To think all these mothers bragging about working full time are just using their own mothers as unpaid childcare?

Oh for heaven’s sake, do you generalise much? “These people”. All of them trying to make poor you feel bad.

How you feel is entirely of your own choosing. Nobody can make you feel anything. As I said, run your own race.

Anyway, best of luck to you.

No different to people who brag about driving since they were 17 and don’t tell you mummy and daddy paid for every lesson and the car too.

I don’t understand this. If someone has been driving since they were 17, I’m going to assume their parents paid for their lessons and their car.

It’s not unusual. How many 17 year olds are out in the world fully independent and supporting themselves? I would imagine it would be close to zero.

I’ve never actually heard someone bragging about driving, just like I’ve never actually heard someone bragging about working full time. Those are really strange things to brag about.

You will never get people to understand the difficulties faced by some.
Don't let their opinion upset you.
They will never understand

ETA duplicate post

You will never get people to understand the difficulties faced by some.
Don't let their opinion upset you.
They will never understand

Having a parent who babysits and working hard, be it in your career and/or at the gym, aren’t mutually exclusive. If a mum works hard for long hours, why can’t she talk about it? If it makes you feel bad, that’s a you issue. Run your own race, like she’s running hers (in the gym while her mum babysits).

I think the OP didn’t make the best opening post in that it’s clearly wrong (another full timer here that had no grandparent childcare).

There is a reality though that if you have a baby at 16 your life will be tough. If you have parental support to continue studying or working your outcomes are likely to be better. The OP is talking about her peer group (which sound like other younger mums). If any of my daughter’s got pregnant young I’d be gutted (and to be frank would be encouraging an abortion) but if they wanted to keep a baby, I’d be helping them as much as possible so they could continue their education and improve their life chances.

Unfortunately I'm not lucky enough to have had the option of my mother helping me with childcare as she died in 2023 when my youngest was just 2. My daughter is in full time paid childcare (8.30 - 5.30pm), in advance of starting school later this year, as I have began a new career and completely retrained in my 40s. I worked part-time when my older children were young and life was a whole lot easier. I work harder now as I have to do all the house tasks and admin in the evenings and at the weekend. I do it because I'm thinking of my career, job satisfaction over the next 20 years, and my pension. I'm not sure how it's hard to grasp that everyone has different circumstances and makes different choices accordingly. It seems terribly judgemental to assume things about other people and their lives. Why not just do what's right for you? It would never occur to me to look down on someone else who wasn't working full-time. Perhaps you are projecting your own insecurities?

That's what I don't understand. I was under 40 when first DGC was born. I was and still am working full time. Another 4 grandchildren later

Has anyone actually accused op of lying or like me have they just asked “who exactly has said directly to you you are lazy?”

I dont know anyone whose mum provides regular childcare. Most women (and men) i know work full time and use paid childcare. Given how hard it can be in some areas to find a nursery or childminder space i think thats pretty common

Oh, and the extra costs that nurseries charge like food and nappies are not covered by UC. So there is another loss.

Er... my mum died before I had my kids and my DH's parents live on another continent so no, I had zero family help (and I worked full time and later started my own business from scratch).

Pretty sure nurseries wouldn't exist if the number of parents using them was as tiny as you suggest 😂

Apparently you can claim 85% of childcare costs on UC judging by a quick google. If you live in London and your nurseries are £10+ per hour and your wage is £8 because you are 17, then working represents a substantial loss in income and in you and your child's quality of life. Even if you are earning just over a tenner an hour because you are 18, that's still a loss! I appreciate other areas of the country may differ.

I expect it does cover quite a lot and admit I don't know the actual details - I would like to. But it probably covers term time only and requires a substantial top up for full time work with the normal amount of holiday.

Plus, honestly, if you worked in a supermarket on £10 or less an hour (which is actually physically quite demanding) would you rather be at home with your baby on the same money or put them in childcare requiring you to top up and actually potentially lose some money, especially given that working in a shop may not offer some people any real prospects to improve their circumstances long term? I'd take a few years out and go back to work when it was financially better for me to do so personally (like when the kid(s) were at school and I didn't have to pay for expensive nursery fees).

It is not the fault of people on low paid jobs that the world is like this.

UC covers the vast majority of nursery fees though doesn’t it?

I hate to burst your bubble, but not only do I not use childcare, free or otherwise, but I work full time and I also have time to get to the gym three times a week.
I don’t know why you are so worked up by women who manage to do this.

They aren't offended, they are just pointing out the inaccuracies in your claims. If you'd posted a thread about the fact that people look down on teenage mums, you would have had lots of agreement and empathy. Posting a chippy thread with wildly exaggerated claims about almost everyone practically using their exhausted mums as slave labour? Not so much.

I work full time but my mum died when I was a child… work that one out

I think any age mums who work minimum wage jobs or similar do actually have it really hard if they want to work. Not everyone has the ability/qualifications to do a job that means you come out with a profit that pays for your actual outgoings plus the costs of your daily life. Nursery costs are really expensive even if you do have a good job.

I see where OP is coming from. Some people are fortunate to have family who can help out. Some are not so fortunate. It isn't OP's fault that she wasn't lucky enough to have family to help out.

If you work a minimum wage job (and don't forget that minimum wage is less if you are under 18) then it might not even cover the costs of nursery. Minimum wage for 16-17 year olds is currently £8 per hour. For 18-20 year olds it's less than £11. Even for those over 20 it's only just under £13 an hour.

Nurseries often work out around £10 per hour or more in more expensive areas. Cheap areas aren't that cheap where nurseries are concerned, even if there is a place! A younger mum working a minimum wage job and topping up anyway with UC is not actually going to be seeing much of a profit from working. It's very easy for those of us who have good qualifications to say 'well, get a better job'. It isn't always as easy as that.

And those minimum wage jobs are keeping the country running. Shops, caring roles, factories etc. People in jobs like this may well need to claim benefits to give their family a basic minimum quality of life. It isn't their fault.

The entire country is being subsidised by the govt, not because people don't want to work but because the jobs available don't pay a decent wage and those doing them will need to claim benefits anyway. Why are we subsidising companies that make huge profits? Why aren't they paying a fair living wage?

I haven't worked a minimum wage job since I was a student, so no skin in the game. But I understand that it isn't as easy for everyone as it was for me (and it wasn't that easy for me tbh).

Yep, this. ^

You have quite the chip on your shoulder. Think you need to look internally and work on your self esteem instead of attacking an imaginary majority of women who use their mothers as free childcare.

Not every country pays women to stay home with their young children. In the U.S. you go back to work, and not after a year of maternity leave, more like 6 weeks.

You’re consistently deflecting any question that challenges your viewpoint. You seem determined not to consider alternative perspectives, and you’re deliberately misrepresenting what others are saying. Why is that?

Apols for repeated posts 😳