying they still don't know what time they're coming back. That alone would have me marching round there and having them back home immediately purely for them taking the absolute piss and overstepping their boundaries. I'd also be telling the friends mum that her kid isn't where he says he is

They're 15 and staying out til 1am with your permission? I'm sorry but they're far too young and should've been home hours before that. Especially as the friend is someone else's kid who she's trusted is under your care.

I wouldn't let a 15 year old out til that time and I would have told V's mother that he wasn't at yours, whatever time it was.

It's all fine when nothing goes wrong but if something had happened to him she'd be blaming you for not telling her he wasn't at yours.

You should have told V’s mum from the outset. Maybe she wouldn’t be bothered, maybe she would, but at that age I’d want to know if my child was staying somewhere other than where I thought he was. Technically you are responsible for him at the moment. What if something happens?
And your DS now needs consequences for not coming home when he said- although it doesn’t sound like you were very firm with him so that might be tricky/unfair if he thinks you’ve ’allowed’ it.
You tell him that from now on if he is having a friend to stay and he wants to change the plans, you will check with the other parent first and he needs to be prepared for the other parent saying no. Better yet, don’t allow him to change plans.

@MintoTime Completely accept that there are cultural differences here that British parents will find anathema.

However, does that also mean that your teens don’t have to stick to agreements you’ve made and therefore effectively can do whatever they want?

While I’m not on board with the 1am agreement, I can see how that might be different in another country. Same for V’s parent being OK whether her teen was at your house or A’s house.

But is it also cultural differences for your teen to completely ignore what you’ve agreed? 1am on the first day of spring break is more than reasonable surely? To not come home when you’ve agreed and to be texting you until almost 3an while they decide what they are going to do….ignoring your agreement….it just sounds like they’re going to do whatever they want, when they want, and you have no say. At 15.

She really isn’t.