12pts in a week - driving ban

Understood but I'm not a fan of tricky loopholes.

There were signs or there weren't signs, there was speeding or there wasn't.

I've tried to give impartial advice about three miles upthread.... 😊

@grumpygrape

hi, absolutely not my intention, though reading it back I can see how it could be read like that. Thank you for pointing it out.

it was more that imo barristers are only needed to find really tricky loopholes

Maybe pop back to the OP’s OP and check where she said she was working away from home before suggesting solutions to a situation which doesn’t exist ?

Ouch, are you suggesting a magistrate wouldn’t give a fair hearing to a defendant represented by a barrister ?

How far is your commute?
Bike, electric bike, electric moped (or would you be banned from that too? I have no idea)? I know these may not be possible. My DD now uses a folding electric bike to get into work (hospital, fairly big city) where driving in a few miles and parking is an absolute nightmare - she uses the bike to avoid a 40min walk which is what she was doing but not ideal for night shifts and strange hours she sometimes has to do.

I sympathise but best to face up and accept the worst possible outcome ASAP and start planning.

Google says the threshold for a course is 31mph in a 20.

As @ItsOkItsDarkChocolatesuggedted, take the speed awareness course for the first one and as for court for the others.

I wouldn’t even involve a barrister. Much better self represent so the magistrate is obliged to ensure you get a fair hearing.

Start by Apologising for taking the courts time with this matter, explain fine speed awareness fit first one, others incurred before you had the benefit of speed awareness and ask for courts leniency.

Even if they don’t let you off, it will only be nine points. Good luck

p.s. don’t be surprised if it takes done time for your heating. Many courts are overloaded and non drink driving non fatal accident traffic offences are not prioritised

if you are really lucky, the advent years will run out and your won’t even have to answer to the court.

don’t ask me how I know.

That’s called perverting the course of justice and carries a mandatory prison sentence!
Do not do this especially if you intend to sleep with your secretary 🤣

That comment could be considered a bit braggy 😉

Not all cars have a screen showing the speed limit and, if they do, how accurate are they if the data hasn’t been updated ?

I’ve not read the whole thread but doesn’t the speed limit show on your dashboard screen?

While I have some sympathy with the OP, one thing I’d be interested to know is what device has been used to catch her. Because ime, where the GATSO cameras are used, there is always a warning sign which consists of a camera symbol and, crucially, the speed limit written underneath. If that’s the case here, then it means the OP wasn’t paying much attention to not notice. Then again, maybe it was obscured by trees or something (although not so likely in the winter).

It has to be shown you knowingly ment to break the speed limit

It really doesn’t.

How on earth can they show that anyone knowingly meant to break the speed limit? That cannot be true. If that was the case, everybody would just plead ignorance! (And isn't ignorance of the law no defence?)

How much difference a few miles an hour makes is exactly what they teach you on the speed awareness course actually. And the answer is….a big difference. Your post almost sounds like a joke it’s such a caricature of what a speeder would say. The level of injury between a child being hit at 20 and 27 would be significant.

Can you take the speed awareness course for 1, and take the 9point hit for the rest?

@Jarofgoodness Presumably you were in Wales, where the default urban limit is now 20, so there may not have been been any signs. Streetlights? Y = 20, unless told otherwise….

Might just be our area - we seem to use roundabout lanes differently too (signs tell you which lane but different to the Highway Code). And we have multiple traffic lights on really small roundabout because no one was using them correctly.

Whilst o despise speeding, in this circumstance I can totally see how it happened and feel really sorry for you. There are people out there who get away with MULTIPLE 12+ points charges , but I presume it’s dependent on having great legal representation; plus anecdotally I suspect much more sympathy for men?! I think you either need to take costs on the chin, google a solicitor who has expertise in this area and speak to them pronto ; unless you happen to have great and sympathetic relatives with totally clear driving licences who suddenly remember they were driving you to work some of those days??’!

No, I wasn’t specifically referring to you but if you care to check my previous posts you will see I have suggested to the OP they use a solicitor and go to court.

OP hasn’t specifically said she needs her licence for her job.

I have no knowledge of the case to which you refer but I repeat, ‘I need to point out the OP is very unlikely to appear in front of a judge. If she goes to court it will be a Magistrate's court so it will be magistrates or the faint possibility of a District Judge if they aren't busy and decided to slum it.’

OP won’t have the option to insist on ‘standing before a judge’ because traffic cases will be dealt with in Magistrates’ Court.

Edited to add
I don’t think prosecutions for speeding have to prove ‘intent’ or meaning to speed; just the fact of speeding.

Go to court. No other option to avoid ban otherwise. See if you can get evidence of signs or lack of. 20 is an exceptional low limit after all. Present everything you have as mitigation even if pleading guilty.

I am giving advice based on what I know of a case . If you are referring to me
so…. Personally I’d be getting a solicitor standing before a judge if need be .

Said person traveling from a 60 to a 30 was caught doing around 45/50 if I remember correctly ., when just entering the 30 . Went to court solicitor told judge what the defendant has said “he was traveling and just hadn’t slowed down quick enough “
The law would have had to have proven the defendant was guilty and meaning to speed “

The op needs her licence to keep her job .
With her clean record. Again I’d get a solicitor and plead my case .

There's a sort of irony with so many people giving 'advice' and hypothesising what a judge will do.
I need to point out the OP is very unlikely to appear in front of a judge. If she goes to court it will be a Magistrate's court so it will be magistrates or the faint possibility of a District Judge if they aren't busy and decided to slum it.

I agree. If you're usually a careful driver and have never been caught speeding before, I'd suggest there is something awry that would mean that the signage isn't clear.

Annoyingly, repeater signs aren't always necessary on 20mph roads. I read an article one year of a lady that got a speeding fine and was arguing against it. Her and her husband had gone out to a friends for dinner. He drove there and she drove home, so she hadn't seen the 20 signs when they arrived. Their friend's house was in the middle of the 20mph zone and she based her speed on the absence of signs and the presence of street lights = 30mph.

Unfortunately I am not sure of an outcome.

I'd definitely go back, take a look and see if you missed the signs and if there was any argument as to why you missed them.

If they were there and you genuinely just didn't notice them, you'll have to take your chance in court unfortunately.

Definitely seek solicitor advice. Is there the opportunity to do a speed awareness course and bring it down to 9 points that way?

Obviously fines and points are automated, with the right solicitor if you are apologetic and highlight you obviously wouldn't have sped multiple times in the same place had you known. Was it a speed camera? I assume you saw said speed camera and made sure you were doing 30.

I'd check the area for signage and take some photos, I'd look on google maps but that could be outdated.
I really feel for you OP, we all miss a sign now and then its unfortunate its happened to you when a camera is around.

My DH and I noticed just the other week we were behind a big lorry and if we didn't know the sign was there we could easily have missed it near us and theres a speed camera shortly after.

If you “don’t think the signs are as clear as they should be” maybe it’s time for an eye test and consider if you should still be driving?

Exactly. Every 1mph increase in speed increases the likelihood of a fatal impact by about 4%. Speed increases affect the forces exponentially and not in a linear format. Speed limits are there for a reason and a few miles per hour can be the difference in life or death. Anyone who tries to argue otherwise is being ignorant of the facts.