Page 20 | Time for Women with Talent to Take Back Older Female Roles in Pantos

Bixo · 08/02/2026 17:03

ComtesseDeSpair · 08/02/2026 16:51

What pantomime tradition are you referring to where roles were designed and written for talented older female actresses? Pantomime has always been low-brow comedy - it derives from harlequinade, which principally about male clowns and clownesque figures doing slapstick and chaos. The more modern tradition of dressing men as women and women as men was the successor of that clowning.

Edited

Yes.

Panto is all about subversion and contradiction. It's part of the comedy and just part of the (very weird) nature of panto itself.

Men played by women

Women played by men

A "family entertainment" full of bawdy jokes designed to (hopefully) go over the heads of the little kids

Audiences joining in the dialogue ("It's behind you!") and actors bantering back and forth with them

A type of show that only exists for about 6 weeks of the year (why?)

Traditional jokes and tropes and local references that get wheeled out again and again, but people still want to see them

... Just so much weird and (in my view) wonderful stuff. It shouldn't work but it does. There's no point subjecting it to logical criticism, imo. It's a very individual and very British cultural phenomenon and I would hate to see it die.

Ponoka7 · 08/02/2026 17:03

The Christmas before last, I said similar to my sister. What I really didn't like was the jokes putting older women down. Gay men always get away with what women don't, especially older gay/panto dames. We'd be cringed at, or considered sad for being sexual. This year's panto was Cinderella and the jokes stayed with the sisters, but not in a put down way.

JHound · 08/02/2026 17:00

No.

Leave Panto Dames as drag performers (same as frequently Peter Pan, Puss in Boots etc are played by women in Drag.)

Thisseasonsdiamante · 08/02/2026 16:59

Time for Women with Talent to Take Back Older Female Roles in Pantos

Oh no it isn’t!!!

KimberleyClark · 08/02/2026 16:58

IdentifyingAsAWoollyMammoth · 08/02/2026 16:53

And while we're about it, let's have a real horse or a real cow, none of these two actors in a costume, one as the head and front legs, and one as the arse and rear legs. Plenty of real livestock would be glad of the work.

Great idea, it would add to the general chaos especially if the horse farted.

KimberleyClark · 08/02/2026 16:57

HighLadyofTheNightCourt · 08/02/2026 16:55

Have you actually asked any actors how they feel about this? Sounds like you just don’t enjoy a traditional pantomime and want it changed to suit your preferences.

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Deleted as wrong post quoted.

Nomedshere · 08/02/2026 16:55

IdentifyingAsAWoollyMammoth · 08/02/2026 16:53

And while we're about it, let's have a real horse or a real cow, none of these two actors in a costume, one as the head and front legs, and one as the arse and rear legs. Plenty of real livestock would be glad of the work.

😆😆😆😆😆

HighLadyofTheNightCourt · 08/02/2026 16:55

SpringTimeIsRingTime · 08/02/2026 16:50

In my honest view? Yes.
I never liked women playing prince charming - I find it weird.
It was started in Victorian times for the male gaze.
Get a young actor to do that - plenty out there.

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Have you actually asked any actors how they feel about this? Sounds like you just don’t enjoy a traditional pantomime and want it changed to suit your preferences.

IdentifyingAsAWoollyMammoth · 08/02/2026 16:53

And while we're about it, let's have a real horse or a real cow, none of these two actors in a costume, one as the head and front legs, and one as the arse and rear legs. Plenty of real livestock would be glad of the work.

ComtesseDeSpair · 08/02/2026 16:51

What pantomime tradition are you referring to where roles were designed and written for talented older female actresses? Pantomime has always been low-brow comedy - it derives from harlequinade, which principally about male clowns and clownesque figures doing slapstick and chaos. The more modern tradition of dressing men as women and women as men was the successor of that clowning.

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SpringTimeIsRingTime · 08/02/2026 16:50

KimberleyClark · 08/02/2026 16:48

Should men also take back the Prince Charming role which is traditionally played by a woman?

In my honest view? Yes.
I never liked women playing prince charming - I find it weird.
It was started in Victorian times for the male gaze.
Get a young actor to do that - plenty out there.

