Why are people trying to downplay how awful this is?

It’s not the same, since we were that much older, but I don’t mind admitting that I almost envied a SiL whose parents died very suddenly in their 80s - one of a heart attack, the other of a massive stroke. Not to mention a friend, whose DM just died in her sleep at IIRC 92, without even being ill first.

Whereas my DF died in his early 70s of cancer, my DM at 97 after far too many years of the dreaded dementia.

No one can know exactly what someone is going through

Sounds like a macabre game of Top Trumps. My grief is worse than yours! No, my experience is even worse!

So distasteful.

OP will be waking up this morning and wishing she'd not opened that second bottle. New level of beer fear - arguing with strangers on mumsnet over whether their grief is difficult enough for her.

That is not the correct definition of empathy.

Thank you for the explanation. I read the blog post too. I do recall someone at my mother's funeral who could be a grief vulture - my mother's beautician. Previously my mother gave me a gift voucher to go to this beautician and we chatted quite a bit, she seemed nice. But then later she told my mother how we had become best friends and she emailed me etc. It was ....odd and I avoided her after that. At my mother's funeral, she was, according to close friends of my mother, talking to everyone about how close she was to my mother, and to me (!). My mother's friends bristled at this, they were so offended. This was a close village community, neighbours popping into to help with washing or chatting when someone was struggling, and the whole village attended the funerals. I had wondered whether it was because the beautician was from another village that my mother's friends were so irked by her. But I can see now it was because they thought she was claiming a closer relationship than there was and using it to elevate herself in some way and get attention.

I agree, that's obnoxious. Also, the story by another PP below of the guy who carried a framed photo of the deceased behind the coffin, and then did the same at a charity walkathon, yet he wasn't actually a close friend. I see the performativeness and him doing it to get attention, so yes, probably a grief vulture.

But in the OP scenario, it's a bunch of colleagues standing together, not in earshot of the colleague whose wife has a terminal disease, and they're talking among each other about their own experiences with grief. I see that as trying to empathise with the suffering of the colleague, not grief vulturing.

I think its kind of gross that you're going out of your way to talk to people about it like a grief tourist and then accusing them of not really getting it because their tragedy isn't "as bad".

I lost my mum to cancer in my 20s, before I'd gotten married or had kids and i loved her, we were close. But I coped far better than my colleague who lost her mum suddenly last year in her late 40s. So does my experience qualify me to have a view?

I honestly think you need to butt out, particularly if you aren't supporting anyone and just causing arguments. You aren't helping anyone. You need to really examine why you're so invested.

And please don't reply to me because its creepy how empathetic you want to be to someone you barely know and I just gdont actually want to engage with you. Im only commenting because i wanted you to know that 20- something women who lose a parent aren't all one homogenous group who would appreciate you going to bat for them.

My mum died when I was in my 30s
My sons friend lost hers when she had just turned 16. Absolutely not the same or comparable at all.
I couldn't imagine losing my mum at such a young age. I sent her flowers & a card (shes been friends with ds since nursery)
She is 20 now & works at the vets where i take my dogs. She is a polite, beautiful, kind caring girl (always has been) and i'm glad she's doing what she always wanted to do in life.
Her mum would've been so proud of her. And her mum was lovely too. 23...same age my eldest son....doesn't bare thinking about poor girl xxx

None of them has said this to the person, they have said it in general conversation among each other.

There is nothing to be proud about in trying to impose a hierarchy of grief on other humans. It's highly judgemental and not a little bit snide. Far more snide than ordinary people using their own experiences to relate to illness and death. Trying to relate in that way is people quite literally then trying to understand the perspective of someone else - something the OP is failing to do apart from with one specific person that she has decided is the top of the tree in her special grief hierarchy.

Come on to fuck and let people be the humans they are.

Amazing writing, so sorry for your loss. ❤️

As someone, who lost my dad at 16, this comment feels so dismissive of how it actually felt to lose a parent so young.

Several people have told you a hierarchy of loss is unsavoury. You seem to be saying your colleagues are creating one sort of hierarchy. Yet this thread is just creating another.

@Andepeda said she lost a parent age 8 and therefore making her the winner. She made no bones about what she thought. Maybe you should go back and read the post.

I haven’t read the entire thread because I need to walk away from the disturbing feelings it brings. I have, however, read all your posts op.

