To think there's a growing amount of people who think food can fix everything?

That's not really true.
The papers I have read are from scientific research across the world . There are stats showing a far better response to immunotherapy in patients with healthy guts compared to patients without.

I understand that ideas change- once upon a time fat was the demon but now it's sugar and UPFs.

This is more to do with advances in medicine and research.

TBH, a great deal of published diet research is here today, gone tomorrow. It’s not a very well-regarded field. Or at least, any real world recommendations supposedly drawn from the research are treated with a great deal of scepticism. In any case, it’s nearly always faddists who come up with diet-related health stats and conclusions, not the authors themselves.

OK.

You’re misquoting me and that is unfair. I have never said that plant food kills cancer.

I said that the food we eat contributes to the systems behind apoptosis (programmed cell death that takes out cancerous cells in the body). Aka the systems that destroy some cancer in the body.

You are misrepresenting my argument, I have shared multiple peer-reviewed journal sources that argue that healthy diet plays a part in apoptosis. How that is conspiracy theories or not really having any research I don’t know. Do you want me to conduct the studies myself?

Food certainly can't "fix everything". I was trying to put up a curtain pole and it kept falling down - the butter just wouldn't hold it.

I had another problem with the sausage draft excluder I had made. My friends dog wouldn't leave it alone.

Yeah but longevity isn't the same as 'health span'

I agree OP - having Psoriasis has meant lots of people have lots of views, including about diet. It's exhausting and guilt inducing.

I gree about thinking that rather than increasing lifespan or healthspan with good diet we need to think of shit food reducing the optimum

I’m certainly not arguing with you. I would be interested to read the research you’re referring to in your posts. But you’ve said you don’t really have any, so I would take that up mean you’re pretty confident that plant food can kill cancer cells but you don’t know how to demonstrate that confidence, which is fine.

but it feeds into the Zoe argument- and really it’s on the same axis as conspriacy theories- it sounds right, it can’t do any harm to follow it right?

The issue is when people who are not emotionally healthy (ie have eating disorders) use these ideas in an unhealthy way- puritanically, the preach, to reinforce their delusions. And that’s what the thread is about.

So not everything then.

This journal isn't the most reputable in the field. Its peer review process is a little questionable.

Here’s a 2023 source that states - ‘Reviewing the literature, almost all articles concluded that the transition to one of these diets (health-conscious diets of the Mediterranean, ketogenic, and plant-based diets) was beneficial in preventing cancer incidence or reducing progression (transition to metastases), tumor staging, tumor markers, and inflammatory markers’.

https://pmc.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/articles/PMC10627144/

Thanks. Happy to read the newer research. I also don’t think I’ve seen anyone actually post anything arguing that a healthy diet absolutely doesn’t contribute to the systems behind apoptosis and therefore I stand by my point until proven / sourced with a reasonable oppositional argument.

So far nobody seems to actually disagree with me they just seem to want to pick apart my source.

Epidemiological studies showing a protective effect of diets rich in fruits and vegetables against cancer have stressed on the possibility that naturally occurring phytochemicals can exert anti-carcinogenic activity. Evidence is also accumulating to support the notion that provision of a combination of dietary bioactive agents is more effective than treatment with a single dietary component. Thus, it is reasonable to assume that combinations of components could be designed to either target multiple pathways or exhibit potentiation or synergy of specific pathways. The interaction of components of the diet clearly requires more focus and further research.

@LadyCrustybread it's work in progress.

Not disagreeing but it's not conclusive from this link.
Which is outdated- more recent stuff is available.

If you want other studies that also look at the same topic here is one you may be able to access:

https://pmc.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/articles/PMC2936503/

If something is published online and in the public domain you aren't stealing it. The link works and it's available to read.

Yes you're so right. Unfortunately my 'pre-conception' conditions were very far from ideal - Mum didn't get enough to eat and was in an abusive relationship. It cannot have helped me. Still, can't dwell on that and have to just get on with things as they are.

Well I can’t paste the information here because that would be stealing the academic’s work… it’s the source I used and so I provided the source. Your interest in the source is then your own prerogative and access to the paper yours to organise if you want to get it. I can’t magic it out from behind a paywall. I was asked for the source and I provided my source.

there isn’t any point linking to a paper that we can’t read though? The free synopsis doesn’t evidence what you suggested

Unfortunately I cannot help with that. I’m not the person in charge of access to scientific journals. Maybe you can find it elsewhere with the following information.

The title is: Apoptosis by dietary factors: the suicide solution for delaying cancer growth

Main author: Khan, 2007.

I’m not particularly healthy but I do see a huge improvement when I eat better and drink water, my hair changed first, then skin, I get less stomach issues and move easier. Sadly one of the healthiest people I know died of cancer age 38 leaving behind two young kids, and she died quickly because she had so little body fat so no stores. She was so unlucky though, that’s how I think of it, she was a yoga teacher and sold foods at the local market so literally as healthy as they come and I think her dh is very caught up on the unfairness of that which is so sad and fair enough she was absolute light to everyone, so lovely

I really like this term "health span", and it's what motivates me to eat and exercise the way that I do (with the obvious caveat that obviously not all health conditions or illnesses can be avoided or controlled with a healthier lifestyle). As others have pointed out to the OP, it's not about extending your lifespan but increasing the number of healthy, active years you have within it.

As a nurse, I saw people whose bodies and minds were "elderly" at 60 years old, whilst others remained fit and active at 95. If there's an element to this that I can influence, then you're damn tooting I'm all over it!

Indeed. That is why am saying if UK healthy years expectancy is 62 but life expectancy is 79 then the focus (as we discuss this) should be that 62. If people who live 17 more years but not in greatest of health then better eating (and many other things) can give them more healthy years e.g. healthy life can improve to 72 rather than being 62. I put it crudely and honestly combined a part where I was being sarcastic and another where I was trying to bring facts in so you are completely correct in correcting me. even for me as a 48 year old, if I had lived a healthier life (more plants, more excercises, more meditaton, more socialising) I could have had healthier years at 48.

Humans are mortal so obviously food choices can't prevent death. However, nutrition research is now very advanced and it is clear that much industrially processed food is exceedingly bad for human health and ought to be avoided. Whole foods from reasoned agriculture on the other hand have all sorts of positive health benefits which not only prolong life but prolong healthy life.

You’re talking to the wrong poster btw. Take a breath (or a sip of lentil water)

Unfortunately I am not able to read it, you need a log in.

@LadyCrustybread don't worry - I understand what you and others are saying! I was just articulating my own struggle with hearing this message. I get that it is at a population level, but somehow my brain converts it into a more personal message and I have to remind myself that the cancer was not my fault!