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KimberleyClark · 08/02/2026 16:48

Should men also take back the Prince Charming role which is traditionally played by a woman?

frockandcrocs · 08/02/2026 16:48

FFS. No.

LindorDoubleChoc · 08/02/2026 16:48

The panto I went to this year had no dame! I have to say it smacked of a certain type of right-on worthiness. And I'm as gender critical as they come. But who knows, maybe they'll be quietly phased out.

I'm a hypocrite because I just wish drag queenery would die a sudden death.

Nomedshere · 08/02/2026 16:47

Dont be silly

HighLadyofTheNightCourt · 08/02/2026 16:46

SpringTimeIsRingTime · 08/02/2026 16:40

It's a highly visible role and one designed for older women.

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But those parts aren’t written for older women. Not in any of the pantomimes I’ve seen anyway. An element of the humour is that it’s being played by a man.

MrsMattMurdock · 08/02/2026 16:46

Yes, this will be sure to smash the patriarchy. The men will be laughing on the other side of their overpainted faces.

HighLadyofTheNightCourt · 08/02/2026 16:43

Ablondiebutagoody · 08/02/2026 15:38

The old, male, panto Dame is the main reason that I go. Plenty of other roles for everyone else.

Same here.
We’d probably stop going if our local pantomime changed this.

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SpringTimeIsRingTime · 08/02/2026 16:40

SlightlyUnexpected · 08/02/2026 15:37

Honestly, out of all the places in which older women are underrepresented, I think pantomime dames are the least of our problems.

It's a highly visible role and one designed for older women.

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vodkaredbullgirl · 08/02/2026 16:38

SpringTimeIsRingTime · 08/02/2026 16:29

The principal boy was played by a woman for the titillation of Victorian men at a time when women had to cover every part of their body except their face.

"Allowing" a slim young good-looking woman to prance around the stage in a pair of tights with a tunic barely covering her backside must have been quite the pleasure ride for the male half of the audience. It was a gimmick to get bums on seats, that's all and for all the wrong reasons.

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🙄

IdentifyingAsAWoollyMammoth · 08/02/2026 16:35

Panto Dames have been a thing since 1806 when a certain Mr Simmons decided to play Mother Goose.... I think it's time for talented actresses to take back elder female roles from the tired tropes played by men since the Victorian era.

That 1806 was part of the Victorian era would have been a surprise to Her Late Majesty as she wasn't born until 1819 and didn't ascend the throne until 1837.

mumofoneAloneandwell · 08/02/2026 16:33

AnAlpacaForChristmasPleaseSanta · 08/02/2026 16:31

I would go so far to say why can they not cancel it and just broadcast a wall of drying paint. I'd prefer to watch it.

I am not one of those people who wants programs cancelled just because I don't watch or enjoy them, but MBB is the exception!

Can't get a head of steam up about this though, so fully agree with @SlightlyUnexpected post at 15:37.

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agree 😂😂 it’s just mrs browns boys that greatly offends me!

AnAlpacaForChristmasPleaseSanta · 08/02/2026 16:31

mumofoneAloneandwell · 08/02/2026 16:07

I don’t see why they don’t cancel mrs browns boys and have a show fronted by a woman 🤷‍♀️

I would go so far to say why can they not cancel it and just broadcast a wall of drying paint. I'd prefer to watch it.

I am not one of those people who wants programs cancelled just because I don't watch or enjoy them, but MBB is the exception!

Can't get a head of steam up about this though, so fully agree with @SlightlyUnexpected post at 15:37.

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SpringTimeIsRingTime · 08/02/2026 16:29

5foot5 · 08/02/2026 16:01

And what about the fact that the "principal boy" i.e. male, romantic lead, is always played by a woman? Thoughts?

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The principal boy was played by a woman for the titillation of Victorian men at a time when women had to cover every part of their body except their face.

"Allowing" a slim young good-looking woman to prance around the stage in a pair of tights with a tunic barely covering her backside must have been quite the pleasure ride for the male half of the audience. It was a gimmick to get bums on seats, that's all and for all the wrong reasons.

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50Balesofgrey · 08/02/2026 16:19

AndrewPreview · 08/02/2026 15:33

Give over, it's panto.

And not all panto dames are gay men.

Oh yes they are