Are other full-time working families finding there is nothing left?

I would like to see benefits taxed so that everyone, absolutely everyone, is making a contribution to HMRC. Taxation is for the many not the few. I find it laughable that everyone thought Labour would tax someone else, hopeful - verging on stupidity.

I mean it is obviously is either an income or a wealth tax. Which are you discussing ? Would it be one you don’t pay by any chance?

Quite. I am also a parent of a disabled child who has complex needs. The exhaustion I experience is on an other level to when I worked and had children. I would attach a photo of the damage he did to my hand during a meltdown yesterday but it is too gruesome. There is increasing evidence that carers experience ‘carer trauma’.

‘Caregiver trauma refers to a state of mental, emotional, and physical exhaustion experienced by caregivers, often due to high-stress situations or dealing with severely ill patients. It can lead to adverse outcomes like depression, anxiety, PTSD, and burnout. Lack of support and preparation amplifies this trauma.’

It is galling to be looked down on as a burden to society when this is not the life I had planned, and only ever planned to be a contributor. I haven’t had a holiday for several years due to my son’s disability and am unlikely to have one for many years. I chose to have a child and with that comes the risk that the child may have a disability, just as it means lifestyle may have to change for a bit even if you have a ‘typical’ child. At least it is temporary, it is permanent and lifelong for many ‘winners’ like us.

It’s always the same. Their ideology doesn’t hold up against the slightest scrutiny using basic facts.

I mean it's not either income tax or wealth tax, there are many ways to tax wealth.

Dividends are a type of income but it's very different to the tax you pay on your wages. They are taxed much lower and I don't see why working people should be paying more tax on their wages than wealthy people pay on their dividends.

Yes, that is an income tax 🙄

Completely all over the place.

I've never talked about increasing income tax

A specific example I gave was increasing tax on dividends

You stared off arguing that income tax increases couldn’t increase unemployment and once presented with facts, you seem to now be attempting to obfuscate the argument with a wealth tax on the ‘elites’.

Eh?

Have you moved over into wealth tax from income tax now ?

No, When I talk about ultra wealthy I'm not talking about people on 70k, 100k, even 200k. The ultra wealthy is an elite class of people above most of us.

It happens so often on mumsnet people talk about wealth tax and someone comes along with their 70k going 'I'm not paying more taxes!!!' Wasn't talking about you!

I call people booklickers when they act like bootlickers. If someone wants to increase wealth taxes then I wouldn't call them a bootlicker because they're not acting like it. If it quacks like a duck...

So you are mad at the government so you are going to take it on the disabled, elderly and people working minimum wage jobs

They've been shafted by the government so it's ok to spout hatred at poor people?

Why should people be nice? Maybe because in difficult times community is all we can cling onto? Would be good if people came together, supported each other, rather than turned against each other. I don't know how to explain why you should be a nice person

You only call people bootlickers who defend the wealthy, oppose taxing them more?. Can you tell me your definition of wealthy? How much tax they currently pay and how much more you’d want them to pay?

The top 10% starting at £70k pay 60% of income tax, again you are going to have to define what an ‘ordinary working person’ is and a ‘wealthy’ person. A wealthy person wouldn’t be anyone earning more that you would it by any chance?

Working people have had it up to here and have been completely shafted by this govt, why should they be “nice”?

Not sure if it's wilful ignorance or genuine here?

you called the people who subsidise you ‘bootlickers’ simply because they pay more tax into the system than they take out

This is wrong in many ways. I didn't call people who pay taxes bootlickers, I was referring to those who do all they can to defend the wealthy, oppose taxing them more, essentially do their bidding.

And top 10% does start a 70k, but the maths shows that in terms of actual monetary contribution, ordinary working people are not paying more than the wealthy.

Nope, the majority of income taxes are paid by the top 10% which starts at around £70k.

‘but spout such utter vitriol and hatred’
Nobody has done that on this thread as far as I can see with exception of when you called the people who subsidise you ‘bootlickers’ simply because they pay more tax into the system than they take out. If it’s moral issue, then it’s the people paying for their own families and subsidising others who have the moral high ground. If it’s an economic issue, then the people paying for their own families and subsidising others who are aiding the economy. Your sympathy is irrelevant, it’s common sense that people are looking for.

@frozendaisy indeed - I and many others predicted post the Brexit deal that plenty of the very people that voted for it would be the ones moaning about the consequences- a lack of large investment- you’ve got a factory to build that has products needing export, not just uk centric, woukd you build here? Of course you wouldn’t, you would build were the barriers to export were a lot lower and where you could probably get good grants - we simply gave a lot of good business to competitors over the channel on a plate. We are not the USA, they have a large enough domestic market, as big as the EU.Sovereignty and flag waving doesn’t pay bills or create better paid jobs or stop import costs . It’s global world whether people like it or not and creating barriers just shoots yourself in the face. Dont forget by the way that according to Farage and Rees Mogg everything was going to be cheaper by now- they mentally live in the 50s -a world of the commonwealth mattering and Britannia rules the waves - it simply doesn’t .

I mean the majority of the taxes are paid by the wealthy, not by normal working people. And I don't have sympathy for them (the ultra rich). I think the ultra rich and businesses with huge profits should pay more to ease the burden on normal working people.

This is the issue. I think most can agree that everyday working families are stretched too thin. But we disagree on how to solve the issue. Some people think the people at the top who are exploiting and profiting from everyone are to blame. Others think it's lazy poor people.

You can talk about moral superiority but I do think there's a bit of a moral issue here. Why are so many people so ready to not only blame the people already at the bottom, but spout such utter vitriol and hatred? I think it doesn't make for a very nice society to behave like that.

I was helping another poster. It’s a given that if you’re claiming JOB SEEKERS Allowance you should be seeking work!

Just shows you shouldn’t judge someone because of your imagination rather than facts 👍

@Differentforgirls

Thats fine. You qualify, I don't.

You posted that everyone is eligible. Which is clearly incorrect

Sorry, I’ve lost interest.

Still waiting for you to tell me what I should feel shame for.