What you are describing in your initial post is you and your colleagues processing. The brain looks for experience you have had in the past to make sense of the present, so your colleagues have linked to their experiences of death of a parent or cancer. This allows the brain to start to consider what may happen in the future, so people naturally feel they know some of what the person is going through and helps them to sympathise and empathise.
You seem to have taken offence to others saying that they know what they are going through. People say this as they have some experience, it is commonly known that no one knows exactly what someone else is feeling/ going through. However your comment that it is not the same, most people will see as you stating that the daughters situation is worse, even if you didn’t mean it that way. Just as you have taken others comments as making it about them.

There's no harm in giving your own personal experience but some people then make it all about themselves.

Op if I’m reading what you’re saying correctly, my understanding of it is that nobody else knows what another person is going through so you shouldn’t compare? I think by you mentioning certain ages, the message has become about a hierarchy of grief and that’s caused a lot of confusion here. Op I think I see where you are coming from, however because you know the family concerned, you may be aware of the relationship between the 23yo and her mother, but you would be wrong to assume that every 23yo would feel the same. Consider if you might be projecting here.

Regardless of age, everybody will experience grief differently and it is not appropriate or helpful to tell a person you know what they are going through because you absolutely don’t. You only know how it was for you, you can’t know how it is for them. You are not them. This applies in every grief situation, even for people grieving the same person.

I think you’re being a little arbitrary. You’re essentially saying a 23 year old’s grief for their parent is worse than a 30 year old’s. There’s 7 years life difference there, I don’t think it’s much different at all.

It’s all relative. I get your point about older people losing their very elderly parents not being the same. That’s because as humans (particularly now and in the west) we have grown accustomed to everyone living until they’re extremely old. When someone dies prematurely it’s a shock and seems much sadder than an elderly person who has lived a full life. But prematurely could mean 65 nowadays, whereas maybe 30-40 years ago that wouldn’t have been so young.

You are being unreasonable OP. Frustration with your colleagues because they don't understand how awful it is for another person.

Some kids lose parents to cancer when still at school and well below the age of 23. Are people to turn learn how to express how super awful that is. Who is the arbiter of how awful it is to lose a parent based on age, cause, type of cancer speed of deterioration etc?

Or do you tell yourself you are a better person than they are because YOU understand how awful it is better then them?

unless you plan to challenge these people, why are you worked up on her behalf over something that they don’t even know about?!

I think she seems obsessed with the “sameness” of things.

Whereas the reality is, a room full of 23 yos about to lose their mother would have varying experiences, emotions and reactions to that because their circumstances are all different.

Surely everyone is just trying to empathise? They're just drawing on their experiences and sharing to empathise, that's all.

But these colleagues were talking to YOU, not to the colleague whose wife has been diagnosed or their daughter.or the lady herself.
So they are not trying to empathise or sympathise with those directly affected by this unfolding tragedy, they are having a conversation with you and each other.
People do usually add their own experiences to conversations on any subject including grief (or impending grief in this case).
But how can you accuse them of making it about them (aka grief vultures) or criticise their words as an inappropriate way to empathise or sympathise with that family, when they aren't actually trying to do that as they aren't even speaking directly to the family.
They could well steer clear of saying they know how they feel or decline from comparing their own experiences IF they were actually speaking directly to the family.

They're just trying to find a way to empathise. That being said, yes, I don't think losing a parent age 40 something is comparable to losing your parent aged 23. In all honesty, you're barely out of your teenage years, and your early 20's are such a time of significant change. Losing a parent is hard no matter how old you are, but I think it's rough to lose them young.

I’m really confused as to the point of you starting this thread. And I’d probably be mightily pissed off to find out that a colleague had posted a thread, with a fairly confrontational approach, about a diagnosis for anyone in my family.

For many, losing a parent is bloody awful - no matter what age, how quick/slow or any other reasons you want to factor in. For others, it will be hard for different reasons - fractured relationships, abuse, abandonment. The list is long.

Maybe the best approach would be less time posting about them on here and more time supporting them irl. Whilst also recognising that those sharing their own experiences are hurting too.

Most people struggle with real empathy OP.

Would those same people, were they in the situation to be losing their mother at 23, want the listener to react with their own story about grandad dying in his 70s? Probably not.

Pride yourself on being different.

Op maybe it will be more 'helpful' to draft a points system on what situation is given how many points, it should be easy because you are in control of what is acceptable or not

Then you can hand it out to everyone

Yeah, I can't do any better on that score than you!

but google tells me...

The Bible verse about a splinter (or speck) in the eye is found in
Matthew 7:3-5 (and similarly in Luke 6:41-42). Jesus asks why one notices the small "speck" in another's eye but ignores the "log" or "beam" in their own, teaching self-examination before judging others

seems spot on!!