Cat versus human a&e

The NHS is collapsing under its own weight

Think back to its inception and the ailments it was expected to treat then to now, how far we have come, what we all want - and add an aging population

I worked for the NHS 1984 to 2000, and it was back then that treatments were being limited

Mum died Sunday, in an NHS hospital. Yes she sat in A&E for 5 hours before being called forward. She was shown to a bay and a bed - not a trolly. Yes she was there for 18 hours but whilst there they did the initial investigations

From there they transferred her to a hospital more suited to her care

She spent 2 days short of a month in hospital, She was treated like a queen, Nothing was too much . After 10 days we agreed pain relief and dignity, and believe me, that's how she was treated to the very end - I sat with her for her last 48hrs, so I saw first hand

Yes the place was chaotic at times , yes it was hard to find someone who was going to sit and explain , yes sometimes things were lost in translation.

But mum was well cared for and I do believe she had a great time for her first 3 weeks being on a ward of women for company and a lot of nurses and care assistants checking in with her

She was kept clean, tidy and comfortable. Even her last day, the nurses knew and didn't subject her to anything other then comfort need

For the NHS to survive it has to withdraw treatment for more problems . Mum had to turn to private care for her eyes, for her knees etc and we are looking to fund an op for DP. Its not life threatening, and it probably wouldn't have been a problem 20 years ago as he would have been retired and not having to still be working at 64

The NHS is just overwhelmed with an aging population and too many answers for too many ailments

I noticed that too. It was a cat in the previous thread as well.

There are private emergency departments in England for all but the most serious conditions. I have gone to St John and St Elizabeth in St John's Wood over the years for several miscarriages, a broken leg, and several other things. Insurance does not pay for the initial consultation (was £100, now possibly more), but (BUPA at least) pays for further investigations/procedures.

In Ireland you pay for HSE A&E if you have not been referred by a GP. It's about €100 currently I believe (paid that in 2021 for reduction of wrist fracture).

This is the second version we've had of this story in as many days. It's almost as if someone has an agenda...

If the system currently in place for cats was in place for humans:

• the wealthiest 10% would get truly excellent, world class care, hardly any waiting, minimal fuss. The premiums would be steep but these people can afford it
• the next 10% would get decent care. Not quite at the gold standard but most things covered. Every so often you'd hear of a difficult situation where a family had to make the heartbreaking decision to have Aunty Maud PTS because although a treatment for her condition exists, it's excluded by the conditions of their insurance as they have a basic policy
• the next 30% woukd have very limited health insurance where only the first set amount of health costs in any year are covered so while illnesses that are cheap to treat are fine, most serious illnesses aren't.
• The remaining 50% would have no direct access to health care at all and would rely on charities if they got seriously ill, or woukd just commit suicide in order to be the keast possible bother.
• for all, the quality of care and your chance of survival is determined not by doctors prioritising the people with greatest need, but instead based on ability to pay.

Personally I believe that for humans Illness is neither an indulgence for which people have to pay, nor an offence for which they should be penalised, but a misfortune, the cost of which should be shared by the community. Meanwhile taking responsibility for the welfare of a cat is entirely optional and those who can't afford to do it well are not obliged to do it at all, so the situations are not comparable.

Just look at what happened to dentistry, if you think having to go private is best.

Getting an emergency vet appt costs. Unless you have private health, are on top lost of NHS triage then this is reality.

I inferred from your OP "I really wish I could pay £350 to be seen if I needed a&e too. I rather pay that than wait a. Ight to be seen."My apologies If this is not what you meant, but logic would suggest that if you paid to be seen without waiting, someone else is going to have to wait longer.

I am not denying changes are required, but I don't believe a private funding model is what is required. And wouldn't work in A&E anyway.

No, not necessarily.
I live in an EU country.
Health is notionally covered 70% and the user pays 30%.
However those on low incomes don’t pay, those with life long illnesses, diabetes, m.s., cancer etc, don’t pay for treatment connected to the illness.
I pay a monthly insurance according to what options I pick. The insurance you choose always pays up regardless. Scaremongering to say you won’t be covered and end up like the USA is not helpful and insulting to the many countries who run a better healthcare system than the UK.
I plan on returning to the UK soon and the state of the NHS scares me.
Compared to where I live now It’s basic and woefully inadequate in many areas of specialty.

I’m a huge advocate of the NHS but it needs more staff and resources.

Paying a properly regulated insurance would, imo, benefit everyone.

Aren’t cats put to sleep when the owners can’t afford the bill?

go private then, one less for the NHS

I'll consider paying more tax when the EDI directors are dispensed with, the rainbow crossings disappear and the admin and nursing staff stop shouting at patients.

When I was in a packed A&E with badly broken bones, my husband found me a wheelchair, and stood by my side for 6 hours. However, when we were eventually moved to the next room, empty but for 40 to 50 chairs, there were about 9 staffnat the desk squealing about theor holidays and cake.

The way patients were spoken to that night was atrocious.

So, forgive me, but it's as much about getting organised as about resources.

I always thought it a scandal that things like air ambulances and hospices only get a tiny bit of NHS funding.

My local hospice has had to turn people away as they don't have the funding. Empty bedrooms that no one can use.

I think there are more humans that need medical attention than there are cats so with that in mind, the premise of your argument is fundamentally flawed.

No doubt this is a driver in people voting Reform. All those that bang on about "we don't take as many refugees as other countries do" usually aren't considering how broken our healthcare system already is.

I dread to think where we would be as a country without a national health service. All for people paying for private care of they can but I hope the NHS remains.

It's not just universal, free (at the point of care) medical treatment. Its all the other things with go with the infrastructure and ethos of a country with an NHS.

A government who 'pays' for its countries health care has a vested interest in keeping that country healthy. This is what drives public health, screening, vaccinations, health and social research and innovation, preventative medicine, health promotion within schools and across communities to reduce inequalities. if we had a private model of health care where someone profited from illness and unhealthy lifestyles much of this fall away.

The NHS is what keeps those people with chronic illnesses alive and cared for when they would likely not be able to pay or secure medical insurance at the level required. This could be any of us at any time.

It is also comparatively cheaper to deliver than private care due to economies of scale both in the purchasing of equipment and drugs and delivery of services.

Hope it stays.

People die needlessly every day due to lack of good care.

But surely you can see that folk paying to "skip the queues" is just going to exacerbate this? If people are no longer seen in order of clinical need.

We need to build a load of cottage hospitals. Just like the ones we had 50 odd years ago. Halfway house between hospital and home. Some bright spark decided they were obsolete because of modern healthcare, completely neglecting to forsee the legion of infirm old folk.

We actually do have a local one. It's completely full 24/7. Old folk go there to be monitored and get rehab, or to pass away. It's partly funded by the community!