To think Lowe is going to wipe the floor with Farage?

What happened

And I cannot stress enough, there’s major money being made here from boat arrivals by companies too.

If people researched some of the companies providing the support, it’s in the billions (Serco and Clear Springs being an examples).

It wouldn’t shock me if current govt officials are shareholders or profiting in some way. Always seems to be the way unfortunately.

Because the money is excellent and people get better at avoiding arrest. Up until recently people were even open about it, that BBC podcast with the man saying he ran the network.

It’s pretty much trying to clear up every person ready to earn millions from moving people, it’s probably even harder than drugs to stop because the people arriving are ok to do so.

But surely the point is that the more people who get arrested and stopped, the less likely it is that others are going to take the risk. What else do you think should happen if not make an example of people?

It’s clearly a very complex issue. The full range of laws haven’t come in yet, they’re being staggered.

And reducing the market doesn't mean they will increase.
There are many things a far right government can do to increase labour without the need for the wealthy to pay more for it.
Remove welfare support so even the old, disabled and ill will have to drag thenselves into some sort of work if they want to eat.
Remove employment rights so that those in jobs can be forced to work harder in poorer conditions and for less if they want to keep them.
Remove support for training and anything beyond a basic education for those who can't afford to pay for it, so the WC start grafting at 16.
I'm sure there's more.

Sure but the issue is you can arrest people but the demand exists for someone else to step in easily once they’re gone. There’s been headlines on supposed ‘game changing’ impact but it’s up on last year.

There’s no shortage of people ready to earn a huge amount of money from moving people.

And reducing the market doesn't mean they will increase.
There are many things a far right government can do to increase labour without the need for the wealthy to pay more for it.
Remove welfare support so even the old, disabled and ill will have to drag thenselves into some sort of work if they want to eat.
Remove employment rights so that those in jobs can be forced to work harder in poorer conditions and for less if they want to keep them.
Remove support for training and anything beyond a basic education for those who can't afford to pay for it, so the WC start grafting at 16.
I'm sure there's more.

To be fair, the boat crossings are going to be hard to crack, but recent reports indicate things are happening, it just won’t be an overnight fix which I think a lot expect.

https://www.nationalcrimeagency.gov.uk/news/suspected-people-smuggler-arrested-and-charged-in-joint-operation

https://www.nationalcrimeagency.gov.uk/news/five-arrested-by-the-nca-in-lorry-people-smuggling-investigation

https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/articles/cn82y2jn492o#:~:text=Adem%20Savas%20was%20described%20by,crossings%20between%202019%20and%202024.

Did I say Farage would?

No I didn’t. But I stand by my point that over saturating the markets will keep wages suppressed.

The biggest things they campaigned on pre GE were fully funded, fully costed, smash the gangs and growth not job losses.

That’s why they’re struggling.

Disabled people. They have already started demonising those and planting seeds but it hasn’t quite got off the ground at break neck speed yet while they can still concentrate on immigration. Then it will be all benefit claimants, single mothers, LGBTQ.

Are you going to comment on my posts that proved from the government itself that there is a definite problem with CSA gangs of Asian heritage and your assertion that most of the gangs are white has not been proven?

Apart from Epstein which really isn't the sort of offender we're talking about in regards to grooming gangs operating in the UK by non-British offenders.

Your 2nd link was a gang who abused one victim, not systematic grooming and abuse of many.

And your 3rd and 4th links were okay, white but not white British but Albanian and Romanian criminal gangs who'd taken adv

Labour mostly have been doing what they said to be fair. You wouldn't know it from the press but this is a good resource...

https://fullfact.org/government-tracker/

If you're so concerned about the way working class people are viewed on MN perhaps you'd like to practice what you preach and stop linking being WC with support for racism? Because as a WC person, I'm sick to death of being told that anti immigration rhetoric and support for racist politicians are 'the concerns of the WC'.
In my WC opinion, Reform are 'vile' and I'd take being thought stupid any day of the week over being lumped in with their supporters.
Many of us WC people live quite happily in diverse communities and care far less about immigrants than we do about wealthy white people exploiting us as they have for centuries.

Tbh as a brown person, I don’t really care at this point what his motives are, what happened to those girls is appalling. I’m getting increasingly pissed off with the attitude of “we need to care more about whether we like the person exposing injustice than the actual injustice itself”. For whatever reason, in this particular thing he’s doing gods work, anyone who’s read anything these women have said about the abuse and torture they suffered would have a bit more sympathy for them rather than the smug, self congratulatory tone we see here.

