AIBU to think women should collectively down tools to demand change?

Because lots of men aren’t terrible.

If men are so terrible why have relationships or children with them in the first place or be so desperate for them need to go out and date one

That’s a fair point. I genuinely felt a little worried for her based on this thread and posts she has made on other threads. But I can see that it probably wasn’t an appropriate thing to say.

You realise that women were also implicated in the Epstein abuse, like Maxwell who encouraged girls she had picked up to bring their friends along too in return for a cash payment. Not to mention Fergie and her daughters fawning over him in return for money. How many others turned a blind eye because it suited them?
It's not as simple as men bad, women good.

Whereas before women suffered in silence,,,

What percentage of women are MPs? The answer is 40.5%.

Yikes, please rethink posts like this. It's possible to have depression and still function ok -and it's an intrusive question. Particularly from a total stranger online.

Are you doing okay? You sound a little depressed. I genuinely don't mean that as an insult, it comes from a place of kindness.

I'm saying if men are the issue how do you intend to change their very nature? There is a difference between having to put up with "crap men" and what OP is suggesting which is that men as a whole are the issue and that women need to punish them all.

Over the years I’ve heard some pretty awful things said to and about women, especially feminists. But I don’t think I’ve ever heard anything quite as vile as suggesting it would be better for humanity to die out than to address the socioeconomic inequalities that many women face.

I don't think you will change the way the world works. Either it's good enough to bring children into or it's not. Personally I decided not.

So you’re basically talking about antinatalism then?

Over the years I’ve heard some pretty awful things said to and about women, especially feminists. But I don’t think I’ve ever heard anything quite as vile as suggesting it would be better for humanity to die out than to address the socioeconomic inequalities that many women face.

I phrased it badly. Are you saying that we should either put up with crap men or allow the human race to die out?

@FreshInks who said anything about dying? Not bringing children here doesn't kill anyone. In fact the only way you die is to be born in the first place.

As solutions go, it’s a tad on the dramatic side

It's real change though isn't it instead of just moaning constantly about the state of the world/men. To decide to not bring children here to be victims is completely within our power. Because it doesn't matter how much you demand the world to change it won't ever be completely safe will it. I'd rather not take the risk and what I won't do is bring kids here and then look around hand-wringing about the state of the world when I already knew that before I made that choice.

You’re basically saying our options are to put up with shitty men or die.

As solutions go, it’s a tad on the dramatic side

@FreshInks it's the only thing that'll work. That's if the world is such a terrible place of course.

You want us to make ourselves extinct?

If the world is such a terrible place and men are so evil and you want to do something about it then become an anti-natalist. You can't change the way the world is you can only decide not to bring any innocent children into it. If you continue to do so then you're part of the problem. I don't thank anyone for keeping the human race going and if all you lot can do is complain about it I don't know why you are patting yourselves on the back for being the reason humans exist.

The OP. Sorry. I agree with your post.

I’m not sure if that is to the OP or me?

You start it then. See how many followers you get.

The reason we sometimes get nowhere is that some people stay trapped in some kind of feminist purity spiral. If the aim is to work towards a shared goal, then there has to be room for disagreement. We have to stop accusing woman who disagree with us as not being feminist enough. Otherwise our discussions just turn into policing each others ideas

I love this.

Sadly most of the responses on this thread show why we never get anywhere.

We could have so much more power if we would only work together. It was done in the past (look at Normal Women by Philippa Gregory where some towns had prices controlled by gangs of older women).

@inkognitha I’m not quite sure what you’re trying to say here.

But disagreement in a conversation is normal, and any mature adult should be capable of such conversations without anger. For example, I don’t get angry with women who vote conservative, despite the fact that I feel that anyone who votes for them has a low moral compass.

Posts like these are why I hid the feminism topic

The Scandinavian people are good at cooperating and planning.

In Sweden people were angry that homosexuality was defined as an illness so at some point ( the seventies?) a lot of people would call in sick at work because they were feeling a bit homosexual that day.

The government decided that homosexuality wasn't an illness after all.