Enjoying quiet drink & elder man approaches

But he left the minute you told him? And if you didn't ignore him for ages then it all sounds a bit of a nothing burger. He tried to chat, you weren't interested, he left. OK so he shouldn't have even initiated conversation, but some people are just friendly.

I have the same thing when I try sitting on a park bench to quietly read my book. I stopped trying. There would always, ALWAYS be an older man taking a reading woman as a cue that she desperately must want him to start chatting to her.

Note they never do it to reading men.

But how do you know they never do this to men? My cousin ended up chatting to an old lonely bloke in the pub, and even went to his house once afterwards. And he's not the friendliest guy in the world so doubt he initiated the conversation. He just felt sorry for the guy that he lived alone. But either way, there were no women involved and if there had been I'm sure she wouldn't have gone back to his house as that wouldn't have been wise. Surely everyone is conditioned not to be rude in general? Well, outside the world of Mumsnet at least.

So if a man was sitting in a pub watching a rugby or football match, he'd have to state outright that he wasn't interested in conversation, when surely a cursory reading of the situation would tell someone he wanted to... watch the match? Don't be daft. This is a ridiculous double standard where women are supposed to be available for chat with random strangers unless they have a note from their mum or have to go home to cook their husband's dinner or something. OP, you were fine. You told him the truth. You had every right to carry on doing what you wanted not feeling like you had to entertain some total random.

He might have been lonely and it might have been easier to try to engage with you than a bunch of men he doesn't know. But life experience should have told him that you don't approach a much younger woman on her own.

People do tend to talk to women alone in pubs though, especially if everyone's watching the match.

You could have just told him to bugger off.

He's a (probably married) loser.

He probably thought you were lonely or something, sigh

Or maybe he was the gang leader of the pub and wanted to initiate you, annoyed that you didn't know his high status

You don’t owe him a damn thing. Arguably the one out of line is him. Men need to learn to just fucking leave women alone and let us enjoy our lives.
PLUS - he’d have to be living under a rock not to know how dangerous it is for a woman to talk to a strange man when she’s alone. He can just fuck right off with his nonsense.

I accept that women generally perform better than men at picking up on non verbal cues. But we’re talking body language and minute facial expressions, not completely ignoring someone.

If you are talking to a stranger and they don’t respond to your opener, nor to any of your subsequent questions, and you still don’t understand that they don’t want to talk to you, then there are either additional issues at play, or you’re banking on shaming someone into talking to you. That’s what this man was doing and if you think otherwise, then that might be down to internalised misogyny, or naivety, or a hopeless desire to always think the best in people. Either way, you would be wrong. He knew she wasn’t responding to him in the way he expected because she said he reacted when she ignored his first comment. There is no way he thought that she welcomed his presence.

Maybe others were watching in case you needed someone to step in?

I don't buy this at all. These men are clued up enough not to do it to other men. So you've got to ask yourself: why not? They just push their luck with women because they know we're conditioned to "be nice" to them (and they're pretty sure we'll never be a physical threat, even if they annoy us).

It's similar to them telling us to smile. You never catch them saying it to the 20-stone barman, for some reason.

Oh come on. Women are way better at discerning non-verbal communication and body language than men are.

If he’d walked up to another man who ignored his questions and carried on looking at a screen, do you think he’d have put his jacket on the back of the other man’s chair and stood over him, waiting for him to respond?

We'll never know because like you said-

rather than doing what a man would do and telling them to fuck off and pester someone else.

im the same. I have no clue why really.

im very soft looking and friendly so maybe it is that? I look very young and im tiny, although im 53.

I have a real ton of childhood trauma nad sometimes I think people can sense my vulnerability and target me

its similar in cafes, some just randomly start chatting to various people

Rubbish. They can take hints just as well as women can. If he’d walked up to another man who ignored his questions and carried on looking at a screen, do you think he’d have put his jacket on the back of the other man’s chair and stood over him, waiting for him to respond? Of course he bloody wouldn’t! He’d have apologised for bothering him and gone away. We tell ourselves that men aren’t good at taking hints because it’s nicer to think that than the reality, which is the men who ignore the non verbal ‘go away’ signals they get from women are banking on women worrying about being perceived as rude and will talk to them if they hang around long enough, rather than doing what a man would do and telling them to fuck off and pester someone else.

@Westerlee men are probably more direct though. They can't take hints so there's no point just ignoring them for ages. They're simple creatures! I couldn't be that direct either as I hate offending people but if it's such a problem then just best to use your words.

No she didn’t have to state anything. No one is entitled to a conversation from a stranger - if she didn’t want to respond to him, why should she? She’s perfectly fine ignoring him. He needs to read the room and go away

My partner is a magnet for this type of person , seems when we go out for a quiet drink / meal / coffee we have random people approach and engage her - she doesn’t mind or notice - does my head in personally.

Sometimes I just want peace or some time together without interruption.

It's the entitlement.

He may or may not have been creepy (I wasn't there), but he was 100% convinced it was your job to talk to him and entertain him.

Would he have done this to a lone bloke - and stuck around like that when the bloke clearly didn't want to talk to him? Asking his name after the bloke stopped responding to questions? No, of course he wouldn't. He did it to you because you're female and you owe him your compliance.

I've seen this so often before - men who see a lone woman (or group of women) out enjoying themselves and think, "I know! What they need is MY company!" And they just approach and hang around, in a way they would never do to a man, or group of men, or even a mixed group. It's because they think it's your job to be nice to them.

You did nothing wrong imho. You stated what you wanted and it wasn’t what he wanted; his problem not yours.

My back is up that he put his jacket on the back of your chair and it’s odd that he singled you out, as a lone female rather than the men floating around—it sounds a bit predatory. And no, age doesn’t excuse bad behaviour or boundaries being crossed.

He'd put his coat on the back of your chair? It's not typical is it? I'd trust your instincts over what any of us think, but FWIW it sounds to me like you handled it perfectly.

Posters here are placing a lot of nefarious intentions on the man described without knowing him. I just don't feel comfortable declaring a man to be a creepy, scary, woman-hating "creepy fuck" for daring to speak to a woman in a pub Yeah, I’m quite sure he walked straight past all the other men he could have spoken to because he thought that the OP looked lonely and like she needed a friend. 🙄