The behaviour around the match in Birmingham indicates people are still tiptoeing around racial sensitivities. The best way to have a society that is cohesive is if everyone is policed exactly the same. We aren’t there and Labours ridiculous Islamaphobia laws will just make this worse.

I wouldn’t be voting either reform (they initially wanted to remove the 2 child tax credit cap, fundamentally disagree with more welfare expansion) or for respect but I think some of the reactions to either of those parties is hysterical.

Also the way we fund the NHS meeds massive reforms, thats just a fact, the current system is sucking up money and not delivering. Something has to change there.

People keep saying WC people are being suckered by reform yet Labour has broken many a manifesto promise or sprung stuff that wasn’t in the manifesto. If anyones a sucker here it’s anyone who voted for Labour…right?

I'm fairly confident that Farage and his mates aren't going to do anything that stops billionaires exploiting people. If the pool of immigrants to exploit dries up another pool be found to replace them. And guess who's going to be in it?

I'm fairly confident that Farage and his mates aren't going to do anything that stops billionaires exploiting people. If the pool of immigrants to exploit dries up another pool be found to replace them. And guess who's going to be in it?

Are you going to comment on my posts that proved from the government itself that there is a definite problem with CSA gangs of Asian heritage and your assertion that most of the gangs are white has not been proven?

Apart from Epstein which really isn't the sort of offender we're talking about in regards to grooming gangs operating in the UK by non-British offenders.

Your 2nd link was a gang who abused one victim, not systematic grooming and abuse of many.

And your 3rd and 4th links were okay, white but not white British but Albanian and Romanian criminal gangs who'd taken adv

But then billionaires are using immigrants to suppress wages and reduce the natives ability to negotiate better working pay. The govt literally prop up min wage with working credits which benefits the billionaires. If you look into the money being made by the companies profiteering off immigration (especially illegal crossings) it’s insanely eye watering.

So as always, I see both sides are as bad as each other for the average working person. It’s why I don’t attach myself to any particular party.

I don’t disagree, tbf I have seen Rupert Lowe actually say there are a bunch of people in the Uk who need to be shoved into a job.

I think the problem is you can have 1 earner in a household which then qualifies a family for a raft of welfare which far outstrips your financial contributions. I do think British people need to suck it up and just get a bloody job and stop thinking things are beneath them.

I think the thing that a lot of people miss is that high levels of immigration was very much a right wing economic thing for a long time. Right wingers like open flexible labour markets because of simple supply and demand. When you reduce labour availability wages go up. It’s become a left wing thing because of social justice sentiments but the old left wingers would have been able to correctly identify that labour market manipulation by massively increasing the supply of labour would only really benefit the wealthy. Lower wages and they would be insulted from the social costs of more competition from finite resources like school places, reasonably priced housing, healthcare etc.

It’s only recently people have started believing stupid things like “high immigration has no impact on wages and housing costs”.

I’m pro immigration but sensible and targeted immigration. There is nothing wrong with a surge of immigration when required if it is accompanied by an actual plan around school places, infrastructure etc.

The fears of the WC have always been sneered at by those favouring right wing politics.
If WC people have poor quality of life they're told they should "get off their arses, work harder and better themselves."
If they live in substandard overcrowded accommodation they should have "made better life choices".
If they are poor and need welfare support they are "scroungers".
When anyone states the blindingly obvious, that the policies that would help WC people involve investment of public money in the services they use, the improvement of their neighbourhoods, plus additional money in their pockets, they are "a drain on the hardworking high earning tax payer".
When anyone suggests any sort of levelling up, then they're being given unfair advantage over a middle class child.
The only issue on which right wing parties "listen to the WC" is when pockets of them are persuaded that the cause of their disadvantage is immigration, and they can engage them in call and response.

Possibly, but my argument would be that many of the jobs that immigrants do, our own unemployed won’t.

I manage a recruitment business, which heavily focusses on health care assistants for some of our SENd jobs. We also employ school cleaners, lunchtime staff, catering assistants.

I would estimate we fill those roles with 90% overseas candidates - we advertise them to everyone. Jobs need filling, and if UK born UC claimants don’t want them, they’ll still have to be filled.

We also can’t complain about people coming and being a resource drain, and also complain about them working.