AIBU to discourage uni for daughter, I'm worried about debt without career plan?

University is not just about a career. Graduates have, on average, more positive outcomes in many areas, for example health, life expectancy. think it is because studying for a degree teaches so many soft skills such as resilience, confidence, critical thinking, ability to learn complex material, problem solving, communication.

I think YANBU. Plenty of time to study part-time whilst working later on. I wouldn't go to uni now unless it was for a specific profession. The main things that count for the world of work are social skills, work ethic and being able to play the corporate game.

I actively encouraged my DC to go to university. I’m a massive fan of education and it’s value for life.

My DS did a degree on a subject he loved and really enjoyed uni. He now has a job unrelated to his degree but everyone in his department is educated to degree level. His employer has paid for him to do a Masters in the area he now works in. His degree has enabled him to get a good job and to progress.

The skills learned through completing a degree are absolutely transferable. I view the subject as just something to hang everything else onto.

I did my degree around 10 years ago now and the uni experience really benefitted me in terms of growing up and living away from home and the general friendship experience (even though I hated it for the first few weeks!).

I didn’t know what I wanted to do with my career but also liked learning so I picked something that I felt could be applied to a variety of careers (business and economics).

I did end up luckily on a grad scheme and have had a pretty good career since.

However - I left uni with 35k of debt which despite payments (which I started paying straight away due to salary being high enough) is now around 55k. I earn approx 70k + bonuses and only started making the balance decline last year with my monthly payments. The payments are about £260 a month now. On bonus months they take over £1200. I realise it’s a privileged position to me in but when I was at uni I definitely didn’t consider that this would be how much I would be paying (or earning tbf).

Looking back I don’t regret it, but I would have wanted myself to also consider apprenticeships as I think I could be in the same position now with no debt or monthly payments. However my husband doesn’t have a degree and this, despite a lot of experience, does sometimes put barriers up for jobs. So it’s a balance but I think being informed about the reality of the repayments is key when deciding what is right for you.

What did you study?

I graduated in 2019. My degree wasn’t worth the paper it was written on. I got a job in a call centre to have something on my cv, then admin, then finance admin, now a chartered accountant. I could’ve done that all from leaving school at 18, but why the rush? I had a fab time at uni, lived away in a different city, made friends for life, dossed about, drank too much, had the time of my life! It was a great three years - she had the rest of her life to work! Yes, I have student debt but it just comes out a small portion each month and gets written off after 30 years - I couldn’t tell you how much I “owe” because I never bother to check

If she doesn't enjoy it and doesn't want to do it, then she will most likely incur a debt and poor grades to show for it.

Look into other options. Maybe something practical alongside a bit of learning or taking a gap year and working. Just so she can have time to think about what appeals to her.

Formal education isnt the right route for everyone. £30-60k debt is huge just for experience.

And graduate with a 2.2 or worse?

I agree with this..

What about a DD who does NOT enjoy school/learning. Should she be encouraged to go to uni as well? Also not sure what work she wants to go. Plus, few jobs. She'd love to ho to uni for the experience/social development.

She can try to get a part time job to make up any shortfall.

She may not use her degree for a particular career now but it may be of use later. And it will be easier for her to study now than when she is older and a has a million other commitments of adult life.

That’s fair although for law and engineering I would b prepared to bet that students with a degree are going to get the better jobs/apprenticeships.

But they are by definition vocational so they work well for a student who is focused on getting into a specific field.

The whole point about university is that it enables learning for its own sake.

I know that a lot of people have come to regard this as decadent these days but you still need some people to study subjects in order to further the field of knowledge as opposed to doing it just to get a job.

Well I guess the question is what she plans to do at 18 instead.

Your concerns on the debt are totally valid but the harsh reality is lots of jobs are closed to non graduates, even if there’s nothing about the job that requires specific knowledge.

I’m not fully sure what the answer is, but it has to be her decision.

"To be educated is not to have arrived (at destination); it is to travel with a different view." R. S Peters. I recall this from my degree over 30 years ago. Still very true today.

Same

She loves learning. That is why she should go to enable her to learn more. I look after a 19 year old with learning disabilities. He wanted to go to uni to study sport. I'm not at all sure he will be able to work in this field but it is what he loves. SS have told me off for encouraging him to go to uni as they said I am encouraging him getting into debt. People learn so much more at uni than academic study. He is learning how to budget his money. How to prioritise needs over wants, how to fit in, which as he is neurodiverse he does not find easy, how to cook and clean up his own mess. If he has to pay a small percentage of his earnings to repay interest on loan until in 40 years it gets written off, so be it. He has been at uni a year and it is the making of him. I am not at all sorry I encouraged him to go. For the first time in his life he is making his own friends instead of just having the teammates he plays sports with. He now has the confidence to join a sports club outside of uni where it is more structured. The choice should be your dad's and whatever she chooses you should support and encourage. Paying a little extra in tax is not a lot compared to what she will gain. Many jobs are now graduate recruitment only. A lot of lower skill jobs will be replaced by AI in her lifetime.

We also carefully looked at unis and made sure they're are top in their field with established and respected courses.

My eldest has graduated recently with a 1st class humanities degree and a Plan 2 student loan! Not great, a real pain actually but she's learned so much and loved her degree, she's doing freelance work and may do a postgraduate (which we'd pay for) while living at home. My second is going to university in September to do an arts degree with a Plan 5 loan. Again not great but what's the alternative? an almost impossible to get job in Asda or similar and then what? Not everyone is suited to train as a plumber or electrician, so I think a few years learning, maturing and mixing with all sorts of people is a good thing, rather than see your world start getting smaller at 18!
Ultimately you have no right to discourage your daughter, just support and inform her in good faith.

We weren't like this with our DC. We pushed them to strive for the best uni possible for their fields with the best reputation. That means Oxbridge, lse, ucl, imperial etc. they didn't get into Oxbridge but are all attending/attended top London unis and have taken advantage of what was offered. And yes we looked at degree paths and where the better paying careers lied.

Excuse me?

I don't need your permission to post.

I had a similar issue with DD - except she wasn’t academic
We went to Uni open days and she got (conditional) places but I also strongly encouraged apprenticeships
I knew she’d have a great time at uni socialising and combined with a poor work ethic - thus would have been a disaster!
She ended up doing an apprenticeship and was offered a job before she had finished - and lives it
Her apprenticeship has taught her what her best friend is doing at university!

Rather than encouraging her not to go, try encouraging her to explore career options, importance of trying different internships etc when she is there, as well as societies and making friends in a new city. If she wants to go YABU to discourage her but make sure she’s aware of all her options and how to get the most out of it if she does decide to go.

It's not "debt" in the traditional sense. It doesn't affect credit and you don't end up with bailiffs at the door if you can't pay. You need a degree for nearly any professional level job and many of them aren't too picky about the subject.

I feel most kids choose a uni to see where they can party and get drunk the most for 3 years. And then the career and job stuff they expect to just stumble along and get one.

except that wasn't what you said....
"I am of the exact opposite view - I think you should ONLY go to university for the love of learning and to broaden your mind. Universities are NOT job training academies, "