AIBU to think Marrakesh was far worse than I expected?

Not sure what you mean by "western". Are you trying to say "white" or referring to a way of dressing or what?

In any case, they tried to sell her stuff, of course, but not in any way that made her feel uncomfortable in the slightest.

I think I saw a different side of Moroccan culture because I had friends there and usually stayed with them in Casablanca, using it as a base. First time I went abroad (1960s) it was to Tangier where my companion met and fell in love with a Moroccan. They later married in the UK and went to live in Casablanca. When you are staying with friends you see a very different side of the life and culture. I was never afraid to go out on my own even at night as the soukh is open late into evening. However I would not have dressed in a mini skirt in the more conservative cities like Marakech and Fez. To those who mentioned Essoura yes its a beautiful little city and much more relaxed Try to stay in a riad in the old town.

Travelling around Morocco on my own in the 1960s and 1970s (my friends were usually working) gave me the confidence to visit many counties on my own including Egypt, Syria and later Iran.

I know Marrakech is different. I'm not sure what your point is.

Yes, I think people don't always realise how geared towards tourists parts of Marrakech are. They "see you coming" in terms of hassling for sales, giving directions, selling tortoises etc and a lot of them are them for that very purpose - to prey on tourists. We found trying to look as though we knew what we were doing helped (walking purposefully etc).

I think it is part of the experience, you know to be aware and if women are going to strip off to a bikini etc outside the hotel, then they will get that sort of attention - I wore long floaty skirts and blouses that covered my shoulders, and I was also very careful about what and where I ate. It isn't right to us, but then part of travelling is to understand how things are not the same everywhere. The same with the stray cats etc: it is very sad, but equally it is an aspect of accepting not every country is like our own.

The sunsets are beautiful, the riads are beautiful, the market is colourful and the experience is of something very different from home. I think if you know what to expect all of that is just about worth a few days of the negatives. That said, I wouldn't volunteer to take a group of 16 year old girls.

Agree. I found Luxor was horrific in terms of being hassled as a tourist!

As is Marrakech!

Years ago , one was supposed to shout ''You are a monkey'' in Arabic to any one bothering you and it seemed to work.

Youve clearly seen a very different Marrakech to the one me and many of my friends have visited. I think it’s a wonderful city and Ive always felt far safer there than I do in my area of south London. If you think that the level of harassment was bad in Marrakech, I would suggest that you don’t go to Luxor!

https://www.lejardinsecretmarrakech.com/en/ is well worth a visit.

As is the women's museum

https://visitmarrakech.com/en/listing/women%27s-museum/

Bahia Palace was beautiful.

I am curious do you think Muslim women should dress like Western women when they are here too?

I’ve been to Marrakesh a few times and always enjoyed it. I preferred the vista I had without my husband as I found with him I was ignored completely whereas with female friends people talked to me! I found that unwanted attention was fairly easy to deal with, a firm no always worked for me. I do think there’s a culture shock and people do behave differently from Europeans.

We had one interaction where a shop owner near a hotel I was staying at with friends kept bugging us, my friends had been saying we’ll come to your shop another time/tomorrow and really they were just trying to say no politely, but he was getting frustrated as they weren’t going to his shop the next day. I ended up saying directly to him that we were feeling harassed by him, and at that he did completely back off. Another time a guy was rude to us in a bar, in Arabic, we didn’t understand him, the bar owner and another guy immediately physically removed him and apologised to us.

I’ve been 3 times and other than those two things I’ve only had positive experiences. I have had worse experiences in Italy and Turkey. I’m told Fez is more laid back. The Atlas Mountains are beautiful but much busier these days, I first went in the 90s and there were hardly any cars, people had only just got hooked up to electricity, it was a different world. Went a few years ago and it was so busy!

I walked around the souk, shopping areas, went off track to find a lovely restaurant.

People can have different experiences in the same place!

Apart from Yves Saint Laurent's garden I found it hard to find anything I was interested in visiting in Marrakech. It's very good for wandering around the souk and medina but a couple of days will cover it.

Some. I got approval for veiling, albeit in my head it was a bit cos playing.

Right. So a beautiful, Western 20 year old woman on her own had absolutely no harassment in the Souk in Marrakech?
She was very fortunate.

We went as a couple, guided, on a round country tour. Other than Marrakech it was lovely if sometimes primitive in the toilet facilities [ but I have been to central Asia so am not bothered]. Ancient and fine culture.

I went as a group as a student when I was studying in Spain. Interestingly all the European women followed the rules, dressing pretty conservatively. While I wouldn’t hurry back, I don’t remember being hassled too much. However, there were a group of American girls on the trip who didn’t cover up and went around in shorts and t shirts on day 1. They were very much harassed and it was pretty hideous. By day 2 they’d bought pashminas to try and cover up a bit. I definitely wouldn’t go back with my own daughters.

My daughter was 20 when we went, and beautiful. She wandered around the souk on her own and with us, and didn't experience any issues.

So weird I was just saying to my DH the only place I have ever visited and hated was Marrakesh.

Don't go to the Medina; it is the most rundown part of the city, and high pressure sales tactics and repercussions for refusal are the norm. Approach Marrakech as the French do: as a winter sun type destination where you eat well, have some time by the pool, and stay the hell away from the old city.

After an initial culture shock, I had a great time in Marrakesh, Essaouira and the Sahara when I went about 15 years ago. I was with DH so not much hassle and also dressed as I usually do on hols (shorts, vest tops, minidresses) without an issue.

That said, I made a decision while there not to go to any developing countries or countries with very high levels of poverty again on holiday. I don't feel comfortable with what the tourism industry does to locals and how relying on tourism to the exclusion of all other industries creates cycles of dependence and exacerbates poverty.

In your opinion. Not mine.

What is the rest of Morocco like? For a small independent group?

Yes, very true. Also, older women are not regarded as sexually available, so the older women on here who weren't bothered is because of that.